Mike Mussina

[rocket]

Well how many of you Mosse bashers have been converted after his fine performance yesterday. Just another quality start going eight innings allowing only two runs on two hots. I know its really to much for me to believe that the bashers have changed because in the fifth inning they were probably saying see he's not even as good as David Wells because he lost his no-hitter and perfect game on one pitch and then cost us the game when Chavez got a cheap homerun. Well I quess somethings never change and either will the bashing so us Moose fans will have to pick up the slack.

[MereChica02]

Rocket, I have been a Moose fan since the day he got to the Yankees. I thought he was a good pickup then, and I still feel that way today. His 11-10 record may not prove it, but I think he has done a fine job for us this year. He usually keeps the Yankees in the game and usually gives them a chance to win, even if the offense doesn't come through. In my mind, Mike has already proven to be a solid Yankee, but here's to him earning his pinstripes in October. Then he, like Roger a few years ago, can find out what it really feels like to be a Yankee.
*Mere*

[amorfati1918]

i still can't believe he pitched a "perfect" game except for those two hrs
i mean tejada and chavez are pretty good hitters but......
aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[cb2u]

The wasted performances by Mussina are....MADDENING! How frustrating.
How much more can you ask of a pitcher than what Mussina gave yesterday; expecting a shutout each time out is a little unreasonable.....

[CarolR]

I had posted a thread to just this tune before the game started. He had to show what he could do against a team as hot as the A's. He certainly stopped the bleeding.

I don't care that we lost. I was thrilled that Mike was able to do what he can do in games such as yesterday. It may not be a game in the win column, but it showed when pitching has to count for everything, he will shine.

Our rotation in the playoffs if ElDuque is back will be awesome. Rocket, Pettitte, Moose, and Elduque, Dozzie, Stanton, and of course Mo.

The key of course, The Big IF

[yankeeholic]

Originally posted by CarolR
I had posted a thread to just this tune before the game started. He had to show what he could do against a team as hot as the A's. He certainly stopped the bleeding.

I don't care that we lost. I was thrilled that Mike was able to do what he can do in games such as yesterday. It may not be a game in the win column, but it showed when pitching has to count for everything, he will shine.

Our rotation in the playoffs if ElDuque is back will be awesome. Rocket, Pettitte, Moose, and Elduque, Dozzie, Stanton, and of course Mo.

The key of course, The Big IF

This is very true Carol and we know sooner or later the Yanks are gonna score runs for him down the stretch and into the post season so even though they lost ( to a very HOT A' s team) he did, for the most part shut their offense down!

[Shel]

Originally posted by CarolR
I don't care that we lost. I was thrilled that Mike was able to do what he can do in games such as yesterday. It may not be a game in the win column, but it showed when pitching has to count for everything, he will shine.

Ditto, Carol! Although I can't honestly say I don't care about the loss. After all, Boston won..... But it was great to see that kind of performance from Mike. It's just a damn shame that his efforts were wasted (again).

[CaptainCargo]

I really feel for Moose. He's pitched better than the record shows. But thats baseball. People sometimes just look at W's and L's. Its a what have you done for me lately mentality.


Moose will still be one of the three starters in the play-offs. :

Casey

[Fan-In-Florida]

I'm not a Mussina "bashers," but I don't have the confidence in him that most of you do. His ERA of 3.83 (higher than Andy and Roger) does not mean that he is a better pitcher that his record shows. He's fortunate to have a winning record with that ERA, and no one in the AL, either 5 pts above or below him does, except Mendosa.

[moosehatmaker]

Yesterday was a typical moose outing. I wish he could find his consistency though. Sometimes I wonder if he performs better under pressure in general, like when he was the ace in Baltimore. Although Baltimore didn't give him run support either. I hope he has a repeat performance in October like he had in Baltimore a few years ago.

PS-How do I get one of those little picture things under my name?

[PinstripePride]

Originally posted by moosehatmaker
Yesterday was a typical moose outing. I wish he could find his consistency though. Sometimes I wonder if he performs better under pressure in general, like when he was the ace in Baltimore. Although Baltimore didn't give him run support either. I hope he has a repeat performance in October like he had in Baltimore a few years ago.

PS-How do I get one of those little picture things under my name?

Gotta have at least 750 posts to get one...

Hint: go to game threads...

[moosehatmaker]

Gotta have at least 750 posts to get one...


Dang! That;s a lot of posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[KDream]

Originally posted by Fan-In-Florida
I'm not a Mussina "bashers," but I don't have the confidence in him that most of you do. His ERA of 3.83 (higher than Andy and Roger) does not mean that he is a better pitcher that his record shows. He's fortunate to have a winning record with that ERA, and no one in the AL, either 5 pts above or below him does, except Mendosa.

Are you sure about the info you have? Or is there any constraint / presumption placed on your statement? I am confused.

According to ESPN, here is Mussina compared to some other starting pitchers with higher ERAs and winning records:
1. Mike Mussina (NYY) 3.83 ERA, 11-10, .524 Win Pct;
2. Jamie Moyer (SEA) 3.96 ERA, 13-5, .722 Win Pct;
3. Hideo Nomo (BOS) 4.09 ERA, 11-5, .687 Win Pct;
4. Brad Radke (MIN) 4.11 ERA, 10-8, .556 Win Pct;
5. Bartolo Colon (CLE) 4.18 ERA, 10-8, .556 Win Pct;
6. Paul Abbott (SEA) 4.21 ERA, 12-2, .857 Win Pct;
7. Ramon Ortiz (ANA) 4.27 ERA, 10-7, .588 Win Pct;
8. Eric Milton (MIN) 4.28 ERA, 11-4, .733 Win Pct;
9. Barry Zito (OAK) 4.29 ERA, 8-7, .533 Win Pct;
10.Steve Sparks (DET) 4.34 ERA, 8-7, .533 Win Pct;
11.CC Sabathia (CLE) 4.42 ERA, 12-4, .750 Win Pct;
12.Scott Schoeneweis (ANA) 4.74 ERA, 9-8, .529 Win Pct;
13.Dave Burba (CLE) 6.50 ERA, 9-8, .529 Win Pct.

As of today, 40 pitchers in AL are qualified for ERA title. 25 of them (62.5%) have winning records (above .500 win pct). With this info in mind, here comes the fun part:
Among these 40 ERA-title candidates, Mussina's ERA ranked 13th.
(1) How many of those 12 pitchers with lower ERA has better winning %, exactly 12! (2) Now, how many pitchers have both a winning record and an ERA higher than Mussina's? 12 again! How many of those "worse" 12 starters have a lower winning %? ZERO!! To summarize it, if you connect ERA with win % of those 25 winning starters, Mussina is right there at the exactly valley/bottom: in-the-middle ERA and lowest win %. It turns out that if a pitcher has a better ERA than Mussina, he is going to win more of his decisions than Mussina wins his, for sure; even if he has a worse ERA (most of them DO), he has a nearly 50% chance to win more of his decisions than Mussina does.
Among all 40 ERA-title qualifiers, Mussina have the Sixth worst run support. Of those five POORER starters, only Tim Wakefield has a winning record (albeit better win %, even fewer wins with an 8-7 record). As a group, these five unlucky starters have an ERA of 4.47, 31-47 record (16 games under .500) and .397 win % -- yes, they collectively win less than 40% of their decisions. See, that group has a run support only about a quarter run per game lower, while having given the team a much worse chance to win. I don't think it's fair to over-complain Mussina's performance.
By the way, among those 12 pitchers with worse ERA and better win %, three of them have more WINs. Who are they playing for? No surprise, Mariners (Moyer and Abbott) and Indians (Sabathia)!

One step further, if you look at WHIPs (walks and hits - baserunners - allowed per inning) of those 40 starters, you have to sympathize with Mussina. He has the FOURTH BEST WHIP (1.17). It's even a strong indicator (even though just an indicator) that he may have pitched mucher better than his record. By the way, Mark Buehrle (.98) leads AL in WHIP, as well as ERA (2.90). Who leads the majors in both WHIP and ERA before his injury? That guy named Pedro. What this number means is, by allowing fewer hits and walks, the pitcher gives his team and himself a better chance to win. However, it's sadly not been the case for Mussina and Yankees. I just realized something by looking at this WHIP number. Mulder and Hudson of A's rank 2nd and 3rd, while Lidle (who just baffled Yankees on Friday) ties with Mussina at 4th. Pettitte ranks 10th and Rocket 11th.

I'm not saying Mussina has pitched lights out. But when you evaluate a pitcher, W-L doesn't show you everything. In quite a portion of games that he pitched, he did bear down with 7 or 8 innings allowing only 3 runs, 2 runs, 1 run or NO run, and did not get the wins. Honestly, I didn't expect Mussina to implode in the AWFUL way he did in several outings, which hurts his ERA and digs a big hole for the team. That being said, I think, overall, Mussina definitely has pitched better than his record, and deserves a better W-L record. I'm very glad that he is a Yankee.

[clacson]

KDream,

CLAP CLAP CLAP!!!

You just put down this fool much better than I did in the "What will it take to get Moose a Win" Poll thread.

Excellent job!!!!

[KDream]

Originally posted by clacson
KDream,

CLAP CLAP CLAP!!!

You just put down this fool much better than I did in the "What will it take to get Moose a Win" Poll thread.

Excellent job!!!!

Let's not use the word "fool". That's not the purpose of my post and I don't wanna be hated.
Trust me, when Mussina got bombed by Marlins, Rangers and his old team, I was as frustrated and pissed as the next guy. I just don't want to be unfair when I say something about a quiet and important member of my beloved Yankees.

[clacson]

This is true.

I shouldn't use the word fool.

It's uncalled for.

Sorry Florida Yankee fan.

But next time, check the stats again OK?

[YankeePride1967]

Originally posted by rocket
Well how many of you Mosse bashers have been converted after his fine performance yesterday. Just another quality start going eight innings allowing only two runs on two hots. I know its really to much for me to believe that the bashers have changed because in the fifth inning they were probably saying see he's not even as good as David Wells because he lost his no-hitter and perfect game on one pitch and then cost us the game when Chavez got a cheap homerun. Well I quess somethings never change and either will the bashing so us Moose fans will have to pick up the slack.

If people kept in mind how he's pitched all year. Yes he's had 2-3 stinkers, but other than those not named Rocket, everyone has. People see this "savior" coming in from Baltimore with the rich contract and consider anything less than 25-3 with a 1.50 ERA a disappointment. He has pitched well enough to be 14-5. Remember, his ERA is right there with Clemens!

[Spencer's_Girl]

KDream, that post was amazing.

Where do you even find stats like that?

[KDream]

Originally posted by Spencer's_Girl
Where do you even find stats like that?

Spencer's Girl, those stats are readily available at ESPN.com.

[bagger015]

I too feel bad for But he will win big time for us eventually. So far just wrong place wrong time. I would not want to have to hit against him.