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  1. #1

    Manny might return this Weekend!

    Looks like the return of one of the most feared hitters in all of baseball could come as early as this weekend. It is a shame he doesn't double as a releif pitcher. Arrojo was fantastic vs. the Rockies. The combination of relief pitching and home games are killing this team. Dustin Hermenson better get health quick!

    http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/16...weekendP.shtml

  2. #2
    Hank is my Hero!! yankeegeek's Avatar
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    OK, so Manny returns and Pedros arm falls off!! That works!

  3. #3
    I guess Pedro talks about his arm, kind of like Wells talks about his back problems. You make it sound like he pitched bad vs. the D-Backs on Saturday. The approach to handling Pedro is much different than in past years. They are pacing him in every start, he has been pretty darn good so far this year. Plus I think the rise in D. Lowe's game is taking a lot of presure off of Pedro. If Arrojo keeps throwing the way he has (0 ER in his last 18 innings) the pressure is reduced even more.

    Again, The Yankee (at last) have some injury problems themselves.

  4. #4
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    Originally posted by dirtdog7

    Again, The Yankee (at last) have some injury problems themselves.
    At last?????????? It seems to me that the Yankees have done nothing but deal with injuries since the season started.

  5. #5
    Originally posted by 2JAY
    At last?????????? It seems to me that the Yankees have done nothing but deal with injuries since the season started.
    How bout the last 3 years? Forgive me, I missed the part where the Yankees lost their All-Star SS, First-Line Catcher, and #1 Pitcher for the season last year. We all know that injuries are a part of sports. And if you can't relize how lucky the Yankees have been keeping there main assets healthy I can't help you. It is almost a fluke that they have not lost any of their key contributers for any lengthy time the past few years.

  6. #6
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    Originally posted by dirtdog7


    How bout the last 3 years? Forgive me, I missed the part where the Yankees lost their All-Star SS, First-Line Catcher, and #1 Pitcher for the season last year. We all know that injuries are a part of sports. And if you can't relize how lucky the Yankees have been keeping there main assets healthy I can't help you. It is almost a fluke that they have not lost any of their key contributers for any lengthy time the past few years.
    Please, take the red sock plea else where. I guess that the Yankees did not lose a starting 3Baseman last year nor a starting RF as well. And Orlando Hernandez had a healthy 2001 as well, right? I guess Bernie,Jeter, nor Clemens has ever gone on the disabled list as well. Yes injuries are part of the game and the Yankees have learned to win with them.

  7. #7
    Hank is my Hero!! yankeegeek's Avatar
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    Lets think about this years starting staff.

    Moose- Healthy
    Roger- Got hurt once already
    Andy- Hasn't pitched since April
    El Duque- God only knows when he will be back
    Boomer- His back sucks(still gets the job done!


    It tells you alot about our team that we had to have Mike Thurman as a starter. Even Sterling isn't exactly sterling. We have injuries too.

  8. #8
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    Don't forget Mo who's one of the toughest players to live without. What do the Sox do if UUU goes on the DL? Does Wakefield become the new closer, or would it be EL GUAPO ?

  9. #9
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    Re: Manny might return this Weekend!

    Originally posted by dirtdog7
    Looks like the return of one of the most feared hitters in all of baseball could come as early as this weekend. It is a shame he doesn't double as a releif pitcher. Arrojo was fantastic vs. the Rockies. The combination of relief pitching and home games are killing this team. Dustin Hermenson better get health quick!

    http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/16...weekendP.shtml
    So King Kong Manny returns. Whoop-dee-do? Why do all of you Sox fans describe your players as "feared"? By whom? Last I checked, Yanks went 2 of 3 last series against _THE_ most feared hitter in all of baseball, one who puts more caution in opposing pitchers and managers, while at the same time, Manny's team was swept when only seeing 1 game w/Curt Schilling.

    Manny and Jason are about the same re power, last I heard unless you heard otherwise. This "feared" business ain't foolin' nobody, since he shut down pretty quickly after June 2001.

    If you follow the crux that "great hitting beats great pitching", please remember that two of the Yankees' pitchers, Andy Pettitte and Orlando Hernandez are on the DL. They are more likely to save more runs defensively, as opposed to a less experienced pitcher, than a top slugger is expected to generate, as opposed to a less powerful hitter.

  10. #10
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    Originally posted by dirtdog7
    How bout the last 3 years? Forgive me, I missed the part where the Yankees lost their All-Star SS, First-Line Catcher, and #1 Pitcher for the season last year. We all know that injuries are a part of sports. And if you can't relize how lucky the Yankees have been keeping there main assets healthy I can't help you. It is almost a fluke that they have not lost any of their key contributers for any lengthy time the past few years.
    It's not our fault that Garciaparra had his right wrist operated on, nor is it our fault that you BoSox fans are forever using the "DL" excuse then forever denying having done so.

    Jeter went straight on his back to make a play in the stands in the ALDS and hurt like heck, which is one reason he wasn't hitting in the WS. The man was broken up but still played!!! That's guts, dude.

    Yanks haven't lost Jorge but w/only 1 backup C, you've gotta admit, we're holding onto a thin line and putting lots of reliance on Jorge. He gets hurt, we're in deep trouble. Not our faults that Tek went down last season.

    Key contributors haven't been lost? Let's see:

    Jete started the 2001 season on the DL, I think, and played hurt much of the year w/o complaining;

    For 2002, we have the following on the DL:
    CL, Mo Rivera;
    LF, RonDL White;
    LHP, SP, Andy Pettitte;
    RHP, SP, Orlando "El Duque" Hernandez;
    RF, Juan Rivera (just called up from the farm, too).

    You want to know the real reason IMO why the Sox' injuries hurt so much (no pun intended)? The 2002 Sox are DD's team. As such, you've got no farm to turn to after injuries, since DD burned the farm, trading away prospects for has-been vets who didn't exactly pan out too well. When the Yankees needed extra offensive production from the RF, they called up Juan Rivera. When he got hurt tripping over a golf cart of all things, we called up Marcus Thames. Both are our top OF prospects.

    That's what the Yankees do, they turn to the farm. If you're going to blame anyone, it should be Dan "Incompetent as Hell and I wanted more Power" Duquette. Excuses du jour won't fly here, in case you haven't noticed.

  11. #11

    Re: Re: Manny might return this Weekend!

    Originally posted by Jersey Yankee
    So King Kong Manny returns. Whoop-dee-do? Why do all of you Sox fans describe your players as "feared"? By whom? .
    I don't know? Why don't you ask the manager that likes to intenally walk him with an open base in the early innings of a game? Oh, you probably don't know who I'm talking about. IT's Joe Torre! Ask Joe if he likes pitching to Manny.

    As for the rest of you guys, I put the words "at last" in perentences, This was not Red Sox whining, this was just clearly stating the fact that the Yankees have not had to deal with major injuries the past few years like most teams have. I would call that a stroke of good luck and good for them. But I am slightly happy to see the injury bug rear it's ugly head in the Bronx I hope it can stick around until late September.

  12. #12
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    The league is catching up to the Sox and their staff of 6 inning starters. Its like this every year. They assemble a group of #4 pitchers at-best to surround Pedro and wind up fading in August because their pen is shot to hell. Granted, Derek Lowe has been a pleasant surprise, but he's also a guy who has never pitched more than 123 innings in a season. If you ask me he's a big ? around the 150IP mark. Pedro will need to be babied the rest of the year and that just leads to more work from the pen. As for Dustin Hermanson, I welcome him and his NL based 4.5 something ERA in the AL.

  13. #13
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    Re: Re: Re: Manny might return this Weekend!

    Originally posted by dirtdog7
    I don't know? Why don't you ask the manager that likes to intenally walk him with an open base in the early innings of a game? Oh, you probably don't know who I'm talking about. IT's Joe Torre! Ask Joe if he likes pitching to Manny.

    As for the rest of you guys, I put the words "at last" in perentences, This was not Red Sox whining, this was just clearly stating the fact that the Yankees have not had to deal with major injuries the past few years like most teams have. I would call that a stroke of good luck and good for them. But I am slightly happy to see the injury bug rear it's ugly head in the Bronx I hope it can stick around until late September.
    I don't follow superclosely who Joe does and doesn't walk. I remember last September, when Andy pitched at YS, in the 7th, Ramiro Mendoza came in and struck out Manny. That I do remember, since I was there. If it's early in the game, every hitter gets pitched to. Last October, Clemens (remember him?) took care of Suzuki, shutting him down like the Tribe didn't in the ALDS. It probably depends on the pitcher.
    If it's Lilly and he's been shaky, if I were Joe, I'd IBB Manny. If it's , Boomer, Roger or if/when Andy's healthy this year, I'd pitch to him. For your team, if it's Fossum or UUU, I think that Little would pitch to Giambi. If El Guapo or Oliver (who's got some crazy numbers in Jason's favor), I'd definitely IBB him. It all depends upon whether hitter can hurt pitcher, IMO.

    I don't follow 30-team injury reports, but I still think that the fault of the injuries is due to DD's selection of over-the-hill has-been vets while trading away the farm. You have a farm, you turn to it rather than being forced into any desperate emergency trades. Non-performing vets get injured.

    You talk about Pedro. He's 5'11", 170 lbs according to ESPN.com's Player Profile. Roger's 6'4", 240 lbs. Who do you think has the capability of going through a season ininjured? The larger pitcher, that's who. Look at Derek Lowe's size, look at El Guapo's . These people have meat on them thar bonez!!! Along w/his finesse and power, DD knew what he was getting when he traded f/Pedro from the Expos. He got a small-boned SP w/heat, he and conversely you guys have to be prepped to pay the price: he won't keep dominating or even pitching until his late 30s or approaching 40 like Clemens has done.

    I have no idea why Nomar waited until 4/1/01 (or thereabouts) before he realized he needed wrist surgery but the timing is certainly pretty bad. None of these injuries are our fault and I don't remember what Tek's injury was for. I do know that w/o good bench players, which shows more of a lack of planning than anything else, you can't win.

    Case in point: LHP, Randy Johnson came into town. Removed from the lineup were all LH hitters sans Jason Giambi. Gone were Ventura, Nick Johnson and all other lefties. Our righty bench players were in there and we beat him. That's not coincidence, that's planning for the future and using Plan B at the appropriate time.

    I suggest the Sox get a decent bench which can beat dominating SPs, guys in the pen who don't routinely give up meatballs and try getting in the surgery in the offseason. If not, you'll be complaining again and again and again and you know what? It still won't be our fault.

  14. #14

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Manny might return this Weekend!

    Originally posted by Jersey Yankee
    I have no idea why Nomar waited until 4/1/01 (or thereabouts) before he realized he needed wrist surgery but the timing is certainly pretty bad. None of these injuries are our fault and I don't remember what Tek's injury was for. I do know that w/o good bench players, which shows more of a lack of planning than anything else, you can't win.

    Case in point: LHP, Randy Johnson came into town. Removed from the lineup were all LH hitters sans Jason Giambi. Gone were Ventura, Nick Johnson and all other lefties. Our righty bench players were in there and we beat him. That's not coincidence, that's planning for the future and using Plan B at the appropriate time.

    I suggest the Sox get a decent bench which can beat dominating SPs, guys in the pen who don't routinely give up meatballs and try getting in the surgery in the offseason. If not, you'll be complaining again and again and again and you know what? It still won't be our fault.
    JY, having a decent bench had nothing to do with the fact the Red Sox had a tuff time last year. If you can tell me the Yankees have enough guys on their 40 Man roster, to be competitive if they lost, Jeter, Posada, and Clemens. I would call you crazy. In fact I think one of the great strength's of the Red Sox this year is that they have a very strong bench. There bench is filled with Vet's that can play and would start on a lot of other teams in baseball. At anytime they can call on Ricky, Carlos Bearga, Brian Daubach, Lou Merloni, Jose Offerman, I would like to add Tony Clark (but I can't, untill he starts doing something)

  15. #15
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    Jose Offerman??

    Quite possibly the worst signing in baseball in the past 5 years.

  16. #16
    Originally posted by junkman73
    Jose Offerman??

    Quite possibly the worst signing in baseball in the past 5 years.
    No Sterling Hitchcock for 2 years $12 Mil. tops the cake, maybee RodDL at 2 years $10 Mil. could be up there with it.

  17. #17
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    No...I think Jose still takes the cake. Either Hitch or RonDL could turn the double-play better than that putz.

  18. #18
    Dirty Nomar.

    The Red Sox are really really good this year. What is your theory about the home record? It's kind of unusual. Some things are hard to explain, 2 years ago, the Tigers were KILLING the Yanks. It's weird.

    Do you think that it has to do with the type of hitters - using or not using the Green Monster? Do you think they're too anxious to perform in front of their eager fans? Is it a complete fluke? It's just seems odd to me that they would have such a good away record and such an average home record.

  19. #19
    Originally posted by junkman73
    No...I think Jose still takes the cake. Either Hitch or RonDL could turn the double-play better than that putz.
    News Flash! Offerman dosen't play the middle infield anymore. In this post we were talking about solid bench guys. Offerman is a professional hitter, that gives quality AB's. By the way, he plays a good firstbase too.

  20. #20
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    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Manny might return this Weekend!

    Originally posted by dirtdog7
    JY, having a decent bench had nothing to do with the fact the Red Sox had a tuff time last year. If you can tell me the Yankees have enough guys on their 40 Man roster, to be competitive if they lost, Jeter, Posada, and Clemens. I would call you crazy. In fact I think one of the great strength's of the Red Sox this year is that they have a very strong bench. There bench is filled with Vet's that can play and would start on a lot of other teams in baseball. At anytime they can call on Ricky, Carlos Bearga, Brian Daubach, Lou Merloni, Jose Offerman, I would like to add Tony Clark (but I can't, untill he starts doing something)
    Any ace, especially one of Clemens' rate, would be very difficult to survive losing. However, a team should have very good #2, #3 and #4 starters. If healthy, guys like Moose, Pettitte, Boomer, El Duque should all work out fine. Even if Roger were away, if he's the only one out, the other four could work out fine and Lilly could fill in as #5. The Yankees are out _TWO_ SPs right now. You were only out one SP. Not the first time Pettitte and El Duque, both postseason performers, have been out. Do we complain about the injuries 24/7 like you BoSox fans do?

    It's not our fault that your guys go on the DL, even several at the same time. If your bench was that good, they can carry that string of DL's, just as the Yanks have called up Mike Thurman and had Lilly make starts against Feddy Garcia and Pedro, even pitching to Barry Bonds. If a team is deep, it'll show when they need it. If not, the proof's in the pudding.

    BTW, please try spelling the names "Rickey" and "Baerga" correctly, but you seem to have a good bench, even if I haven't checked all their stats. Whoever fills in at SS would need to be competent or the GM's got more work to do.

    Yankees still beat Randy Johnson, one of the finest active pitchers, NL or NL, using primarily the bench, since the team has switched to LH hitters in 2002.

    I also question your inclusion of Jose Offerman's name, since a few Sox fans I know of compared him to now-departed Gerald Williams.

  21. #21
    Originally posted by Alex
    Dirty Nomar.

    The Red Sox are really really good this year. What is your theory about the home record? It's kind of unusual. Some things are hard to explain, 2 years ago, the Tigers were KILLING the Yanks. It's weird.

    Do you think that it has to do with the type of hitters - using or not using the Green Monster? Do you think they're too anxious to perform in front of their eager fans? Is it a complete fluke? It's just seems odd to me that they would have such a good away record and such an average home record.
    Alex, you hit the nail right on the head. I was having a converstion today with one of my Red Sox Fan friends about the samething. We have determined that the Red Sox are not quite built to play 81 games at Fenway. It seems like every team the Sox play against are more suited to play there than they are. There entire line up is filled with line drive hitters from the right side. Manny, Nomar, Hilly all don't lift the ball like traditional HR guys. They end up hitting bullets off the wall that 6-10 are singles, the other for times are split between HR's and extra base hits. None of the left hand hitters do a great job of hitting the ball the other way. It seems like the visting clubs can get the ball up into the screen much better than the Sox. It bothers me a little bit, but hey what can I complain about this team is a solid team.

  22. #22
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    News Flash! Offerman dosen't play the middle infield anymore. In this post we were talking about solid bench guys. Offerman is a professional hitter, that gives quality AB's. By the way, he plays a good firstbase too

    Exactly...because he can't turn the double play.....and you can't comment on Hitchcock making $6mil per if the Sox are paying Offerman $6mil per to be a "bench guy" as you put it. Too bad he wasn't playing first in Game 1 of the 99 ALDS....maybe he picks Valentin's throw, Thome never ties the game, and Pedro is ready for Game 1 vs the Yanks.

  23. #23
    Do you think there's anything to getting too anxious when playing in front of a home crowd? Some players like it, but I think there are definately players that prefer to perform away. Clemens in general does better at home, and it seems like Orlando (at least in the past) does better on the road.

  24. #24

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Manny might return this Weekend!

    Originally posted by Jersey Yankee
    BTW, please try spelling the names "Rickey" and "Baerga" correctly, but you seem to have a good bench, even if I haven't checked all their stats. Whoever fills in at SS would need to be competent or the GM's got more work to do.

    Yankees still beat Randy Johnson, one of the finest active pitchers, NL or NL, using primarily the bench, since the team has switched to LH hitters in 2002.

    I also question your inclusion of Jose Offerman's name, since a few Sox fans I know of compared him to now-departed Gerald Williams.
    Umm, I didn't realize that you were the spelling teacher of the BB. BTW in the maintain accuracy please state NL or AL the next time you post about the American and National Leauges.

  25. #25
    Originally posted by Alex
    Do you think there's anything to getting too anxious when playing in front of a home crowd? Some players like it, but I think there are definately players that prefer to perform away. Clemens in general does better at home, and it seems like Orlando (at least in the past) does better on the road.
    I personally don't buy that. But the way they have play thus far at home you might be onto something. I just feel that these guys are just natural line drive hitters (which is fine), but they definately don't take advantage of the cheap HR's that Fenway has to offer.

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