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  1. #251
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeFan1421 View Post
    Do people realize that the Yankees Opening Day payroll this year will be their highest ever?

    We can quibble and say adjusted for inflation it's not. We can also point out that for the first time in 15 years they won't have the highest payroll in all of baseball, as the Dodgers will.

    But it's an interesting contrast. The Dodgers are said to be spending like crazy and acting like they have endless resources and that the Yankees are suddenly penny pinching...and yet LA's payroll this year will surpass the Yankees by about $5mm.

    Yes, the Yanks have relatively low levels of committment after 2013. But to say a team that is yet again having their highest payroll ever is suddenly acting like a small market...I don't get it.
    This point has been addressed again and again and again and again and again and again and again over the course of this thread. Perhaps the OP could and should have chosen a different title for this thread, in which case people might not take it in quite so literal, limited and concrete a fashion. If you're going to take it that way, then yes, you're correct, the Yankees are not literally planning to act in precisely the way that small-market teams generally act.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
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  2. #252
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    This point has been addressed again and again and again and again and again and again and again over the course of this thread. Perhaps the OP could and should have chosen a different title for this thread, in which case people might not take it in quite so literal, limited and concrete a fashion. If you're going to take it that way, then yes, you're correct, the Yankees are not literally planning to act in precisely the way that small-market teams generally act.
    Point well taken. If I had anticipated such literal reactions to the thread title, I might have phrased it differently.
    Yankee fan living in Maine.

  3. #253
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by apalradio View Post
    Don't forget Bobby Murcer and Roy White. And, of course, Mel was one of the best pitchers in the game for a while. But Pete Mikkelsen would make me cringe every time he came into the game. Or was that even before CBS came in and wrecked the franchise?
    Didn't mean to slight Murcer, White, Stottlemeyer or the plethora of other great players of the era (now catching, #41, Jake Gibbs).

    And Mikkelsen was at the start of those years.
    Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

  4. #254
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Think the debacle of the Alex Rodriguez contract has made the entire organization reconsider their previous method of operation. And it's why I think they won't resign Cano. There are probably a lot of memories of Alfonso Soriano's metldown in the 2003 postseason and comparsions being drawn with Cano's performance last October. And it's entirely appropriate.

    Further let's be blunt; Cano is pals with A-rod and Melky.The insinuations are out there, the inferences are being drawn and conclusions are being made. It may not be fair but these A-rod monthly revelations are are making it less likely the Yankees will give Cano (or anyone) a long term top dollar deal.

    The Steinbrenners and Cashman are done settingt he market. DOn't think it's them being cheap like the Mets. But they don't think how things worked under the George Steinbrenner is any way to do things going forward. They will still sign a no brainer free agent, but they won't overpay someone with question marks and lomng term deals with back ends with any player in their late 30s is not going to happen ever again.

    If Cano wants to be paid well for 4 or 5 years, he'll be a Yankee in 2014. If he wants 10 years he will go someplace else. And it will be someone else making a mistake.
    pitching, pitching and pitching

  5. #255

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugg View Post
    Think the debacle of the Alex Rodriguez contract has made the entire organization reconsider their previous method of operation. And it's why I think they won't resign Cano. There are probably a lot of memories of Alfonso Soriano's metldown in the 2003 postseason and comparsions being drawn with Cano's performance last October. And it's entirely appropriate.

    Further let's be blunt; Cano is pals with A-rod and Melky.The insinuations are out there, the inferences are being drawn and conclusions are being made. It may not be fair but these A-rod monthly revelations are are making it less likely the Yankees will give Cano (or anyone) a long term top dollar deal.

    The Steinbrenners and Cashman are done settingt he market. DOn't think it's them being cheap like the Mets. But they don't think how things worked under the George Steinbrenner is any way to do things going forward. They will still sign a no brainer free agent, but they won't overpay someone with question marks and lomng term deals with back ends with any player in their late 30s is not going to happen ever again.

    If Cano wants to be paid well for 4 or 5 years, he'll be a Yankee in 2014. If he wants 10 years he will go someplace else. And it will be someone else making a mistake.
    Yep.

    As you say, fair or not, the Yankees are weighing a lot of things....and I think this is going to be a turning point in baseball about long term contracts in the PED era.

    yanks can't afford two guys whose bodies disintegrate early amidst a cloud of PED suspicion...

  6. #256

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Any team that signs a 30/31 yr old to a 7+ year deal, at premium dollar, is making a mistake. Let another team make that mistake. Cano isn't signing a team friendly deal like Wright did with the Mets.

    If it was me, I'd have traded Cano and Granderson this off-season, because we're letting them both walk anyway, or at least should be. We could have rebuilt on the fly.

  7. #257
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Sabbathia View Post
    Any team that signs a 30/31 yr old to a 7+ year deal, at premium dollar, is making a mistake. Let another team make that mistake. Cano isn't signing a team friendly deal like Wright did with the Mets.
    Except that some teams are flush with cash and don't care about the money. The Yankees will easily be outbid in future years by the Dodgers and Angels, and quite possibly the Padres (!!). It's like the guy who just hits the jackpot at the casino and overspends 30% on a rolex in the casino mall. He doesn't care, it's free money and he wants that nice watch

  8. #258

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    It's not even about the money, it's about the fact you lock yourself into what will surely be a declining player

    A-Rod's contract is the worst in baseball. The contract the Angels gave Pujols was insane. I want no part of any deal like that.

    These longterm megadeals are a thing of the past. Teams lock up good players when they're young now, then they hit FA in their 30's, and someone else overpays. The Yankees problem is that they haven't had anybody good worth locking up in a while, other than Cano. They shouldn't compound that problem.

  9. #259
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
    Except that some teams are flush with cash and don't care about the money. The Yankees will easily be outbid in future years by the Dodgers and Angels, and quite possibly the Padres (!!). It's like the guy who just hits the jackpot at the casino and overspends 30% on a rolex in the casino mall. He doesn't care, it's free money and he wants that nice watch
    Quote Originally Posted by Black Sabbathia View Post
    It's not even about the money, it's about the fact you lock yourself into what will surely be a declining player

    A-Rod's contract is the worst in baseball. The contract the Angels gave Pujols was insane. I want no part of any deal like that.

    These longterm megadeals are a thing of the past. Teams lock up good players when they're young now, then they hit FA in their 30's, and someone else overpays. The Yankees problem is that they haven't had anybody good worth locking up in a while, other than Cano. They shouldn't compound that problem.
    I have to go with BS on this one. We've seen teams quickly jack up their payrolls in the past and regret it (Phillies and Red Sox come to mind), and I have no doubt that the Dodgers, in particular, are going to rue some of the moves they're making. I don't think it's going to be "free money" for the long term -- they'd just better hope they win before those contracts get into their later years.

    As for Cano, I think there's a decent chance he stays, but it fully depends on what teams are really willing to bid for him.
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

  10. #260

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Fan in Boston View Post
    I have to go with BS on this one. We've seen teams quickly jack up their payrolls in the past and regret it (Phillies and Red Sox come to mind), and I have no doubt that the Dodgers, in particular, are going to rue some of the moves they're making. I don't think it's going to be "free money" for the long term -- they'd just better hope they win before those contracts get into their later years.
    Nothing you said here is contrary to my point. The Phillies are a mess. The Red Sox are a mess, and somehow managed to pawn their bad contracts off on the Dodgers, who will suffer with Crawford and Gonzalez for years.

  11. #261

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmers' Helmet View Post
    I agree with Stick - until the A-Rod and Teixeira contracts elapse, the Yankees will likely continue to operate within the parameters Hal has put in place. This is Hal's team now, and by his own admission he is a finance-geek. Balance sheets and budgets are his forte.
    Capitalism's greatness owed very little to finance geeks. It owed a lot more to its entrepreneurial buccaneers.

  12. #262
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Sabbathia View Post
    Nothing you said here is contrary to my point. The Phillies are a mess. The Red Sox are a mess, and somehow managed to pawn their bad contracts off on the Dodgers, who will suffer with Crawford and Gonzalez for years.
    Yes, I was agreeing with you, BS
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

  13. #263

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugg View Post

    If Cano wants to be paid well for 4 or 5 years, he'll be a Yankee in 2014. If he wants 10 years he will go someplace else. And it will be someone else making a mistake.
    I'd like to think you are right but my sense is they will break the bank again for Cano.
    Plays the game the wrong way.

  14. #264
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bauer View Post
    Capitalism's greatness owed very little to finance geeks. It owed a lot more to its entrepreneurial buccaneers.
    Well said.
    Yankee fan living in Maine.

  15. #265
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    With respect to the team reportedly trying to coax Derrek Lee out of retirement to play first base, can this get much worse? Scouring the bargain bins is one thing, but this is now like picking through the trash. As a decades long fan of this team, it has been many years since the front office has shown such seeming indifference to its roster, and I'm just not getting the strong commitment to winning that's been such a hallmark for this proud organization. I truly hope this works out, but my expectations quite frankly are not that high.
    Yankee fan living in Maine.

  16. #266
    Don't call it a comeback False1's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by apalradio View Post
    With respect to the team reportedly trying to coax Derrek Lee out of retirement to play first base, can this get much worse? Scouring the bargain bins is one thing, but this is now like picking through the trash. As a decades long fan of this team, it has been many years since the front office has shown such seeming indifference to its roster, and I'm just not getting the strong commitment to winning that's been such a hallmark for this proud organization. I truly hope this works out, but my expectations quite frankly are not that high.
    Bringing it back to your opening post, what would you want a "big market" team to do in response to these injuries right now?

  17. #267

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by apalradio View Post
    With respect to the team reportedly trying to coax Derrek Lee out of retirement to play first base, can this get much worse? Scouring the bargain bins is one thing, but this is now like picking through the trash. As a decades long fan of this team, it has been many years since the front office has shown such seeming indifference to its roster, and I'm just not getting the strong commitment to winning that's been such a hallmark for this proud organization. I truly hope this works out, but my expectations quite frankly are not that high.
    by how much money would you like the Yankees to increase their payroll before you are convinced that they are committed to putting a competitive team on the field?

    This year they will open with their highest payroll in their history. They've increased their payroll by about $13mm from last opening day to this one, while their primary competition in recent years in the AL East, the Rays and Sox, have both reduced theirs.

    yes, the Blue Jays have increased dramatically and yet still will spend about $100mm less on players than the Yankees will. The Yanks will spend more than twice amount on players than the Orioles will.

    A $24mm a year first baseman is expected to be lost for about 6 weeks of the regular season. So they are supposed to go out and get another expensive player to replace him now? And then what are they supposed to do when Tex comes back?

  18. #268
    Hello dum-dum... effdamets's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Bringing it back to your opening post, what would you want a "big market" team to do in response to these injuries right now?
    Don't you know?
    The Yankees should trade Austin Romine and Manny Banuelos for Joey Votto.
    Should be no problem.
    The Yankees are entitled and EVERY other major league team is so trying to help the Yankees win more. (SMH)
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  19. #269
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeFan1421 View Post
    by how much money would you like the Yankees to increase their payroll before you are convinced that they are committed to putting a competitive team on the field?
    It's all about the % of revenue invested into the team. Dodgers are getting $350M/year in local TV rights. Yankees make twice the gate revenue as the Dodgers and the TV rights are worth a hell of a lot more than the $350M in LA. Yet the Yankees have the same payroll. Explain that one

  20. #270
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Bringing it back to your opening post, what would you want a "big market" team to do in response to these injuries right now?
    Their complete lack of depth wasn't a surprise. They could have addressed that before. It shouldn't have been that hard to find a decent fourth outfielder.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  21. #271
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Mike Francesa ripping them. Basically calling them cheap.

  22. #272

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Letting Dickerson go was a HUGEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE mistake.
    EvilEmpireDC: Fans bitch about anything lol

  23. #273

    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Ben Francisco on his way to the Yanks after getting cut by Cleveland.

  24. #274
    Don't call it a comeback False1's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Their complete lack of depth wasn't a surprise. They could have addressed that before. It shouldn't have been that hard to find a decent fourth outfielder.
    No argument there, but we're talking now about 1B. And really what i think you're referring to is a question of their prior strategy, which has provided a great run, and whether it is finally catching up to them. My question in the context of this thread is... At this point, what would a big market team do to replace Tex? I think a small market team would simply use whatever filler in the org that they could versus trying to coax someone out of retirement.

  25. #275
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Yankees planning to operate like a small market team?

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    No argument there, but we're talking now about 1B. And really what i think you're referring to is a question of their prior strategy, which has provided a great run, and whether it is finally catching up to them. My question in the context of this thread is... At this point, what would a big market team do to replace Tex? I think a small market team would simply use whatever filler in the org that they could versus trying to coax someone out of retirement.
    If they had done a better job with the bench - not just fourth outfielder but DH, backup infielder, bat off the bench - they would probably have better options to plug in at first or third.

    For that matter, I would have been much more inclined to try to sign Swisher. I don't think the contract he signed was excessively onerous.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
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