2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

[just-blaze]

10 game hit streak
sounds pretty good till you realize it's been 1 hit per game, 9 were singles (1hr) and zero walks

1 double and 1 homerun.

[CommerceComet]

It's kind of like when people say Gardner has HR power as well but only shows it during BP cause it isn't his game. It's funny because why wouldn't a player want to be able to hit a homer if he's capable? Not only does it help the team greatly by having a multi-threat player but it also can fatten that player's wallet by having another tool to bank on.

It's just their nice way of saying that he's incapable of doing so, and there's nothing wrong with that. Not everyone is a HR hitter.

The fact that major league pitchers don't throw 65-70 mph meatballs right down the middle of the plate might contribute to a player's inability to bring BP power to the game.

[just-blaze]

It's kind of like when people say Gardner has HR power as well but only shows it during BP cause it isn't his game. It's funny because why wouldn't a player want to be able to hit a homer if he's capable? Not only does it help the team greatly by having a multi-threat player but it also can fatten that player's wallet by having another tool to bank on.

It's just their nice way of saying that he's incapable of doing so, and there's nothing wrong with that. Not everyone is a HR hitter.

I believe it, his swing is all about upper body control with his legs out running before contact. If he were to stay back and drive with his hips/lower body he would probably hit for more power. Which he probably does in BP.

Not that I would advocate it, but since Safeco is where power goes to die, Ichiro might have the right approach.

All that being said, he's so little I imagine him trying to hit for power would have to be 25 HRs in his prime in a stadium like NYS.

[CommerceComet]

His home/away split is like night and day. Safeco is killing him.

Someone help me here - why would the stadium affect him so much? I could see it if he were a power hitter but since Ichiro is generally a slap-hitter, what difference would the stadium make? Is the infield so slow that ground balls that would normally get through the infield are being turned into outs? Just curious - it seems an odd fact without a decent explanation.

[Blazer]

Someone help me here - why would the stadium affect him so much? I could see it if he were a power hitter but since Ichiro is generally a slap-hitter, what difference would the stadium make? Is the infield so slow that ground balls that would normally get through the infield are being turned into outs? Just curious - it seems an odd fact without a decent explanation.

You're exactly right. His career home/road splits are virtually identical. Therefore his adjusted OPS+ is skewed by park factors that don't really come into play in his case.

Most overrated offensive player of all time, IMO. His career OPS is lower than Chuck Knoblauch's and just above Al Martin's. HOF, really?

[kan_t]

You're exactly right. His career home/road splits are virtually identical. Therefore his adjusted OPS+ is skewed by park factors that don't really come into play in his case.

Most overrated offensive player of all time, IMO. His career OPS is lower than Chuck Knoblauch's and just above Al Martin's. HOF, really?

Depends on how you rate his defense. If you like WAR, he should be a HOFer.

[Blazer]

Depends on how you rate his defense. If you like WAR, he should be a HOFer.

An offensive CF playing RF. Imagine how good Kenny Lofton's defensive WAR would have been if he had the luxury of insisting on playing RF. Basically, they're the same player with the exception of Lofton's competitive nature. I assure you Ichiro never broke up a DP in his entire career.

[Mr Coffee]

An offensive CF playing RF. Imagine how good Kenny Lofton's defensive WAR would have been if he had the luxury of insisting on playing RF. Basically, they're the same player with the exception of Lofton's competitive nature. I assure you Ichiro never broke up a DP in his entire career.

Kenny Lofton had 200 hits in a season once.

Ichiro did it 10 years in a row, including a record 262 in 2004. That year he had a .414 OBP.

He's clearly not the player he once was, but I don't think batting .350 twice (once at age 35) and .372 once and setting the record for hits in a season is anything to sneeze at. Also, he came over here at 27 when he already had 1278 hits and a career .353 avg. in Japan. Hell, if you add up his Japan and MLB totals, he's around 400 hits away from Pete Rose.

[justtxyank]

First of all, Kenny Lofton to me is a player who just misses the hall of fame cut off so being compared to him isn't an insult. That said, Ichiro is a better player. Walks are better than outs, but a hit is always better than a walk. I would definitely trade 20 or so walks a year for 40 or so hits.

Ichiro also had a significantly better arm than Kenny Lofton could ever dream of. Ichiro also didn't get to start his big league career until age 27.

Now, I don't think he's aging as gracefully as Lofton did, but again I stress that Kenny Lofton is an incredibly underrated player who was still productive at the end of his career. It's illogical to me to be honest that Lofton couldn't convince a team to give him a job for another year. He basically had a slightly below average few hundred at bats as a partime player his last year and got black listed.

[kan_t]

First of all, Kenny Lofton to me is a player who just misses the hall of fame cut off so being compared to him isn't an insult. That said, Ichiro is a better player. Walks are better than outs, but a hit is always better than a walk. I would definitely trade 20 or so walks a year for 40 or so hits.

Ichiro also had a significantly better arm than Kenny Lofton could ever dream of. Ichiro also didn't get to start his big league career until age 27.

Now, I don't think he's aging as gracefully as Lofton did, but again I stress that Kenny Lofton is an incredibly underrated player who was still productive at the end of his career. It's illogical to me to be honest that Lofton couldn't convince a team to give him a job for another year. He basically had a slightly below average few hundred at bats as a partime player his last year and got black listed.

Agreed.

[ajra21]

Lofton wasoodles lily good player. Ichiro was a great player. That said, Lofton's agreed OBP was higher than Ichrio's is right now. I also feel that Ichiro is one of those corner outfielders who would have been considered a very good centre fielder had he played the position.

[Shadoux101]

I don't think him being a HoF is even debatable.

You don't get gold gloves in the outfield for being the just the best RF'er, either. You have to show you're one of the three best which he did for 10 straight years on arrival.

[Mr Coffee]

Lofton wasoodles lily good player.

Please translate this for those of us who don't have crumpets for breakfast.

[ajra21]

Please translate this for those of us who don't have crumpets for breakfast.

****ing iPad autocorrect.

[Blazer]

Depends on how you rate his defense. If you like WAR, he should be a HOFer.

Dwight Evans says, "Hello."

[CommerceComet]

Most overrated offensive player of all time, IMO. His career OPS is lower than Chuck Knoblauch's and just above Al Martin's. HOF, really?

I agree that Ichiro was overrated - perhaps not the most overrated but overrated nonetheless. Ichiro was very good, just not as good as most people thought which is the definition of overrated.

BTW, I see that the Clipper's hit streak record is safe - whew, that was a close one. ;-)

[pleasepassthesoup]

****ing iPad autocorrect.

In what world is a program "correcting" something to say wasoodles?

[JL25and3]

In what world is a program "correcting" something to say wasoodles?

Wales.

[pleasepassthesoup]

Wales.

Fair enough, I suppose.

[EvanJ]

He tied a career-high with 5 RBI, which he last did on August 17, 2004 and also in 2003.

[grizy]

Ichiro! is first ballot HoFamer, no doubt about it.

I don't even know who blocked him in CF but his defensive stats in CF are pretty good too.

Why should OPS+'s lack of adjustments hurt Ichiro!'s case? Should we discount Jeter's too because he's good at hitting opp field to short porch? If anything, his ability to produce in an extreme pitcher's park should be a point for him, not against.

He's not exactly the greatest of all time but you cannot write a baseball history of the past 12 years and not dedicate a few pages, at least, to his accomplishments.

[Sam18]

Lol those are the softest 5 rbi I have ever seen.

[JL25and3]

Stupid Ichiro! and his 5 RBI prevented the Yankees from winning a 1-run game.

[fredgmuggs]

Stupid Ichiro! and his 5 RBI prevented the Yankees from winning a 1-run game.

I've been meaning to ask about something - what's with the exclamation mark after Ichiro?

[JL25and3]

I've been meaning to ask about something - what's with the exclamation mark after Ichiro?

It's always been there.