Offseason "The Sky is Falling" Thread

[Yankees1962]

Does anyone get the sense that the Yankees are, to an extent, 'rebuilding'? I hate to even use that term because they should be in the playoff hunt again next year.

But I almost get the sense that what we see is what we get. I don't see many more major moves, simply because I don't see a lot out there. You almost get the sense that the front office is going to tweak this team a little bit, see if this current cast of players can win it all, and if not, they will just look ahead to a future of A-Rod, Cano, Wang and others while spending a bit more next offseason when a contract like Mussina is finished.

Not necessarily saying that is a bad thing either, but just a thought.

The Yankees aren't rebuilding, but they clearly didn't like the choices this off-season. They decided to bide their time, acquire some less expensive, but still effective players and then wait for better players to become available to them. At the same time, let their own best prospects advance further along in their system and with good results on the field they improve their value to the Yankees and whatever trading partners the Yankees may have in the future.

Folks, the Yankees finally have a structured gameplan, one in which they're executing without acting like they're at K-Mart for a Blue Light Sale.

[Yankees1962]

This article might interest those that think Cashman is sitting on his hands and not doing anything. Cashman is right about the market being inflated in regard to the asking price for certain players.

To the chagrin of general manager Pat Gillick, who is balking at the $7 million-and-up asking price for what he considers staunch mediocrity, the current free-agent market for starters doesn't suit the Phillies' taste - not for Matt Morris or for any other midlevel name that has been floated.

Gillick has discovered that no team is willing to surrender the top-flight starter the Phillies wanted for All-Star rightfielder Bobby Abreu. Also, no team values part-time starter Jason Michaels as much as the Phillies; contrary to two other reports, it is believed it was Michaels, not Abreu, whom the Phillies were discussing with the Dodgers in exchange for starters Derek Lowe or Brad Penny. Finally, any interest from clubs in leftfielder Pat Burrell has been tepid, at best.

"We've got one or two [trade] situations where we could possibly do something," Gillick said yesterday afternoon. "Those two situations don't look as good as they did 2 or 3 days ago."

http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/sports/13356049.htm

[rajah]

Joke all you want guys, but beyond Farnsworth, the Yankees are yet to address any of their many holes, while teams like the Sox and Jays are getting creative with ways to help their teams this year and following years, for better or for worse. The Yanks on the other hand, let the winter meetings go by with nothing more to say than that they will continue to talk with Bernie Williams.

As a fan I have to question if the organization really had a plan going into this offseason, or if they were just going to see what happens.

Now I am not saying the sky is falling, but it would be nice to see some sign of a plan from the Yankees, a team that I invest my time and money to support.

The Jays are getting creative? You call those inflated contracts to Ryan and Burnett creative? They are spending money to get their payroll up to a level that will still be less than one half of the Yankees. The Y's already are committed.

The Red Sox also have more payroll flexibility, but the trade for Beckett was possible because their minor league system is much stronger at the moajor league ready level than the y's because of a series of terrible Yankee drafts.
Cashman really does not have the money or the players to be too creative.

The Y's have a plan. It is just not the plan you want, which apparently is to keep the payroll up with the usual flashy off season signings, regardless of what you might say to deny this.

[YankeePride1967]

I have a serious question Besides a blockbuster trade, which we don't have the chips for, what the hell could he be doing that needs to develop this slowly and this secretly?

What GM tells the media/fans the moves they are making? Did Boston call up the Globe before landing Beckett and say "I just want to inform the fans so they don't lose sleep we are in the process of trading for Josh Beckett"?

As for why we haven't made moves, you do realize that by signing players before yesterday, we automatically lose draft picks to the teams the players we sign played on in 2005. THat would be dumb just to appease fans.

[ReggieBar]

The sky fell last off season when the Yanks signed Pavano, Wright, Womack and traded for Randy.

[YankeePride1967]

You have a legitimate concern and it isn't any more wrong or right than somebody actually believing that there's this master plan and that everything will be alright.

My guess is that there is no concrete plan and that the Yanks are just waiting to see what shakes out. Maybe they'll get lucky. Maybe not. Farnworth as a stepping stone to bigger and better things in the works is OK. Farnsworth's signing alone is not O.K.

I'm assuming that in the middle of your anti-Cashman campaign that you are aware that if we signed players prior to yesterday we automatically lose a draft pick (depending on the classification of the player) as it is before the salary arbitration deadline didn't you? Or is it that important that us fans know NOW exactly what our 2006 team will be that who needs prospects for the minors, we can just continue our 2000's approach of overpaying for average talent.

[ojo]

i think by hanging on to wang, cano, duncan, hughes and phillips the yankees have shown a TON of creativity.

though i would have traded wang by now. he's at what will probably be his career-high in value NOW and should have been dealt for a good CF. time will tell though.

[Yanks Lifer]

This article might interest those that think Cashman is sitting on his hands and not doing anything. Cashman is right about the market being inflated in regard to the asking price for certain players.

http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/sports/13356049.htm

Gillick is fantasizing about his players as much as Boras is about his clients if he thinks Jason Michaels is worth Lowe or Penny! I'm not saying either Lowe or Penny are Cy Young, but they're closer to Cy Young than Michaels is to Joe DiMaggio. Come on!!!

[Dooley Womack]

I'm assuming that in the middle of your anti-Cashman campaign that you are aware that if we signed players prior to yesterday we automatically lose a draft pick (depending on the classification of the player) as it is before the salary arbitration deadline didn't you? Or is it that important that us fans know NOW exactly what our 2006 team will be that who needs prospects for the minors, we can just continue our 2000's approach of overpaying for average talent.

So, as Cashman's spokesman, are you telling us that THIS was Cashman's plan all along and why no trades or signings (other than Farnsworth) were made to date, and that it's only a ploy saying he is happy with Giambi and Phillips at 1B, unlike the winter of 2003 when he said he was happy with the Yanks 2004 pitching (starting and relief) and actually meant it?

And by the way, just what free agents are left to play center and 1B, now that we won't lose a draft pick? Unless of course, it's Giambi and Phillips at 1B.

Our 2000's "approach" got us into the playoffs every single year, in case you forget. Who wins in the post season is a crapshoot. And quite honestly, I don't care if the payroll is $180M or $220M. For the Yanks to make it every year they had to spend it more wisely than Monday morn QB's give them credit for, unless you include the $16M and ridiculous perks that Kevin Brown got, and we all know who was wise enough to trade for him and take on the worst salary known to mankind and get the very least for it.

[YankeePride1967]

This article might interest those that think Cashman is sitting on his hands and not doing anything. Cashman is right about the market being inflated in regard to the asking price for certain players.

http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/sports/13356049.htm

exactly, but if GS were involved, he would waive his magic wand and make the player come here

Patience needs to return to our approach. We tried the rushing out there to make moves last year and got Wright and Pavano before anyone else could. I guess to some a bad move is better than no move.

[ojo]

So, as Cashman's spokesman, are you telling us that THIS was Cashman's plan all along and why no trades or signings (other than Farnsworth) were made to date, and that it's only a ploy saying he is happy with Giambi and Phillips at 1B, unlike the winter of 2003 when he said he was happy with the Yanks 2004 pitching (starting and relief) and actually meant it?

And by the way, just what free agents are left to play center and 1B, now that we won't lose a draft pick? Unless of course, it's Giambi and Phillips at 1B.

Our 2000's "approach" got us into the playoffs every single year, in case you forget. Who wins in the post season is a crapshoot. And quite honestly, I don't care if the payroll is $180M or $220M. For the Yanks to make it every year they had to spend it more wisely than Monday morn QB's give them credit for, unless you include the $16M and ridiculous perks that Kevin Brown got, and we all know who was wise enough to trade for him.

i think giambi/phillips at 1b are some of the least of the yankees' concerns. let the kid play. if giambi gets hurt go find a viable stop-gap to back up phillips. but the kid's earned a shot.

[YankeePride1967]

So, as Cashman's spokesman, are you telling us that THIS was Cashman's plan all along and why no trades or signings (other than Farnsworth) were made to date, and that it's only a ploy saying he is happy with Giambi and Phillips at 1B, unlike the winter of 2003 when he said he was happy with the Yanks 2004 pitching (starting and relief) and actually meant it?

And by the way, just what free agents are left to play center and 1B, now that we won't lose a draft pick? Unless of course, it's Giambi and Phillips at 1B.

Our 2000's "approach" got us into the playoffs every single year, in case you forget. Who wins in the post season is a crapshoot. And quite honestly, I don't care if the payroll is $180M or $220M. For the Yanks to make it every year they had to spend it more wisely than Monday morn QB's give them credit for, unless you include the $16M and ridiculous perks that Kevin Brown got, and we all know who was wise enough to trade for him.

I'm saying that he is not going to tell us his exact plans. No smart GM would. OUr 90's approach (more like we are doing now) got us 4 World Series rings! I do care what the payroll is when the payroll limits us in the moves we can make and that's where we are now. How about the pen? If we had gone out there and gotten another set up man like some are saying it would have cost us a pick but hey, just so we know exactly what the plan is, that's all that matters.

[YankeePride1967]

i think giambi/phillips at 1b are some of the least of the yankees' concerns. let the kid play. if giambi gets hurt go find a viable stop-gap to back up phillips. but the kid's earned a shot.

I also have confidence that if Phillips is indeed our 1B (I dont think he is) that he can replicate the production Tino gave us with the exception of that 10 day stretch in May. If we take a few steps back and look rationally, on 12/8/05, we are not that dissimiliar to the team we ended the season on. You'd think by some reactions that we need to totally remake the team.

[Dooley Womack]

I'm saying that he is not going to tell us his exact plans. No smart GM would. OUr 90's approach (more like we are doing now) got us 4 World Series rings! I do care what the payroll is when the payroll limits us in the moves we can make and that's where we are now. How about the pen? If we had gone out there and gotten another set up man like some are saying it would have cost us a pick but hey, just so we know exactly what the plan is, that's all that matters.

GR there is no exact formula that gets you 4 rings. No team will ever duplicate the players and mix the Yanks had from their farm and FA signings. Mo's, Jeter's, Bernie's and Pettittes aren't just waiting around for the Yanks to draft them one day.

That's not to say to ignore youth, but when the plan is to get young on one hand YET cream his pants over a declining 35 year old player who never wanted to come to NY, to play center, when he's not even a CF, AND for 3 years till he's 38, on the other hand, then something is terribly wrong or suspicious in Yankeeland.

Funny how well this went over with some Cashman fans who are preaching that his plan is youth and cutting payroll.

[YankeePride1967]

GR there is no exact formula that gets you 4 rings. No team will ever duplicate the players and mix the Yanks had from their farm and FA signings. Mo's, Jeter's, Bernie's and Pettittes aren't just waiting around for the Yanks to draft them one day.

That's not to say to ignore youth, but when the plan is to get young on one hand YET cream his pants over a declining 35 year old player who never wanted to come to NY, to play center, when he's not even a CF, AND for 3 years till he's 38, on the other hand, then something is terribly wrong or suspicious in Yankeeland.

You also don't get the opportunities to develop the Jeter's the Mo's, the Pettittes when you give the picks away because we have to sign Jaret Wright because we have to make a move fast.

As for Giles, if he came here Giles would have been in RF and Sheffield as the DH.

[ojo]

I also have confidence that if Phillips is indeed our 1B (I dont think he is) that he can replicate the production Tino gave us with the exception of that 10 day stretch in May. If we take a few steps back and look rationally, on 12/8/05, we are not that dissimiliar to the team we ended the season on. You'd think by some reactions that we need to totally remake the team.

i know he's no spring chicken here but he demonstrated power and the ability to hit for average/get on base at AAA. let's see what he can do in a couple hundred AB. this is precisely how you discover hidden gems/late bloomers.

[Dooley Womack]

You also don't get the opportunities to develop the Jeter's the Mo's, the Pettittes when you give the picks away because we have to sign Jaret Wright because we have to make a move fast.

As for Giles, if he came here Giles would have been in RF and Sheffield as the DH.

Wherever Giles played he was offered a ridiculous contract to play till he's 38. So we pick and choose the youth and wise-spending according to Cashman's so-called plan? So if Cashman wants him, even if it's against the plan everyone is excited about, it's OK?

[dabomb2045]

I also have confidence that if Phillips is indeed our 1B (I dont think he is) that he can replicate the production Tino gave us with the exception of that 10 day stretch in May. If we take a few steps back and look rationally, on 12/8/05, we are not that dissimiliar to the team we ended the season on. You'd think by some reactions that we need to totally remake the team.

well...seeing as how we didnt win a title last year...that means the team does have problems that need to be fixed. If the philosophy is to "stand pat" because the options on the market arent good ones, and just go into 2006 as the same team as 2005...then fine. Just dont expect a ring next year.

[Dooley Womack]

Gotta run to the office, so if I don't answer I'm not ignoring you GR. You're STILL one of my favorite people here and don't want you to think a difference in opinion changes that.

[WebsterMulligan]

GR there is no exact formula that gets you 4 rings. No team will ever duplicate the players and mix the Yanks had from their farm and FA signings. Mo's, Jeter's, Bernie's and Pettittes aren't just waiting around for the Yanks to draft them one day.

There is no exact formula, but I will gladly take the pre-1996 approach as opposed to the way the Yanks handled things post-2000.

As Yankee fans, we may have to endure a lean year or two, in order to allow some prospects in the minors to develop. I'm willing to wait it out.

[dabomb2045]

i know he's no spring chicken here but he demonstrated power and the ability to hit for average/get on base at AAA. let's see what he can do in a couple hundred AB. this is precisely how you discover hidden gems/late bloomers.

Phillips cant hit a breaking ball, he looks like Cerrano in Major League flailing away cluelessly at them. There is a reason why he has been stuck at AAA for so long. You can be a good hitter at AAA without having to figure out off-speed pitches. You cannot be a good hitter on the major league level and not be able to handle breaking balls.

[ojo]

Phillips cant hit a breaking ball, he looks like Cerrano in Major League flailing away cluelessly at them. There is a reason why he has been stuck at AAA for so long. You can be a good hitter at AAA without having to figure out off-speed pitches. You cannot be a good hitter on the major league level and not be able to handle breaking balls.

and he's obviously shown *some* ability to learn hence his still being in the system/getting a shot.

we'll see what happens.

[ring403]

Phillips cant hit a breaking ball, he looks like Cerrano in Major League flailing away cluelessly at them. There is a reason why he has been stuck at AAA for so long. You can be a good hitter at AAA without having to figure out off-speed pitches. You cannot be a good hitter on the major league level and not be able to handle breaking balls.

Are you basing your opinion on his 40 big league AB's last season, or do you have knowledge of his minor league scouting reports?

[effdamets]

well...seeing as how we didnt win a title last year...that means the team does have problems that need to be fixed. If the philosophy is to "stand pat" because the options on the market arent good ones, and just go into 2006 as the same team as 2005...then fine. Just dont expect a ring next year.

I disagree with this because I think the teams pitching will be much, much better than last year. Let's not forget, after the abismal 11-19 start last season, the Yankees posted the BEST record in the majors. That's not too shabby. With a (NY) year under Johnson's belt, the emergence of Chacon and Wang, the starting rotation has to be better. Also, I can't imagine that 4 of our 5 starters will go out with injuries this year.

I think we can expect each offensive player to have the same season, because which Yankee played way beyond his capabilities last season? Cano? Maybe. But realistically, I think the kid will be even better this season, especially after the all-star break. And you can expect for Sheffield to have a wonderful season as this is his walk year, no? (he has an uncanny history of having great numbers in his walk year)

The team, right now, will be better defensively (see center field), just as good offensively, and the starting pitching will be better because you have to expect better health. This in turn, makes the bull pen more rested and more effective later in the season, and into the playoffs.

Do I "expect" a championship? You can't. Not in this fouled-up Selig system. With so many teams in the mix for the World Series title, anything can happen, like a dropped third strike or something. But, you can expect to compete for championships, which is not out of the question for this present Yankees team.

[dabomb2045]

Are you basing your opinion on his 40 big league AB's, or do you have knowledge of his minor league scouting reports?

I'm judging this on the fact that he has been stuck at the same level for awhile now. This happens alot....the classic AAAA player. AAA pitchers make alot more mistakes...then dont have the full command of breaking balls and they dont fully understand how to attack the opposing hitters weakness. You can be clueless against offspeed pitches, yet still hit well in AAA. Judging by what I saw from him, he doesnt know how to hit an off-speed pitch. And honestly it doesnt surprise me, considering his age and how he has been stuck in AAA. You put the two together and it makes sense as to why he puts up big numbers in AAA, yet he doesnt get a chance or why teams arent clamoring to trade for him. Andy Phillips has zero trade value....why?? Because the scouts see his weakness and know he wont be very successful on the big league level.