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  1. #76
    Brien "The Incident" just-blaze's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePinStripes View Post
    10 game hit streak
    sounds pretty good till you realize it's been 1 hit per game, 9 were singles (1hr) and zero walks
    1 double and 1 homerun.
    Fistpumping like a champion.

  2. #77
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jax Teller View Post
    It's kind of like when people say Gardner has HR power as well but only shows it during BP cause it isn't his game. It's funny because why wouldn't a player want to be able to hit a homer if he's capable? Not only does it help the team greatly by having a multi-threat player but it also can fatten that player's wallet by having another tool to bank on.

    It's just their nice way of saying that he's incapable of doing so, and there's nothing wrong with that. Not everyone is a HR hitter.
    The fact that major league pitchers don't throw 65-70 mph meatballs right down the middle of the plate might contribute to a player's inability to bring BP power to the game.

  3. #78
    Brien "The Incident" just-blaze's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jax Teller View Post
    It's kind of like when people say Gardner has HR power as well but only shows it during BP cause it isn't his game. It's funny because why wouldn't a player want to be able to hit a homer if he's capable? Not only does it help the team greatly by having a multi-threat player but it also can fatten that player's wallet by having another tool to bank on.

    It's just their nice way of saying that he's incapable of doing so, and there's nothing wrong with that. Not everyone is a HR hitter.
    I believe it, his swing is all about upper body control with his legs out running before contact. If he were to stay back and drive with his hips/lower body he would probably hit for more power. Which he probably does in BP.

    Not that I would advocate it, but since Safeco is where power goes to die, Ichiro might have the right approach.

    All that being said, he's so little I imagine him trying to hit for power would have to be 25 HRs in his prime in a stadium like NYS.
    Fistpumping like a champion.

  4. #79
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by madjack View Post
    His home/away split is like night and day. Safeco is killing him.
    Someone help me here - why would the stadium affect him so much? I could see it if he were a power hitter but since Ichiro is generally a slap-hitter, what difference would the stadium make? Is the infield so slow that ground balls that would normally get through the infield are being turned into outs? Just curious - it seems an odd fact without a decent explanation.

  5. #80

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by CommerceComet View Post
    Someone help me here - why would the stadium affect him so much? I could see it if he were a power hitter but since Ichiro is generally a slap-hitter, what difference would the stadium make? Is the infield so slow that ground balls that would normally get through the infield are being turned into outs? Just curious - it seems an odd fact without a decent explanation.
    You're exactly right. His career home/road splits are virtually identical. Therefore his adjusted OPS+ is skewed by park factors that don't really come into play in his case.

    Most overrated offensive player of all time, IMO. His career OPS is lower than Chuck Knoblauch's and just above Al Martin's. HOF, really?
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  6. #81
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Blazer View Post
    You're exactly right. His career home/road splits are virtually identical. Therefore his adjusted OPS+ is skewed by park factors that don't really come into play in his case.

    Most overrated offensive player of all time, IMO. His career OPS is lower than Chuck Knoblauch's and just above Al Martin's. HOF, really?
    Depends on how you rate his defense. If you like WAR, he should be a HOFer.

  7. #82

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by kan_t View Post
    Depends on how you rate his defense. If you like WAR, he should be a HOFer.
    An offensive CF playing RF. Imagine how good Kenny Lofton's defensive WAR would have been if he had the luxury of insisting on playing RF. Basically, they're the same player with the exception of Lofton's competitive nature. I assure you Ichiro never broke up a DP in his entire career.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  8. #83

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Blazer View Post
    An offensive CF playing RF. Imagine how good Kenny Lofton's defensive WAR would have been if he had the luxury of insisting on playing RF. Basically, they're the same player with the exception of Lofton's competitive nature. I assure you Ichiro never broke up a DP in his entire career.
    Kenny Lofton had 200 hits in a season once.

    Ichiro did it 10 years in a row, including a record 262 in 2004. That year he had a .414 OBP.

    He's clearly not the player he once was, but I don't think batting .350 twice (once at age 35) and .372 once and setting the record for hits in a season is anything to sneeze at. Also, he came over here at 27 when he already had 1278 hits and a career .353 avg. in Japan. Hell, if you add up his Japan and MLB totals, he's around 400 hits away from Pete Rose.
    27 World Championships
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  9. #84

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    First of all, Kenny Lofton to me is a player who just misses the hall of fame cut off so being compared to him isn't an insult. That said, Ichiro is a better player. Walks are better than outs, but a hit is always better than a walk. I would definitely trade 20 or so walks a year for 40 or so hits.

    Ichiro also had a significantly better arm than Kenny Lofton could ever dream of. Ichiro also didn't get to start his big league career until age 27.

    Now, I don't think he's aging as gracefully as Lofton did, but again I stress that Kenny Lofton is an incredibly underrated player who was still productive at the end of his career. It's illogical to me to be honest that Lofton couldn't convince a team to give him a job for another year. He basically had a slightly below average few hundred at bats as a partime player his last year and got black listed.

  10. #85
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by justtxyank View Post
    First of all, Kenny Lofton to me is a player who just misses the hall of fame cut off so being compared to him isn't an insult. That said, Ichiro is a better player. Walks are better than outs, but a hit is always better than a walk. I would definitely trade 20 or so walks a year for 40 or so hits.

    Ichiro also had a significantly better arm than Kenny Lofton could ever dream of. Ichiro also didn't get to start his big league career until age 27.

    Now, I don't think he's aging as gracefully as Lofton did, but again I stress that Kenny Lofton is an incredibly underrated player who was still productive at the end of his career. It's illogical to me to be honest that Lofton couldn't convince a team to give him a job for another year. He basically had a slightly below average few hundred at bats as a partime player his last year and got black listed.
    Agreed.

  11. #86
    time of my life ... ajra21's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Lofton wasoodles lily good player. Ichiro was a great player. That said, Lofton's agreed OBP was higher than Ichrio's is right now. I also feel that Ichiro is one of those corner outfielders who would have been considered a very good centre fielder had he played the position.
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    who made the rain come; Seagulls sing your hearts away;
    'Cause while the sinners sin, the children play ...

  12. #87

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    I don't think him being a HoF is even debatable.

    You don't get gold gloves in the outfield for being the just the best RF'er, either. You have to show you're one of the three best which he did for 10 straight years on arrival.
    You know they are not real pies, right?

    "I heard Jackie Bradley junior was already voted to the ASG....for the next three years." - NerfBall55 4/4/2013

  13. #88

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ajra21 View Post
    Lofton wasoodles lily good player.
    Please translate this for those of us who don't have crumpets for breakfast.
    27 World Championships
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  14. #89
    time of my life ... ajra21's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Coffee View Post
    Please translate this for those of us who don't have crumpets for breakfast.


    ****ing iPad autocorrect.

    Bring tea for the Tillerman; Steak for the son; Wine for the woman
    who made the rain come; Seagulls sing your hearts away;
    'Cause while the sinners sin, the children play ...

  15. #90

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by kan_t View Post
    Depends on how you rate his defense. If you like WAR, he should be a HOFer.
    Dwight Evans says, "Hello."
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  16. #91
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Blazer View Post
    Most overrated offensive player of all time, IMO. His career OPS is lower than Chuck Knoblauch's and just above Al Martin's. HOF, really?
    I agree that Ichiro was overrated - perhaps not the most overrated but overrated nonetheless. Ichiro was very good, just not as good as most people thought which is the definition of overrated.

    BTW, I see that the Clipper's hit streak record is safe - whew, that was a close one. ;-)

  17. #92

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ajra21 View Post


    ****ing iPad autocorrect.

    In what world is a program "correcting" something to say wasoodles?

  18. #93
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pleasepassthesoup View Post
    In what world is a program "correcting" something to say wasoodles?
    Wales.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  19. #94

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Wales.
    Fair enough, I suppose.

  20. #95
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    He tied a career-high with 5 RBI, which he last did on August 17, 2004 and also in 2003.

  21. #96

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Ichiro! is first ballot HoFamer, no doubt about it.

    I don't even know who blocked him in CF but his defensive stats in CF are pretty good too.

    Why should OPS+'s lack of adjustments hurt Ichiro!'s case? Should we discount Jeter's too because he's good at hitting opp field to short porch? If anything, his ability to produce in an extreme pitcher's park should be a point for him, not against.

    He's not exactly the greatest of all time but you cannot write a baseball history of the past 12 years and not dedicate a few pages, at least, to his accomplishments.

  22. #97
    NYYF Legend

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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Lol those are the softest 5 rbi I have ever seen.
    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Yeah, I'm definitely straight, but I might have made an exception for him.

  23. #98
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Stupid Ichiro! and his 5 RBI prevented the Yankees from winning a 1-run game.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  24. #99

    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Stupid Ichiro! and his 5 RBI prevented the Yankees from winning a 1-run game.
    I've been meaning to ask about something - what's with the exclamation mark after Ichiro?
    Success is getting what you want. Happiness is wanting what you get. ~ Dale Carnegie

  25. #100
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Ichiro Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by fredgmuggs View Post
    I've been meaning to ask about something - what's with the exclamation mark after Ichiro?
    It's always been there.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

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