+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 58
  1. #1

    Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Not really sure why MLB continues to schedule teams to play 19x4= 76 games against teams in their division but only 66 games total against the remaining 10 teams in the AL.

    It certainly makes it far more difficult for a second place WC team in the East to have a better record than a second place team from the Central or West. Its not even close when you look at the overall records broken down against each division.

    Cleveland is 12-21 against the East. Im guessing they would not even be .500 if they played each team in the East 19 times yet they may very well have a better overall record than the Yankees.

    Texas is also sub .500 against both the East and Central

    I think the NBA has the fairest method in having each team play nearly all other teams in the conference 4 times and every non conference team 2 times (I believe)


    The Yankees and Rays are clearly no worse than the 4th or 5th best team in the AL yet it is very doubtful both will make the playoffs.

  2. #2

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    If MLB were to go to a completely balanced schedule (within each league) then there would be no point in having divisions at all but having two wild cards would be completely fair. With a balanced schedule and no divisions, the 4th and 5th place teams would be the wildcards. The winner of the WC game would play the first place team in the Division Series while the second and third place teams would play in the other Division Series.

    The problem with that is you'd really only have two races per season; the race for third (to avoid the one game WC playoff) and the race for 5th (to get into the WC playoff). Not conducive to anything resembling a "pennant race."

    On the other hand, divisions with unbalanced schedules make sense in determining the a "champion" of some sort (division champion). No one will be legitimately be able to argue that the Red Sox aren't the true and deserving champion of the East Division. The problem with this scheme, as you pointed out, is with the wildcards. Some teams (Cleveland) have an easier overall schedule and therefore have an easier road to making the playoffs than a team (Yankees) in a tougher division.

    The advantage of this setup are that, in theory, you can get three (per league) "pennant races" for division championships (which in the two wildcard era do have value) plus a race for the second wildcard, that is, four potential races.

    Bud likes races and races for division championships (plus one race for the second wildcard) are more appealing than a race for the third best record in the league (plus the second wildcard).

    Personally, I would prefer going back to two divisions (perhaps add two teams to get to 16 per league or move Houston back to the NL) per league with only the division champion advancing but that's just me. From a financial and fan interest standpoint, having a division winner win by 12 or 14 games with the other six or seven teams in that division just playing out the string for the last three months of the season is not good for the sport.

    I've resigned myself to the fact that 162 games determine the best teams (currently the Braves and Red Sox) while the playoffs constitute an entirely separate "season" that determines the "champion" which may or may not be one of the best two teams over the 162 game regular season.
    I can't complain but sometimes I still do. - Joe Walsh

  3. #3

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    I'm for reverting back to the 1967 pre-Curt Flood rules... kinda like re-setting your computer back to its "default" settings... 2 Leagues, no divisions, no playoffs, no watering-down with AAA teams, no DH, no free-agents, no overpaid-millionaire mediocre players, no roids, single-pay doubleheaders, and $35 box-seats as adjusted for inflation... OOPS !! I'm sorry, I started writing down my daydream here, everytime a see a sensible argument that goes against the overriding principle of "WHAT WILL GET THE OWNERS & PLAYERS THE MOST MONEY FROM THE SUCKERS " (that means "us").
    Roger Maris = single season "natural" home-run record-holder.

  4. #4
    Devoted Member
    Bugg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Brooklyn

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by RogerNatural View Post
    I'm for reverting back to the 1967 pre-Curt Flood rules... kinda like re-setting your computer back to its "default" settings... 2 Leagues, no divisions, no playoffs, no watering-down with AAA teams, no DH, no free-agents, no overpaid-millionaire mediocre players, no roids, single-pay doubleheaders, and $35 box-seats as adjusted for inflation... OOPS !! I'm sorry, I started writing down my daydream here, everytime a see a sensible argument that goes against the overriding principle of "WHAT WILL GET THE OWNERS & PLAYERS THE MOST MONEY FROM THE SUCKERS " (that means "us").
    Think scheduling several Sunday doubleheaders and dropping to 154 or so games makes a world of sense. Going against NCAA football and the NFL is giving away gates that pretty much suck anyway. and bascially we have baseball after Labor Day to find 2 teams in each league for what amounts to a play in game. Had occasion to flip around to the various MLB games on FIOS last night; there are a lot of empty seats. Imagine is doubly true on Sundays and week night school nights. Even the Yanks/Sawx Thurday featured lot of empty seats. Would probably also requirte retrhinking Sunday nights which seem to be a real travel headache.with 40 man rosters after september 1st MLB is bascially compromising it's product.
    pitching, pitching and pitching

  5. #5
    Addicted Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Dunstable, MA

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugg View Post
    Think scheduling several Sunday doubleheaders and dropping to 154 or so games makes a world of sense. Going against NCAA football and the NFL is giving away gates that pretty much suck anyway. and bascially we have baseball after Labor Day to find 2 teams in each league for what amounts to a play in game. Had occasion to flip around to the various MLB games on FIOS last night; there are a lot of empty seats. Imagine is doubly true on Sundays and week night school nights. Even the Yanks/Sawx Thurday featured lot of empty seats. Would probably also requirte retrhinking Sunday nights which seem to be a real travel headache.with 40 man rosters after september 1st MLB is bascially compromising it's product.
    I actually like the division games until this year and at one point this year I was looking forward to playing Boston down the stretch (around 15 games). Now I can't believe it. But they (Bud) is not going back. The East has always been tough; I like the quality of play; and above all the rivalty. We need to get more competitive. I am worried about our pitching next year.

  6. #6

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by pacersyankees View Post
    Not really sure why MLB continues to schedule teams to play 19x4= 76 games against teams in their division but only 66 games total against the remaining 10 teams in the AL.

    It certainly makes it far more difficult for a second place WC team in the East to have a better record than a second place team from the Central or West. Its not even close when you look at the overall records broken down against each division.

    Cleveland is 12-21 against the East. Im guessing they would not even be .500 if they played each team in the East 19 times yet they may very well have a better overall record than the Yankees.

    Texas is also sub .500 against both the East and Central

    I think the NBA has the fairest method in having each team play nearly all other teams in the conference 4 times and every non conference team 2 times (I believe)


    The Yankees and Rays are clearly no worse than the 4th or 5th best team in the AL yet it is very doubtful both will make the playoffs.
    I'm not sure. The 17 years with 1 wildcard team produced 13 AL East teams being the WC, 3 AL West and only 1 AL Central team making it. That would make it appear easier to make the WC from the east, not harder. Last year the 2 teams were AL west and east. Central was nowhere to be found. The continuing unbalanced schedule seems to work against the AL central for what reason I don't know?

  7. #7
    Forum Regular

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Seattle, WA

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by pacersyankees View Post
    The Yankees and Rays are clearly no worse than the 4th or 5th best team in the AL yet it is very doubtful both will make the playoffs.
    How is a team that was outscored over the season clearly one of the 4 or 5 best teams in the league?

  8. #8
    Devoted Member
    Yankeefan3783's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Waterbury, CT

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    If baseball ever expands to 32 they could go with 4 divisions of 4 teams in each league. Or, 2 divisions of 8 teams. Balanced schedule, no IL.

  9. #9

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankeefan3783 View Post
    If baseball ever expands to 32 they could go with 4 divisions of 4 teams in each league. Or, 2 divisions of 8 teams. Balanced schedule, no IL.
    I don't see them ever going to two divisions of eight. Four of four would almost certainly be the way it would be set up. Hopefully, in that case, only the four division winners would get into the playoffs. There is no point in having divisions if they play a balanced schedule. I would suspect that four divisions of four teams would play more within the division to make a division championship mean something. They'll never dump interleague.
    I can't complain but sometimes I still do. - Joe Walsh

  10. #10
    NYYF Legend

    ymike673's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Brooklyn,NY

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    I really hate this two WC system. If MLB wanted the WC to have a disadvantage they could have had the WC face the team with the best record in the first round and only get one home game. It could have been scheduled as 2 1 2. Playing an entire 162 game schedule to play what amounts to a play in game is just ridiculous.

  11. #11
    NYYF Legend

    ymike673's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Brooklyn,NY

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankeefan3783 View Post
    If baseball ever expands to 32 they could go with 4 divisions of 4 teams in each league. Or, 2 divisions of 8 teams. Balanced schedule, no IL.
    Baseball will never go to 32 teams. There are too many teams now.

  12. #12
    #notonemore Big_E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    37 miles from the Home Office of Baseball

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by pacersyankees View Post
    The Yankees and Rays are clearly no worse than the 4th or 5th best team in the AL yet it is very doubtful both will make the playoffs.
    I can't get past this sentence. The Yankees, with virtually no SP are the 4th or 5th best team in the AL?

    Fantasy Baseball: Larrupin' Lou's

  13. #13

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    It's really not a catastrophe if a team from the Central gets a WC spot. It doesn't mean that they playoff format has to be blown up and reconfigured.

  14. #14
    #notonemore Big_E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    37 miles from the Home Office of Baseball

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by markyra View Post
    It's really not a catastrophe if a team from the Central gets a WC spot. It doesn't mean that they playoff format has to be blown up and reconfigured.

    Yes, that's exactly what it means...we need to have as many playoff spots as it takes for the Yankees to qualify every year.

    Don't you know nothing?

    /sarcasm

    Fantasy Baseball: Larrupin' Lou's

  15. #15

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by Big_E View Post
    I can't get past this sentence. The Yankees, with virtually no SP are the 4th or 5th best team in the AL?
    Well- where do we begin:

    1) Boston
    2) Oakland/Detroit about equal
    4) Rays
    5) Yankees
    6) Texas???? 13-17 vs East, 12-17 vs Central
    7) Cleveland??? 12-21 vs East
    8) Baltimore??? 9-10 vs NYY, 6-9 vs Rays, 30-33 vs AL East

    If you "can't get past the sentence" then surely you can tell us who the 4th and 5th best teams in the AL are if they are not TB or NY, right????

    I'm also factoring in the Yankees team in their current state now WITH Arod, Soriano, Granderson, etc, one that would probably have sewed up nothing worse than a WC spot by now had these 3, or even 2/3 been on the active roster most of the year.

    I'll hang up and listen- this ought to be fun

  16. #16

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by Zzyzx View Post
    How is a team that was outscored over the season clearly one of the 4 or 5 best teams in the league?
    Im presuming by "league" you meant the AL, not MLB. I guess using your logic- the following teams would all be better than the Yankees since they have a better run differential:

    1) LAA -6
    2) KC + 36
    3) BALT + 46
    4) CLEV + 59
    5) TEX + 66

    Again- might the NYY run differential be a tad better if they played Houston & Seattle 19 times per year? What about CHI and Minnesota??

    Who cares? Run differential means absolutely zilch

  17. #17

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    I get why they introduced the first wildcard, and I get why they then created the second wildcard.

    That said, this second wildcard is creating a situation where the September pennant race is basically watching barely above mediocre teams try to survive, rather than good to great teams fighting it out for a post season spot.

    If it was Rays vs. Rangers for one wildcard, that's a little easier to stomach than watching the Yankees, Indians, Royals and Orioles all try to get in as well....

    In my perfect, never to be seen world, MLB would contract to 24 teams and have four divisions of six teams each, with a best of 7 LCS in each league leading up to the World Series...or contract to 28 teams with four divisions of 7 each.

    As I say, that will never happen, of course, so to me the second best setup is to actually expand by two teams (say in Mexico City and Montreal), and have eight divisions of four teams each. While still not likely, it would be considerably more plausible than my preferred contraction scenarios.

    But this idea that fans are getting excited about the wild card races is to me just not true (save for maybe in Kansas City because of how long it's been). Pennant races among so-so teams just don't feature the excitement of pennant races between good to great teams...

  18. #18
    #notonemore Big_E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    37 miles from the Home Office of Baseball

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by pacersyankees View Post
    Well- where do we begin:

    1) Boston
    2) Oakland/Detroit about equal
    4) Rays
    5) Yankees
    6) Texas???? 13-17 vs East, 12-17 vs Central
    7) Cleveland??? 12-21 vs East
    8) Baltimore??? 9-10 vs NYY, 6-9 vs Rays, 30-33 vs AL East

    If you "can't get past the sentence" then surely you can tell us who the 4th and 5th best teams in the AL are if they are not TB or NY, right????

    I'm also factoring in the Yankees team in their current state now WITH Arod, Soriano, Granderson, etc, one that would probably have sewed up nothing worse than a WC spot by now had these 3, or even 2/3 been on the active roster most of the year.

    I'll hang up and listen- this ought to be fun

    And with those guys, they just got swept by Boston. They are 7-8 this month.

    For the season, they are 10th in the AL in runs. 172 fewer than Boston. 13th in HR. 12th in BA. 12th in OBP.

    Their expected W/L is 73-77, which mean's they're actually playing over their heads for the season, by +6 games.

    They have the 7th best ERA, 13th worst BAA, on and on...

    They're a bad team, that had a good run that gave fans hope...but in reality, this is a bad team going nowhere.

    Fantasy Baseball: Larrupin' Lou's

  19. #19

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    It evens out over time. No Yankee fans were complaining when we were pretty much steamrolling the Jays, rays and orioles in the late 90s early 2000's while the AL West had very good balance

    Besides, the yankees are in this mess not because of an unbalanced schedule , but because they posted a whopping 6-10 record vs the White Sox, Mets , Astros and Padres to this point.

  20. #20

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeFan1421 View Post
    But this idea that fans are getting excited about the wild card races is to me just not true
    No kidding. From tonight's Rangers - Rays box score on ESPN.com:

    Stadium Tropicana Field, St. Petersburg, FL
    Attendance 10,724 (31.5% full) - % is based on regular season capacity
    Game Time 3:01
    Weather indoors

    http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=330916130
    I can't complain but sometimes I still do. - Joe Walsh

  21. #21
    Sunny days ahead YankeePride1967's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    CT

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Nothing to do with the Yankees, but with two wild cards now, I am in favor of a balanced schedule. Does anyone actually think Cleveland is better than any of the teams they are competing with for the last wild card?

  22. #22

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    I really hate this two WC system. If MLB wanted the WC to have a disadvantage they could have had the WC face the team with the best record in the first round and only get one home game. It could have been scheduled as 2 1 2. Playing an entire 162 game schedule to play what amounts to a play in game is just ridiculous.
    Eh, baseball can't win this argument. When the wild card was introduced, people complained the division meant nothing. Now you're complaining and arguing the division shouldn't mean much. Why is a play-in game ridiculous? Anymore ridiculous than rewarding the division winner with ... nothing but one extra home game.

    Look, nothing is fair except a completely balanced schedule and one league. No AL. No NL. One league and no playoffs. Otherwise there are arbitrary rules. That's sports. All sports.

    And to the guy who wants no million-dollar contracts: yep, all those players are so dam greedy actually wanting to receive some of the money owners earn. Screw them.

    Sarcasm aside, I hate complaining.

  23. #23

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by OnTheBorder79 View Post
    Eh, baseball can't win this argument. When the wild card was introduced, people complained the division meant nothing. Now you're complaining and arguing the division shouldn't mean much. Why is a play-in game ridiculous? Anymore ridiculous than rewarding the division winner with ... nothing but one extra home game.

    Look, nothing is fair except a completely balanced schedule and one league. No AL. No NL. One league and no playoffs. Otherwise there are arbitrary rules. That's sports. All sports.

    And to the guy who wants no million-dollar contracts: yep, all those players are so dam greedy actually wanting to receive some of the money owners earn. Screw them.

    Sarcasm aside, I hate complaining.
    I have mixed emotions on it, granted, but the downside to the one game playoff is that it's very plausible you get a team from a stronger division (like the Rays) finishing three or four games ahead of a team from a weaker division (like the Indians) and then lose what amounts to a play-in game (it feels more like a play-in than a playoff game to me) and based on a one game crapshoot, the Rays go home and are forgotten while the Indians get a chance to play in the playoffs, even though after 163 games the Rays finished comfortably ahead of the Indians. (sure as a Yankee fan if they were to squeak into it, I would be there watching and enthralled, but I would feel a bit dirty in the morning...)

    The other issue to me is that it's contrived drama. You're asking the casual baseball fan to get focused on a single elimination game with all the drama that involves and then switch back to the mode of a best of five and then best of seven series. And then if one of them goes to the 7th game, which should be the ultimate, there's a feeling of familiarity because they just saw one of these.

    In general, baseball is trying to manufacture/guarantee pennant races every year and while I know it helps overall revenues, I think it dilutes the memories and specialness of seasons like 1978. If you want to capture September back from the NFL, then roll the dice and set it up so that the entire month feels like an ongoing playoff that's fair and not a crapshoot.

  24. #24

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by Ram Man View Post
    No kidding. From tonight's Rangers - Rays box score on ESPN.com:

    Stadium Tropicana Field, St. Petersburg, FL
    Attendance 10,724 (31.5% full) - % is based on regular season capacity
    Game Time 3:01
    Weather indoors

    http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=330916130
    Actually, though, I would look more at TV ratings than attendance for this...as the modern fan doesn't really walk up to games the way they used to. Few in Tampa are circling their calendars for a game in mid September against the Texas Rangers and buying tickets back in June.

    I may be in the minority, but if I really want to zero in on a big game, I actually prefer watching it television ,more and more, than I do being there. Aside from a huge playoff/World Series game, I suppose...but a late season pennant race game that I am invested in, I'd rather watch on the big screen for the most part.

    for a mid-season game in beautiful weather against whomever, I look forward to the stadium experience as I don't feel I need to hang on every pitch...

  25. #25
    Devoted Member
    Bugg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Brooklyn

    Re: Argument For A Balanced Schedule

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeFan1421 View Post
    I have mixed emotions on it, granted, but the downside to the one game playoff is that it's very plausible you get a team from a stronger division (like the Rays) finishing three or four games ahead of a team from a weaker division (like the Indians) and then lose what amounts to a play-in game (it feels more like a play-in than a playoff game to me) and based on a one game crapshoot, the Rays go home and are forgotten while the Indians get a chance to play in the playoffs, even though after 163 games the Rays finished comfortably ahead of the Indians. (sure as a Yankee fan if they were to squeak into it, I would be there watching and enthralled, but I would feel a bit dirty in the morning...)

    The other issue to me is that it's contrived drama. You're asking the casual baseball fan to get focused on a single elimination game with all the drama that involves and then switch back to the mode of a best of five and then best of seven series. And then if one of them goes to the 7th game, which should be the ultimate, there's a feeling of familiarity because they just saw one of these.

    In general, baseball is trying to manufacture/guarantee pennant races every year and while I know it helps overall revenues, I think it dilutes the memories and specialness of seasons like 1978. If you want to capture September back from the NFL, then roll the dice and set it up so that the entire month feels like an ongoing playoff that's fair and not a crapshoot.
    You could plausibly having a 95+ win team facing a barely .500 club and having it's season turn on one bad 163rd game. And to further agree-we aren't seeing great teams fight for that 2nd WC spot, merely a September death march between a lot of mediorce ones. Look,l if the Yanks get in I'll certainly root for them to win it all. But nobody can say this is anything more than a slightly over .500 team.
    pitching, pitching and pitching

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

     

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts