View Poll Results: Do you think collisions at home plate should be banned?

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  • Yes - it's an unnecessary risk to player safety

    27 47.37%
  • No - it's part of the game

    26 45.61%
  • Undecided

    4 7.02%
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  1. #26
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    I have felt this change has been necessary for a long time. With the info we have on concussions in all of sports, and the possible career ending injuries that could occur, I am all for eliminating it. Matheny is correct, the runner sprobably feel like they have to do it even if they don't want to. The catcher is at such a dangerous disadvantage it's just not necessary.
    Concussions are going to happen occasionally, but I think the concussion argument is a rather weak one due to the relative lack of frequency with which actual blows to the head happen, even in home plate collisions. Rules like that are certainly necessary in the NFL, where head trauma of one sort or another happens on almost every play, or in hockey where checking is very much a part of the game, but the runner catcher collision is a pretty rare play in baseball, and a lot of the time when it happens it's kind of half-assed anyway. A lot of times when catchers get hurt it's not their heads, either. I would submit that balls being fouled back into the catcher's mask are a far greater threat when it comes to concussions/long term impact than a few incidents per year where they might be a really serious collision.

    I would hate to change the rule so it's up to the umpire to make a judgment call on something like that. I'm not necessarily diametrically opposed to change on the issues, but I think the "safety of the players" angle here is probably being overstated in this particular instance (and I'm generally very supportive of changes in that regard.) If concussions are a concern, they should start by all wearing those helmets that Cervelli wears, which look pretty silly but are evidently significantly safer. That's a change you could make overnight with no impact on the actual game.
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  2. #27

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Mxylsplk View Post
    That's actually the rule already, though obviously it's not enforced.

    But why would this be difficult to put in place? Wouldn't this just be the same as plays at any other base? Fielders can't block the bases, and runners can't bowl them over. Instances of runners or fielders claiming they were interfered with are pretty rare there, why would it be different at home? (Other than players having to get used to the change).

    My understanding is that they can- if a fielder gets in the way of a runner and is in the basepath the runner can legally run the fielder over. Rarely happens, but I remember a play when Mike Lowell did just that to Cano
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  3. #28
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Lou, you know I agree with you 99.9% of the time, but let's not use Little League in this discussion. The stakes are totally different in a variety of ways.
    You do know that batting helmets started in little league right?
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  4. #29
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by ieddyi View Post
    My understanding is that they can- if a fielder gets in the way of a runner and is in the basepath the runner can legally run the fielder over. Rarely happens, but I remember a play when Mike Lowell did just that to Cano
    If this were true then shouldn't A-Rod have been safe on the infamous "slap" play against the Red Sox back in 2004? The point of running into the catcher is to knock the ball out of his hands, and that's exactly what Alex did to Arroyo (albeit in a somewhat comical, less aggressive manner) but he was called out for it. That leads me to believe that catchers are the only defenders you can legally run over, but I could be wrong about this.
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  5. #30
    Don't call it a comeback False1's Avatar
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    You do know that batting helmets started in little league right?
    I didn't, but not sure what that means in this context. They call games at twilight in many little league games, have mercy rules, etc too. Was just saying that on plays on the plate, the stakes are way different in a little league game than they are in a ML game. Thus, the tolerance for injury risk may be different.

  6. #31
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by NelsonMuntz View Post
    If this were true then shouldn't A-Rod have been safe on the infamous "slap" play against the Red Sox back in 2004? The point of running into the catcher is to knock the ball out of his hands, and that's exactly what Alex did to Arroyo (albeit in a somewhat comical, less aggressive manner) but he was called out for it. That leads me to believe that catchers are the only defenders you can legally run over, but I could be wrong about this.
    I think if the fielder is in the basepath, contact can be made with this exception:

    Quote Originally Posted by Section 6.1 of the MLB Umpire Manual
    While contact may occur between a fielder and runner during a tag attempt, a runner is not allowed to use his hands or arms to commit an obviously malicious or unsportsmanlike act.

  7. #32
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    I didn't, but not sure what that means in this context. They call games at twilight in many little league games, have mercy rules, etc too. Was just saying that on plays on the plate, the stakes are way different in a little league game than they are in a ML game. Thus, the tolerance for injury risk may be different.
    In this context it is a saftey issue and prior to batting helmets being introduced by little league in the 1950s no one wore them by the 1970s they were required for all non grandfathered MLBers.

    I'm not saying a mercy rule or everyone must play rule should be instituted but common sense where injuries are fairly easily avoidable by rule should be adopted.

    Again, it was common to barrel roll into the SS/2B breaking up a DP for many, many years in MLB, that is no loanger allowed. I'm not sure why the play at home should be treated any differently.
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  8. #33
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    I think if the fielder is in the basepath, contact can be made with this exception:
    Indeed I was wrong. How did you ever find that rule?
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  9. #34
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    collisions at home plate dont happen that often, its part of the game. You're catcher wants to avoid collisions, get his pitcher to throw strikes, plain and simple
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  10. #35
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Everyone keeps saying it doesn't happen enough. Are we supposed to wait until it does in order to prevent it from happening afterwards? No reason to wait. If it doesn't happen often enough then it won't change much.
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  11. #36
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by BronxYanks45 View Post
    collisions at home plate dont happen that often, its part of the game. You're catcher wants to avoid collisions, get his pitcher to throw strikes, plain and simple
    This may have been the stupidest thing I've read all month.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  12. #37

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    If the only thing baseball got going for it is nostalgia, the sport will die in a hurry.

    We need to look forward and find ways to grow the sport.

    One of the things we could do is to make it safer.

  13. #38
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    The majority of the people who have voted are pro-collision? Seriously?

  14. #39

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    MLB put a status up on their Facebook about this a few days ago, asking what people thought about the rules being changed to protect catchers. I would say a good 75% of people were against it, most claiming that it would ruin the sport and insinuating that the only people who would want to see it changed are fans of catchers who have been seriously injured in plays at the plate (the word whiny was used a lot).

  15. #40
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by d32123 View Post
    The majority of the people who have voted are pro-collision? Seriously?
    It's split down the middle now and even that surprises me. How many rules have changed as a result of a devastating injury or death - in any sport? The NFL is fighting an uphill battle to cut down on players leading with the helmet and other potentially very harmful tactics. Former players are suing because they believe the league was aware of the devastating effects of repeated head trauma, but did nothing to try to prevent it. Here we have an opportunity to eliminate or cut down on the chance that a catcher or runner or both may be dealt a season-ending or career ending injury.....or worse. It doesn't make sense not to figure out a rule that would remove that chance. If Pete Rose had ended Ray Fosse's career when he steamrolled him in the All-Star game (a game that did not COUNT at that time), we may or may not be having this conversation because the technology and research were not available then. We have both now.
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  16. #41

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Whether or not collisions at home plate should be banned, I think most will agree this is probably outside the lines:

    The pitcher tosses a wild pitch and the runner on third sets off towards home, at which point the pitcher no doubt thinks "Screw it" and decides to annihilate this Hendrix baserunner.
    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ter-wild-pitch

    Credit to the umps and coaches for preventing a brawl.

  17. #42
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Mxylsplk View Post
    Whether or not collisions at home plate should be banned, I think most will agree this is probably outside the lines:



    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ter-wild-pitch

    Credit to the umps and coaches for preventing a brawl.
    Wow... textbook example of how to NOT play the game.

  18. #43

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by penfold View Post
    Wow... textbook example of how to NOT play the game.
    At least not this game. Football on the other hand ...
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  19. #44

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    I am as old-school & a traditionalist as they come. But on this, there should be no difference at HP or any other base. Suddenly baseball becomes a football game? If there's contact by the players as the play is in progress, so be it. But for a waiting player with the ball to be barreled into ( as someone mentioned hockey charging penalty), is not what the fundamental aspect of the game is: avoid getting tagged. And while they're at it, ban the DH. Worst rule ever implemented.
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  20. #45

    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Yes - it's an unnecessary risk to player safety
    always reasonable

  21. #46
    Bazinga Hitman23's Avatar
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by 35Knucklecurve View Post
    It's split down the middle now and even that surprises me. How many rules have changed as a result of a devastating injury or death - in any sport? The NFL is fighting an uphill battle to cut down on players leading with the helmet and other potentially very harmful tactics. Former players are suing because they believe the league was aware of the devastating effects of repeated head trauma, but did nothing to try to prevent it. Here we have an opportunity to eliminate or cut down on the chance that a catcher or runner or both may be dealt a season-ending or career ending injury.....or worse. It doesn't make sense not to figure out a rule that would remove that chance. If Pete Rose had ended Ray Fosse's career when he steamrolled him in the All-Star game (a game that did not COUNT at that time), we may or may not be having this conversation because the technology and research were not available then. We have both now.
    That's my opinion. People continue to say it doesn't happen enough.... well then it wouldn't affect anything if it doesn't happen enough. And I don't want to wait until the worst happens. Just as recently as Posey's injury.... that sucked for baseball just losing him for a season. I don't want to see that again.
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  22. #47
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by RogerNatural View Post
    I am as old-school & a traditionalist as they come. But on this, there should be no difference at HP or any other base. Suddenly baseball becomes a football game? If there's contact by the players as the play is in progress, so be it. But for a waiting player with the ball to be barreled into ( as someone mentioned hockey charging penalty), is not what the fundamental aspect of the game is: avoid getting tagged. And while they're at it, ban the DH. Worst rule ever implemented.
    it is like any other base though, isn't it? If a defender is standing in front of first, second or third I thought the runner could barrel into them.

    I'm all for safety, but to me you can't have the defense parked firmly in front of a base blocking the route and ask a baserunner gassing it to put on the brakes or just slide into a brick wall. It just shifts the injury risk more so to the runner, the defender can still get injured and it gives the defense an unfair advantage. So the only option in my opinion to prevent home plate collisions would also involve calling defensive interference for catchers obstructing the route from third to home.

    It's tough. Of course player safety trumps fan perspective, but imagine if Montero stuck at catcher and came up mashing and got Poseyed in his sophomore year?

  23. #48
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by BronxYanks45 View Post
    collisions at home plate dont happen that often, its part of the game. You're catcher wants to avoid collisions, get his pitcher to throw strikes, plain and simple
    Actually, if you are a catcher and want to avoid collisions.....just don't block the plate. There does not need to be a rule change, leave it up to the players.

    Collisions at home plate are dictated by the catcher.
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  24. #49
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    why couldn't you make plays at home like plays at first, just make it a force play and not a tag one.

    and i don't care one way or the other, I am not a pro ball player and don't play myself anymore so no danger for me.

    I do get pissed when a yankee gets hurt on those plays that, then it seems silly but part of the game since baseball is not a contact game.

    however it is a risk they signed up for it, part of the game. You know there is a chance.

  25. #50
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    Re: Should collisions at home plate be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Gonzo View Post
    why couldn't you make plays at home like plays at first, just make it a force play and not a tag one.

    and i don't care one way or the other, I am not a pro ball player and don't play myself anymore so no danger for me.

    I do get pissed when a yankee gets hurt on those plays that, then it seems silly but part of the game since baseball is not a contact game.

    however it is a risk they signed up for it, part of the game. You know there is a chance.
    I thought about that. But you would have to complicate the rule so the defense could not force a runner ten feet down the line from third. You also might have injuries to runners trying to do full speed reverses at home if you just say they are allowed to return to third. Somehow you need a definition that "commits" the runner to try to score before you can safely force him or you will have to be able to force him as soon as he starts towards home.

    I think the best way is just to not allow blocking the plate. Call it the WWJPD rule. ("What Would Jorge Posada Do?")
    "Deep to left! Yastrzemski will not get it! It's a home run! A three-run homer by Bucky Dent! And the Yankees now lead by a score of 3-2!" - New York Yankees announcer Bill White (October 2, 1978)

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