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  1. #1
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    Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    A new beginning, looking forward to a full season of Kreider!










    (thread continued from http://forums.nyyfans.com/showthread...-season-thread)
    Last edited by GordonGecko; 07-30-12 at 12:16 PM.

  2. #2

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Replying to this in here since the thread was made...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyler Durden View Post
    I think this is a brilliant move by Philly.

    Either they get Weber without blowing up the current young core or he stays in Nashville, away from any Eastern Conference rivals.

    If they do get him, the cap space issue can easily be solved in 1 or 2 roster moves (trades, waivers, etc.).

    And as far as losing assets, I don't think 4 future 1st Round Picks is a drastic overpayment for a cost-controlled Shea Weber in his prime signed long-term.

    Its not just 4 first round picks though.

    It would be 4 first round picks+ the contract+ moves that you will need to make to get under the cap + losing other key pieces in the future+ having no cost controlled options to replace pieces lost.

    the 4 first rounders becomes a much bigger deal when you're locked into so many long term contracts. Short term, Timmonen's contract coming off the books will help, but what happens when Giroux, Schenn, SC are all due or raises? Who would off set the high contracts on the team?

    If this goes through, at least one, perhaps two of them won't be with the Flyers when they're due for a raise.

    I think the contract is fair. I think Holmgren is a douche for handing it out instead of trying to give up "fair" value for Weber (and when he gets fired in a few years, he'll have a tough time finding a job, you don't piss off the ol' boys club) but its not an over payment (money wise), Weber is a game changer on D.

    I wouldn't expect him to step into Philly and fix everything though. He won't be paired with Ryan Suter and Bryzaster is a huge fall off from Rinne.


    Nashville should match the contract and then trade him in a year or how ever long you have to wait to trade a player you just signed. They need pieces that can help them now, not 4 mid to late first rounders.

  3. #3
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    GO RANGERS!!!

    Looking forward to seeing this team build from last year!!
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  4. #4
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by CanoForPresident View Post
    Replying to this in here since the thread was made...




    Its not just 4 first round picks though.

    It would be 4 first round picks+ the contract+ moves that you will need to make to get under the cap + losing other key pieces in the future+ having no cost controlled options to replace pieces lost.
    4 first round picks stings a bit, but again, it's Shea Weber... in his prime... signed long-term on a relatively cap friendly deal.

    There are plenty of low cost veteran/role players available for short-term, cap friendly deals every year in the NHL.

    Why would Weber's contract prevent the Flyers from signing those types of players versus filling out the roster through the draft?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanoForPresident
    the 4 first rounders becomes a much bigger deal when you're locked into so many long term contracts. Short term, Timmonen's contract coming off the books will help, but what happens when Giroux, Schenn, SC are all due or raises? Who would off set the high contracts on the team?

    If this goes through, at least one, perhaps two of them won't be with the Flyers when they're due for a raise.
    Timonen, Briere and/or Hartnell could all be gone by then and they already unloaded JVR's contract when they traded for Luke Schenn.

    I doubt any of those 3 you mentioned leave if Philly still views them as 'core' players by that time.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanoForPresident
    I think the contract is fair. I think Holmgren is a douche for handing it out instead of trying to give up "fair" value for Weber (and when he gets fired in a few years, he'll have a tough time finding a job, you don't piss off the ol' boys club) but its not an over payment (money wise), Weber is a game changer on D.
    Nashville could have avoided this entire mess by signing Weber long-term before he hit RFA, so I have no sympathy for them.

    Also, I'm not entirely convinced that Holmgren didn't have some sort of gentlemen's agreement with Nashville before offer-sheeting Weber.

    I think you're just mad that this kills any possible Weber-to-NYR trades this offseason, if not longer.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanoForPresident
    I wouldn't expect him to step into Philly and fix everything though. He won't be paired with Ryan Suter and Bryzaster is a huge fall off from Rinne.
    Bryz is...well, Bryz.

    But adding Weber to Coburn, Grossman and 1 more year of Timonen isn't exactly an AHL blueline.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanoForPresident
    Nashville should match the contract and then trade him in a year or how ever long you have to wait to trade a player you just signed. They need pieces that can help them now, not 4 mid to late first rounders.
    This is why I think there was some sort of gentlemen's agreement between them. Match or don't match, Nashville makes out okay in either scenario by not losing Weber for nothing.
    28 in 2014

  5. #5

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyler Durden View Post

    4 first round picks stings a bit, but again, it's Shea Weber... in his prime... signed long-term on a relatively cap friendly deal.

    There are plenty of low cost veteran/role players available for short-term, cap friendly deals every year in the NHL.

    Why would Weber's contract prevent the Flyers from signing those types of players versus filling out the roster through the draft?
    Because those players will cost more money than you think. I don't think Hartnell is irreplaceable by a long stretch, but hes a tougher hole to plug than you'd think.

    IF this goes through, the Flyers are above the current cap set at 70.2. Not a big deal when you figure they can trade Voracek and Bourdon to keep the figure there, but what happens when the new CBA is agreed upon and the cap drops 4-6 mil with no compliance buyout?

    Who gets moved to clear space for next year?



    Timonen, Briere and/or Hartnell could all be gone by then and they already unloaded JVR's contract when they traded for Luke Schenn.

    I doubt any of those 3 you mentioned leave if Philly still views them as 'core' players by that time.
    With what cap space? None of those guys are going to take sweetheart deals (at least Giroux won't, the other two have more restrictions holding them back, but they make pretty big money on their elc's now with bonuses, a qualifying offer alone would be a nice chunk of change.)

    Briere is signed through for a longer term than any of those guys are on their current deals. Unless you figure the team can trade him, he'll be around. And again if you do, he'll be a tougher hole to plug than you'd expect, unless you're planning on running with a bunch of 40 year old vets past their last legs in the bottom six.


    Nashville could have avoided this entire mess by signing Weber long-term before he hit RFA, so I have no sympathy for them.

    Also, I'm not entirely convinced that Holmgren didn't have some sort of gentlemen's agreement with Nashville before offer-sheeting Weber.

    I think you're just mad that this kills any possible Weber-to-NYR trades this offseason, if not longer.


    I am. Seems to me that he got tired of waiting around or realized that he didn't have the chips to get it done (at least one that he was willing to give up) and made a move to try and force Poile's hand while reducing the market to just Philly.

    If you're right and they end up making a trade before this whole thing goes down, then it was a pretty smart move, but seeing as how Nashville has reacted to this whole thing it seems more likely that they were caught off guard.

    If that is the case, and they do match, there is no way they'll negotiate with Philly.

    I've never been a fan of offer sheets and its a douche maneuver when ever someone hands one out, regardless of who it is. I wouldn't be happy if the Rangers had done this either.



    Bryz is...well, Bryz.

    But adding Weber to Coburn, Grossman and 1 more year of Timonen isn't exactly an AHL blueline.
    Grossman sucks but there is no doubt that your blue line gets better. I'd actually be shocked if his offensive numbers didn't improve, but you underestimate how much Suter meant to Weber (and vice versa.)

    And again, when Timonen is done (figure he'll retire after this season or go somewhere else), who replaces him? Defensemen don't exactly go for nothing in the open market.

    This is why I think there was some sort of gentlemen's agreement between them. Match or don't match, Nashville makes out okay in either scenario by not losing Weber for nothing.
    We'll see, but it makes no sense.

    Why would Poile give away his right to start a bidding war for Weber?

  6. #6
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    This Webber thing means nothing.

    Webber will not propel the Rangers to win the Cup.
    He will not propel the Flyers to win the Cup.

    Flyers goaltending is too much of an issue.
    Rangers need scoring.

    Shea would be a GREAT addition to either team, but the cost of getting
    him is not worth where both teams are at right now.

    The Rangers and Flyers both have more immediate concerns then Shea Webber.

    This is all just a bunch of noise, that will mean very little come next May and June.
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  7. #7
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Sounds like Weber didn't want to be in Manhattan.

  8. #8

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Our location is killing us this off season, go figure.


    I had to read TT's post twice times to make sure I was seeing things and unless someone slipped acid into my water, hes actually pretty much spot on. Rangers have greater needs, Flyers still have Bryz and if they're ever forced into a situation where Luke Schenn is playing top 4 minutes, he will off set any of the good Weber brings.

    I do think Weber would have helped out PP big time and that in and of it self would be huge.

    Adding him to our D is more of a luxury than anything else though. Hes a much, much bigger need for Philly who is really putting all their eggs in the 2012-13 basket if this move goes through.

    If he does end up with the Flyers, I hope that the Preds either match and get a nice return for him, or don't since the Flyers would be cap ................ed and forced to make more difficult sacrifices. I fear they'll end up settling for a package of Voracek and crap.

    Holmgren is a dick for putting out the offer sheet though. Would love to see this blow up in his face.

  9. #9
    Let's go Rangers! RhodyYanksFan's Avatar
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    I dont get why the Rangers would go after Weber. Not once last year did I say "boy theRangers need more depth and skill on the blue line". This team's problem is scoring goals, not preventing goals. Yes Weber would help on the PP but notenough to justify his price.

  10. #10

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by RhodyYanksFan View Post
    I dont get why the Rangers would go after Weber. Not once last year did I say "boy theRangers need more depth and skill on the blue line". This team's problem is scoring goals, not preventing goals. Yes Weber would help on the PP but notenough to justify his price.
    I'd say they do, but they'd lose one of their top guys in a deal for Weber so it wouldn't really add to the depth.

    We need to be able to run 3 pairing on the ice during the playoffs, there were times in the devils series where we were playing 1.5.

    I would still really like to see this team make a run at Yandle or Boyle if they have the space to do so after acquiring a forward.

  11. #11
    Big Poppa dabomb2045's Avatar
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    So Weber wanted no part of living and playing in NYC.....at least we found that out now, and not after he signed a 14 year deal. Have fun playing in the "small market" that is Philly.

  12. #12
    Let's go Rangers! RhodyYanksFan's Avatar
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    So what is the plan to replace Gaborik's production for the first 2 1/2 months of the season?

  13. #13
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by RhodyYanksFan View Post
    So what is the plan to replace Gaborik's production for the first 2 1/2 months of the season?
    I would like an answer to this as well. Even when Gaborik comes back, we still have scoring issues. I really dont want to have to see us play the same exact style we had to play last year...its just too taxing on the team and I dont believe we can win a Cup playing that way for 82 reg season games plus another 20+ in the playoffs.

  14. #14
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by dabomb2045 View Post
    So Weber wanted no part of living and playing in NYC.....at least we found that out now, and not after he signed a 14 year deal. Have fun playing in the "small market" that is Philly.
    They're looking good........

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  15. #15

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by RhodyYanksFan View Post
    So what is the plan to replace Gaborik's production for the first 2 1/2 months of the season?
    Doan+Nash!

    I'm ................ing drunk but it makes sense to me, salary cap be damned!

    We'd be loading up for one year to try and win it all but I think it'd be worth it. We'd have to move Gaborik after the season to open up space to resign Steps and McDonagh but I go no problem with that.

    Go big or go home!

  16. #16

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Drunken Ideas= possible reality

    Know this: It isn’t either Doan or Nash for the Rangers. It is, on Sather’s Blueprint, Doan and Nash.
    Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_...#ixzz21N1IpES9

  17. #17
    Big Poppa dabomb2045's Avatar
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Sather can want Nash all he wants...but unless Howson stops smoking crack...its not gonna happen. Seeing as he's lasted this far in his dream world of asking for too much, I dont see him changing his ways and coming back to reality anytime soon.

  18. #18
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    I keep hearing that Stepan is a deal breaker for anyone. MDZ too.
    Why are these guys untouchable?
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  19. #19

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by JfromJersey View Post
    I keep hearing that Stepan is a deal breaker for anyone. MDZ too.
    Why are these guys untouchable?
    I don't think they're deal breakers for everyone, just for Nash.

    Would you deal your #2 center (who is under team control for another five seasons) for a winger with a 7.8 cap hit for the next year?

    Better yet, would you feel comfortable with Artem Anisimov as your second line center? I wouldn't even feel comfortable with him as our third line center. Wasn't signing Richards a no brainer because he gives up depth down the middle? Why the hell would we be looking to trade that way for anything less than a star player on a great contract?

    With out MDZ our D goes from a strength to a huge weakness. You can talk all you want about how great our top 3 is but our depth at the position killed us in the NJ series. Do you really want to subtract from that?

    Plus, 22 year old defensemen don't routinely put up 41 points in a season, especially on a team with a PP as bad as ours was. If you look at what UFA defensemen made on the market this summer, it makes even less sense.


    Its insane, after last season you'd figure a lot of Ranger wants would be very optimistic about the way things are going but they can pretty much be divided into three groups...

    1. The "I WANT NASH NAO!!1!" group
    2. The "WE DON"T NEED ANY UPGRADES!!! ANISIMOV IS UNTOUCHABLE!" group
    3. The sky is falling because we haven't made any significant trades/signings 23 days into July group.


    Group two is a little less annoying than the other 2, but just as delusional.

  20. #20

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Rangers have acquired Rick Nash. No Stepan, Mcdonagh or Kreider in the deal per dreger.

    Details to follow.

    Happy Mike?

  21. #21

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Nash to the Rangers all but done. Dreger is a very reliable source.

    http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/blog/ey...w-york-rangers

  22. #22

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Dreger is saying:

    "Dubinsky, Erixson and 1st believed to be 3 of 4 pieces included in Nash trade."

  23. #23

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Dubi, Anisimov, Erixon, 1st.

    I think we could have gotten him for less but SUCK it Howson, you could have gotten more for him at the deadline.


    Guess this means JT Miller will be centering out third line sometime this year.


    Now bring me Shane Doan.

  24. #24
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    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Looks like a steal, we got to keep MacD, Stepan, Kreider and Hagelin.

  25. #25

    Re: Let's Go NEW YORK RANGERS! 2012-2013

    Rangers also getting a 3rd round pick and a defensive prospect back from CLB.

    They have a second and four third round picks. I'm thinking they'll be able to move back into the first round if they want to.

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