Nice work by Soriano and Johnson

[TheBamTino24]

Nick Johnson, 26 years old (Vasquez Deal):
65G, 228AB, .325, 8HR, 39RBI, 46SO, 40BB, 38R, .442OB%, 3/9SB

Alfonso Soriano, 29 years old (A-Rod Deal)
60G, 248AB, .294, 18HR, 44RBI, 48SO, 18BB, 51R, .332OB%, 8/8SB

Personally, I was one of those people who thought that these two players should have been "untouchables." I wanted Soriano to be the successor to Bernie Williams in CF.

In any event, glad to see these two are reaching their potential. Seems they both could've solved huge needs for the Yankees moving forward - 1B and OF - and youth! Both had that Yankee Pedigree and both produced in the playoffs despite how people wanted to run Soriano out of town after 2003.

[Bub]

We should not have moved Nick Johnson, despite the continuing injuries. At the time, it seemed like a good gamble, especially if Vasquez proved to be a great pitcher. As for Soriano, I still think he's useless in the postseason because great pitchers own him and he can't lay off bad pitches.

[JDPNYY]

Are they Yankees again?

Did I miss something?

[ojo]

nick johnson is the real painful to see go.

soriano is great to have on a fantasy team, but any competent pitcher can own him. not so with nick the stick.

[chanman7483]

The Former Yankee Performance thread :

http://forums.nyyfans.com/showthread.php?t=81195

[Little Big Sheff]

In case you haven't noticed, the guy we traded Soriano for is posting the following numbers :

.325 / .433 / .616 / 1.049, with 19 HR and 56 RBI's.

He leads the league in HR's, and RBI's, and is top three in OBP, SLG and OPS. And Texas is paying a good chunk of his salary.

So, what was your point about that deal again?

[sandman84]

Soriano never wanted to play CF, he hated that idea. As it was he already had been moved from SS. I loved Sori, but he was not going to be our next CFer.

[Hemingway]

Soriano's OBP is 22nd among major league SECOND BASEMEN. His offensive value is overrated thanks to his huuuge slugging percentage. In Texas, they need more player like A-Rod than they do players like Soriano, one run doesn't mean nearly as much down there.

If you're trying to break team homerun marks, by all means, play Soriano at 2nd, if you're trying to win games, there are probably ten better choices making half the dough Soriano is.

[DontHateOnNumber2]

Johnson is really blowing up out there in Washington and Soriano is hitting big although it's in Arlington. Soriano sounded good in CF years ago but the problem was he didn't want to switch his position. Why do you think he's playing second for Texas?

[rightfielder21]

Johnson is the one they should have never let get away...

[sandman84]

Nobody was saying we should have kept Johnson when Javy was nasty last years first half. The guy was laways hurt and didnt really do anything while here that would have made anyone say, he should never be touched. Hes playing good that he finally healthy, but how long is that going to last?

[Jasbro]

The problem with Nick is that he is a walking broken bone. He is a really nice player, but he needs to be more than a 100 - 120 game player.

[wileedog]

I would love to have Johnson back, I really would.

But that trade was the right deal at the right time. Just didn't work out for whatever reasons.

Sori I don't miss. The fact that we got one of the best hitters in baseball out of the deal is just gravy.

[Bub]

The problem with Nick is that he is a walking broken bone. He is a really nice player, but he needs to be more than a 100 - 120 game player.

He could be that this year. Mattingly predicted that he'd someday win a batting title. That could be this year too.

[yanks710]

We all knew these guy were talented and I'm happy for them

[TheBamTino24]

Yes we got one of the best RH hitters ever in Rodriguez. Was it really that great of an improvement? Soriano was the 2B for two American League Pennant teams (2001 & 2003). Lets remember his 8th inning HR of Curt Schilling would have given us the World Series in 2001.

I still find it bizzare how every team GREATLY improves the year after dumping Alex Rodriguez (Seattle, 2001 and Texas, 2004).

[wileedog]

Yes we got one of the best RH hitters ever in Rodriguez. Was it really that great of an improvement? Soriano was the 2B for two American League Pennant teams (2001 & 2003). Lets remember his 8th inning HR of Curt Schilling would have given us the World Series in 2001.

Lets not forget who holds the major league record for strikeouts in one post-season either.

I still find it bizzare how every team GREATLY improves the year after dumping Alex Rodriguez (Seattle, 2001 and Texas, 2004).

Gee, you're right.

We should cut the one of the top hitters in the game and most-likely first ballot HOFer immediately based upon this mountain of evidence.

[TheBamTino24]

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Don't overreact. I never said cut him or that I was displeased with Rodriguez. Fact of the matter, statistically, it is not that great of a difference. Record wise, we're struggling.

Even you would have to agree it is an oddity that the teams improved while giving away baseball's best player. Not an exact science, just really weird. Texas went from 71-91 to 89-73 and Seattle went from 91-71 to 116-46.

That's +16 and +15 after parting ways with baseball's best player.

Conversely, the Rangers were also 71-91 in 2000 and 73-89 in 2002 (A-Rod's first year). The Yankees were 101-61 in 2003 and the same 101-61 in 2004 (A-Rod's first year).

So that's +2 and 0 when acquiring baseball's best player.

Very, very strange, no?

[GraniteYankee]

Nick Johnson, 26 years old (Vasquez Deal):
65G, 228AB, .325, 8HR, 39RBI, 46SO, 40BB, 38R, .442OB%, 3/9SB

Alfonso Soriano, 29 years old (A-Rod Deal)
60G, 248AB, .294, 18HR, 44RBI, 48SO, 18BB, 51R, .332OB%, 8/8SB

Personally, I was one of those people who thought that these two players should have been "untouchables." I wanted Soriano to be the successor to Bernie Williams in CF.

In any event, glad to see these two are reaching their potential. Seems they both could've solved huge needs for the Yankees moving forward - 1B and OF - and youth! Both had that Yankee Pedigree and both produced in the playoffs despite how people wanted to run Soriano out of town after 2003.

Sorry, can't agree with you here. We received arguably the best player in baseball with the Soriano trade, in addition, the 2003 playoffs watching him SO a zillion times was enough for me. Johnson was injury prone at the time of the trade for Vaz and we had, what we thought at the time anyway, was a highly productive 1b in Giambi - can't kill the FO on these moves.

[Jersey Yankee]

I still find it bizzare how every team GREATLY improves the year after dumping Alex Rodriguez (Seattle, 2001 and Texas, 2004).

Neither has ever been to thw WS, so how much improvement was that?

Seattle had Ichiro in 2001, a year in which A-Rod didn't play.

The Yanks won the AL East and went to the ALCS with Alex Rodriguez. The only ALCS either team has been to after Alex left was Seattle's 2001 ALCS, in which they got trumped 4-1.

Yeah, big improvement.

I'd like to see Alex help us get to the WS. That way, if someone points out that no prior team Alex has left had ever been to the WS, then people can always point out that no team he's left has been to the WS.

[Jasbro]

Yes we got one of the best RH hitters ever in Rodriguez. Was it really that great of an improvement? Soriano was the 2B for two American League Pennant teams (2001 & 2003). Lets remember his 8th inning HR of Curt Schilling would have given us the World Series in 2001.

I still find it bizzare how every team GREATLY improves the year after dumping Alex Rodriguez (Seattle, 2001 and Texas, 2004).

Yes, it IS that great of an improvement.

And regarding your last remark, was shedding ARod the ONLY move those teams made those years? Or were there other moves made in addition that contributed to their resurgence?

Further, just because a team gets better after a player leaves that team does not mean that the team got better BECAUSE the player left that team. Basic logic, my friend.

I had breakfast this morning -- then it rained. But my having breakfast this morning did not cause it to rain. Same thing.

[Hitman23]

I'd still trade A-Rod for Soriano. I liked Sori, alot. but you have to make that trade. It's A-Rod.

Johnson was painfull to see go but we needed pitching and Jason was supposed to be our guy. No one knew we'd be here with the 1st base problems. It's easy to look back now and say "I told you so", but at the time the decision was potentially the better one.

That being said, I am still a fan of both, I stil follow both, and I'm happy they are doing well.

[Dooley Womack]

Re NJ. Bad trade-actually an awful trade- to get a pitcher who was totally ineffective, but oh well, we can't keep looking back. At the time I thought it was a decent trade, though I was always suspicious of getting a NL pitcher, especially one who pitched in the obscurity of Montreal.

NJ and Rivera (in left) sure would look good in pinstipes now.

A-Rod for Sori is a no-brainer.

[wileedog]

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Don't overreact. I never said cut him or that I was displeased with Rodriguez. Fact of the matter, statistically, it is not that great of a difference. Record wise, we're struggling.

Even you would have to agree it is an oddity that the teams improved while giving away baseball's best player. Not an exact science, just really weird. Texas went from 71-91 to 89-73 and Seattle went from 91-71 to 116-46.

That's +16 and +15 after parting ways with baseball's best player.

Conversely, the Rangers were also 71-91 in 2000 and 73-89 in 2002 (A-Rod's first year). The Yankees were 101-61 in 2003 and the same 101-61 in 2004 (A-Rod's first year).

So that's +2 and 0 when acquiring baseball's best player.

Very, very strange, no?

Seattles Team ERA in 2000 was 4.50. It was 3.54 in 2001.

Texas team ERA went from 5.67 to 4.53 from 2003 to 2004.

Good thing A-Rod wasn't there to f*ck up the pitching staffs anymore.

[CaptainThurman]

For those who say Soriano is owned by good pitchers in the post season, I seem to recall that he homered off Schilling to put the Yankees in position to win the 2001 Series....

I would love to root for the following lineup, which is home grown, younger and more athletic as the one we currently watch, and far less expensive...

C - Posada (and Duncan)
1B - Johnson
2B - Soriano (and Cano)
SS - Jeter (and Guzman)
3B - Lowell
LF - Matsui (or Soriano)
CF - Wily Mo Pena
RF - Juan Rivera
DH - Bernie

SP - Halsey, Wang and Lilly at the back end, at least
RP - Rivera teaching Brazoban how to close