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  1. #1551
    Legend DJ27's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmers' Helmet View Post
    With the Yankees stated goal of lowering payroll to $189 million, trading for Felix makes no sense. The cons outweigh the pros - not only are you trading two quality, cost-effective young starters (and weakening overall rotation depth), but it also means the chances of retaining Cano/Granderson become slim to none.

    That's much too steep a price to pay for any pitcher.
    I agree but my point is that if you can get him you change your goal.
    Speak softly but carry a big stick.

  2. #1552
    The Best Ever ! jnewmark's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    I dunno, I'm kinda disappointed. It seems like evry team in contention got some starting pitching except the Yanks. Did they even try ?
    What we can appreciate now is that the Yankees from 1996-2003 were even more extraordinary than we thought.

  3. #1553

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    I can't believe anybody had to even ask if McGehee was an upgrade on Pena.......I like Ramiro's defense but the guy is useless at the dish

    McGehee's produced a .807 OPS against lefties this season. .754 on his career. He's got some pop and plays a decent enough 3B. Good platoon partner for Chavez. I'm not expecting anything great out of him, but if he can give us a .750 OPS 2-3 games a week and pinch hitting he's an upgrade. And we basically got him for nothing. Low risk. For what this team needed right now he's a great addition.

    I'm glad Cashman didn't spend on more pitching

  4. #1554
    Released Outright
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by jnewmark View Post
    I dunno, I'm kinda disappointed. It seems like evry team in contention got some starting pitching except the Yanks. Did they even try ?
    Think rationally, brother.

  5. #1555

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Sabbathia View Post
    I can't believe anybody had to even ask if McGehee was an upgrade on Pena.......I like Ramiro's defense but the guy is useless at the dish

    McGehee's produced a .807 OPS against lefties this season. .754 on his career. He's got some pop and plays a decent enough 3B. Good platoon partner for Chavez. I'm not expecting anything great out of him, but if he can give us a .750 OPS 2-3 games a week and pinch hitting he's an upgrade. And we basically got him for nothing. Low risk. For what this team needed right now he's a great addition.

    I'm glad Cashman didn't spend on more pitching
    Nicely thought out and expressed. I didn't care for Nova tonight, but every pitcher bites the bit every now and then.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  6. #1556
    Get Off My Lawn. Maynerd's Avatar
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    Colorado Springs

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by JDPNYY View Post
    He's better than Miguel Cairo.
    If I recall correctly, you were a big fan of Cairo's, no?

    "But what people tend to forget...is that being a Yankee is as much about character as it is about performance; as much about who you are as what you do."
    - President Barack Obama

  7. #1557
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Jul 2006

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by Maynerd View Post
    If I recall correctly, you were a big fan of Cairo's, no?
    Wasn't everybody?
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  8. #1558

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by unfamous loser View Post
    Seattle's FO's [open] over-valuing of certain defensive metrics and their defense-usually-above-all strategy is partly what's led them into their current state of suck. they took something smart teams use in conjunction with other tools/goals and ran too much like the thickest poster on BTF would.

    but yes, Brendan Ryan is a master of run prevention. players with .258 wOBAs cut off a lot of possible runs scored for their teams.
    I thought Brendan Ryan's detractors might enjoy this:

    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...s_mendoza.html

  9. #1559
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    I thought Brendan Ryan's detractors might enjoy this:

    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...s_mendoza.html
    Did you write that article, and/or are you Mrs. Ryan?

  10. #1560

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    The Phils put Cliff Lee on waivers today

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/0...medium=twitter
    A wise man sees failure as progress
    A fool divorces his knowledge and misses the logic

  11. #1561
    NYYF Legend

    Yankee Tripper's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Did you write that article, and/or are you Mrs. Ryan?
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  12. #1562

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Did you write that article, and/or are you Mrs. Ryan?
    Uh ... no and no.

    Are you Brendan Ryan's jilted lover?


  13. #1563
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    Uh ... no and no.

    Are you Brendan Ryan's jilted lover?

    I'm not into dudes, especially ones with sub-.600 OPS. NTTAWWT

  14. #1564
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Jul 2006

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    I thought Brendan Ryan's detractors might enjoy this:

    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...s_mendoza.html
    "As I mentioned earlier today in a post imploring the Mariners not to trade Ryan and even to look at extending him multiple years, his offense has been better for some time now. It just takes a while to climb out of that sub-.200 range when you get off to such a poor start."

    This is true, in a sense. At the end of June, he was hitting .176/.283/.268, which is absolutely horrific. Since then he's been hitting .289/.325/.395, which is merely very bad. Also, his track record suggests that he's been hitting over his head for that period. He's 30 years old, and his career line is .249/.311/.334.

    But sure, go ahead, sign him to a multi-year contract.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  15. #1565

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    "As I mentioned earlier today in a post imploring the Mariners not to trade Ryan and even to look at extending him multiple years, his offense has been better for some time now. It just takes a while to climb out of that sub-.200 range when you get off to such a poor start."

    This is true, in a sense. At the end of June, he was hitting .176/.283/.268, which is absolutely horrific. Since then he's been hitting .289/.325/.395, which is merely very bad. Also, his track record suggests that he's been hitting over his head for that period. He's 30 years old, and his career line is .249/.311/.334.

    But sure, go ahead, sign him to a multi-year contract.
    I would note that the American League average for shortstops is .255/.306/.367 (and for all positions is .255/.321/.412).

  16. #1566
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    I would note that the American League average for shortstops is .255/.306/.367 (and for all positions is .255/.321/.412).
    But those averages are for this year right? They've decreased over the past couple of years, right? I don't think you can compare them to his career line. I think it's telling that his career OPS+ is 77
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

  17. #1567
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    I would note that the American League average for shortstops is .255/.306/.367 (and for all positions is .255/.321/.412).
    Let's be real Mrs. Ryan.

    He ranks 21st out of 25 ML SS with >300 PA this season with a 67 wRC+.

    Thirty days of the BABIP Gods smiling on him (.344 in July, which STILL only lead to a .709 OPS) doesn't change anything. Brendan Ryan is TERRIBLE offensively. It's ridiculous that you are not just owning up to that.

    How much his glove offsets his automatic out status is debatable, but let's not go even insinuating that the dude is league average offensively, even for a SS.

  18. #1568

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Fan in Boston View Post
    But those averages are for this year right? They've decreased over the past couple of years, right? I don't think you can compare them to his career line. I think it's telling that his career OPS+ is 77
    Those are American League averages for 2012 and, of course, I was responding to your assertion that ".289/.325/.395, which is merely very bad."

    Here are the American League and MLB averages for shortstops in recent years:

    American League
    2011 .266/.321/.387
    2010 .258/.312/.357
    2009 .274/.329/.391
    2008 .266/.319/.375

    MLB
    2012 .257/.309/.377
    2011 .263/.317/.380
    2010 .262/.319/.374
    2009 .271/.328/.393
    2008 .272/.327/.391

  19. #1569

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Let's be real Mrs. Ryan.

    He ranks 21st out of 25 ML SS with >300 PA this season with a 67 wRC+.

    Thirty days of the BABIP Gods smiling on him (.344 in July, which STILL only lead to a .709 OPS) doesn't change anything. Brendan Ryan is TERRIBLE offensively. It's ridiculous that you are not just owning up to that.

    How much his glove offsets his automatic out status is debatable, but let's not go even insinuating that the dude is league average offensively, even for a SS.
    Brendan Ryan is a well-below-average hitter and I've never contended otherwise. However, I did in fact dispute that ".289/.325/.395, ... is merely very bad."

  20. #1570
    NYYF Legend

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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    So Ryan's career line of .249/.311/.334 falls short on all counts. He's a really bad offensive player, there is really no debating that.

    His recent stretch while likely unsustainable would infact make him somewhat valuable given his glove as he would at least approximate average offensive production.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  21. #1571
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    Those are American League averages for 2012 and, of course, I was responding to your assertion that ".289/.325/.395, which is merely very bad."

    Here are the American League and MLB averages for shortstops in recent years:

    American League
    2011 .266/.321/.387
    2010 .258/.312/.357
    2009 .274/.329/.391
    2008 .266/.319/.375

    MLB
    2012 .257/.309/.377
    2011 .263/.317/.380
    2010 .262/.319/.374
    2009 .271/.328/.393
    2008 .272/.327/.391
    I don't think you were replying to my assertion, as this was my first post on this -- or are you saying that all us Yankee fans look alike to you?

    Regardless, the OPS+ numbers are pretty telling where he stacks up vs. his peers without needing to get into the individual lines.
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

  22. #1572

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Fan in Boston View Post
    I don't think you were replying to my assertion, as this was my first post on this -- or are you saying that all us Yankee fans look alike to you?

    Regardless, the OPS+ numbers are pretty telling where he stacks up vs. his peers without needing to get into the individual lines.
    My mistake ... I was responding to the post of JL25and3.

  23. #1573

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by portman7387 View Post
    The Phils put Cliff Lee on waivers today

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/0...medium=twitter
    This is relevant to my interest.

  24. #1574
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Jul 2006

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
    Brendan Ryan is a well-below-average hitter and I've never contended otherwise. However, I did in fact dispute that ".289/.325/.395, ... is merely very bad."
    Fair enough. For a ninth hitter with a good glove, that's not awful. It's also certainly not untradeable, and at age 30 shouldn't be considered for a multi-year contract.

    On top of that, it's one month when he's approximated league average. Nothing else in his career suggests that he's capable of maintaining that.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  25. #1575
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Jul 2006

    Re: 2012 Hot Stove/ Trade Rumors...

    Quote Originally Posted by ElReyDeLosReyes View Post
    This is relevant to my interest.
    Claim him, and the Phillies will undoubtedly just pull him back. Either that, or you get him and his monstrous contract for essentially nothing.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

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