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Thread: Masahiro Tanaka

  1. #226
    Movin' on Bub's Avatar
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Stats mean very little to nothing. Look at his velocity, movement and most of all location. Everything else just says he can compete. If they took this approach to Igawa the mistake would never have happened.
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  2. #227
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Be careful with the velocity. He throws a very flat fastball, with little to no movement. Though velo is strong, it has been called very pedestrian.

    What I hope is that someone can get him to get movement on his FB, making the split and slider that much more effective, those are his out pitches.

    Also, regarding Igawa, there were plenty of scouting reports that made him sound plausible.

    http://prospectinsider.wordpress.com...kei-igawa-lhp/
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  3. #228

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by goin for 27 View Post
    Be careful with the velocity. He throws a very flat fastball, with little to no movement. Though velo is strong, it has been called very pedestrian.

    What I hope is that someone can get him to get movement on his FB, making the split and slider that much more effective, those are his out pitches.

    Also, regarding Igawa, there were plenty of scouting reports that made him sound plausible.

    http://prospectinsider.wordpress.com...kei-igawa-lhp/

    His fastball isn't his bread and butter pitch. His split-finger is. All the fastball has to do is set up the split.
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  4. #229

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by snapple View Post
    His fastball isn't his bread and butter pitch. His split-finger is. All the fastball has to do is set up the split.
    I am not a fan of straight fastballs in the al east, a division that has plenty of great fastball hitters.

    Their mistake was not going for darvish (altho that texas bid was insane). I think tanaka wont be great in NY.

    Just my opinion. Nothing to really back it up

  5. #230
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by snapple View Post
    His fastball isn't his bread and butter pitch. His split-finger is. All the fastball has to do is set up the split.
    Correct. That is why I said that the splitter and slider are his out pitches.

    However, you don't pitch in this league with a flat FB. Like I said, I want the guy, I just hope someone can work with him to get movement on the FB. No FB, no split.
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  6. #231
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by goin for 27 View Post
    Also, regarding Igawa, there were plenty of scouting reports that made him sound plausible.

    http://prospectinsider.wordpress.com...kei-igawa-lhp/
    No one makes that signing, especially at that price, for what basically would amount to a #3 if all things went right.

  7. #232

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by snapple View Post
    His fastball isn't his bread and butter pitch. His split-finger is. All the fastball has to do is set up the split.
    Well he throws his Slider almost as much as his Fastball. Both of those pitches setup his splitter which is his strikeout pitch. He's a true 3 pitch starter though.

    If his control translates to or rather doesn't significantly regress in the MLB he'll be a great pitcher.

    Everything I've read about him suggests that he's extremely motivated and takes adversity as a challenge to improve. He seems to have a great mentality for NY.

  8. #233
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by teknetic View Post
    No one makes that signing, especially at that price, for what basically would amount to a #3 if all things went right.
    I did not say it was a good signing, I am just saying that there were some scouts that were high on him. I also was here back in the day, and many here were elated at the signing.

    I will say it again - I definitely think Tanaka is worth the risk, Posting does not count towards cap, and there is NOTHING in FA.

    Totally worth the flyer, but I have very low expectations compared to many here. If he could make 25 starts, and be a decent 5, I would be elated.

    Primarily, because if he can do that, he should be able to develop more in years to come.

    I think some feel he would replace Kuroda (If Kuroda does not come back) which IMO is absurd.
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  9. #234

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by goin for 27 View Post
    I did not say it was a good signing, I am just saying that there were some scouts that were high on him. I also was here back in the day, and many here were elated at the signing.

    I will say it again - I definitely think Tanaka is worth the risk, Posting does not count towards cap, and there is NOTHING in FA.

    Totally worth the flyer, but I have very low expectations compared to many here. If he could make 25 starts, and be a decent 5, I would be elated.

    Primarily, because if he can do that, he should be able to develop more in years to come.

    I think some feel he would replace Kuroda (If Kuroda does not come back) which IMO is absurd.
    I also agree that he is at best a #3. Maybe #2. Waay too much to pay for that, cap savings be damned.

    Just put that $60 mil into hiring away all the key personnel from other teams ^^.

    Or just suck it up, revamp the org, and "bridge year" it. Sox pulled it off (twice!) why cant we?

  10. #235
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    2 things:

    1) I don't have any faith the Yankees will scout him properly (see Kei Igawa). They literally weren't aware of the pitches he threw.
    2) I don't have any faith the Yankees scouts are adept at talent evaluation.

  11. #236

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by ober0n98 View Post
    I also agree that he is at best a #3. Maybe #2. Waay too much to pay for that, cap savings be damned.

    Just put that $60 mil into hiring away all the key personnel from other teams ^^.

    Or just suck it up, revamp the org, and "bridge year" it. Sox pulled it off (twice!) why cant we?
    Because the Dodgers won't take A-Rod off their hands like they did with Crawford and Beckett for the Red Sox.

  12. #237

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    there seems to be 2 key adjustments we need to make about players coming from japan etc.

    first is how good their stuff actually is, second is their approach to pitching. both of these are distorted by the different hitting approach and quality of batters in an international league

    a pitcher can have stuff that's worse than what the stats show, even compared to peers who have made the transition. this depends on scouting to inform

    a pitcher can also adjust worse to the different ways hitters in MLB attack the pitcher. even darvish had some issues dealing with this and his stuff is so much better. however, players like kuroda seem to have done fine and his approach is one of the strong points of his game even. so this adjustment to approach depends on teh individual player and maybe team coaching etc
    always reasonable

  13. #238
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

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  14. #239

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by pleasepassthesoup View Post
    Because the Dodgers won't take A-Rod off their hands like they did with Crawford and Beckett for the Red Sox.
    What i mean is not to get a bailout by the dodgers but simply to deliberately not spend on long contracts, sucking a little and concentrating on revamping player development.

    I was actually a proponent of trading cano for prospects at the trade deadline. At the time it seemed like we had no chance at the playoffs and it seemed to be and still seems to be the right choice. We get a bunch of prospects instead of one pick, and we still have a chance to re-sign him this winter anyways if the rumor is true and cano will go to the highest bidder anyways.

    So what i'm saying is dont sign anyone longterm, suck a crapton next year, rehaul everything. Basically build the foundation for another period of sustained success.

  15. #240
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by ober0n98 View Post
    What i mean is not to get a bailout by the dodgers but simply to deliberately not spend on long contracts, sucking a little and concentrating on revamping player development.

    I was actually a proponent of trading cano for prospects at the trade deadline. At the time it seemed like we had no chance at the playoffs and it seemed to be and still seems to be the right choice. We get a bunch of prospects instead of one pick, and we still have a chance to re-sign him this winter anyways if the rumor is true and cano will go to the highest bidder anyways.

    So what i'm saying is dont sign anyone longterm, suck a crapton next year, rehaul everything. Basically build the foundation for another period of sustained success.
    Tanaka is 24. He can be one of the foundation players.

    I think people over-react to long term contract. It really depends on how much payroll team is cooperating. Having a payroll as high as the Yankees, the key is how to take balance between handing long term contracts to foundation players and keep payroll flexibility. The Yankees are not the A's. There is no need for them to act like the A's.

  16. #241

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Has there been any report on when Tohoku plans on posting him? I know Darvish was mid-December and Dice-K was mid-to-late January.

  17. #242

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Apparently there is a new posting system that might go into effect November 1st. I wonder what it entails?

  18. #243

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by TrueYankee01 View Post
    Apparently there is a new posting system that might go into effect November 1st. I wonder what it entails?
    I think the major change is that the player being posted gains the ability to pick his team from the top 3 bidders. So even if the Yanks are the top bid, they may not get him.

  19. #244

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by wang+cano=future View Post
    I think the major change is that the player being posted gains the ability to pick his team from the top 3 bidders. So even if the Yanks are the top bid, they may not get him.
    Hopefully the Yankees' appeal as a brand internationally as compared to other MLB teams would make that a positive rather than a negative, but who knows.

  20. #245

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by wang+cano=future View Post
    I think the major change is that the player being posted gains the ability to pick his team from the top 3 bidders. So even if the Yanks are the top bid, they may not get him.
    Interesting, I guess.

  21. #246
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by wang+cano=future View Post
    I think the major change is that the player being posted gains the ability to pick his team from the top 3 bidders. So even if the Yanks are the top bid, they may not get him.
    You are correct.

    http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/eye-on-...stem-agreement

    I find this kind of stunning. One would think that the posting club wants the most money possible, who cares about the player.

    I think it helps the Yankees. Most opportunity for marketing dollars for player. Kind of sucks though, in the era of trying to get to $189M, some other team could drive up the offer.
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  22. #247

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    It means the Yankees just need the third highest bid to get a shot at Tanaka.

    More of the money will be going toward the players (more toward luxury tax).

  23. #248

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Quote Originally Posted by grizy View Post
    It means the Yankees just need the third highest bid to get a shot at Tanaka.

    More of the money will be going toward the players (more toward luxury tax).
    But do you think the player will have the mentality of "well I'm just going to go with the highest bidder because they clearly want me most on their team?"

  24. #249

    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    Possibly, but that posting fee is not their money and I am sure agents have good ideas on what the teams are willing to give to the players.

  25. #250
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    Re: Masahiro Tanaka

    When did they alter this rule? (top three bidder can negotiate)

    I can just see that in the future, if the Yankees are the #3 bid and sign Tanaka, that MLB changes the rules that the posting fee counts towards salary, evenly over the life of the contract.
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