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  1. #226

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldee5 View Post
    He should have lied under oath?
    Wow, just wow.
    Snitches get stitches dude.

  2. #227

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Pettitte deserves contempt for being a snitch, but Leyritz is yanksftw's boy.

    weird dude.

  3. #228
    NYYF Legend

    Eldee5's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Here's a link to Andy's news conference in Tampa today:
    http://web.yesnetwork.com/media/vide...y_20234777&v=3

  4. #229
    Yankee Stadium: 1923-2008 DiMaggio5CF's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldee5 View Post
    Here's a link to Andy's news conference in Tampa today:
    http://web.yesnetwork.com/media/vide...y_20234777&v=3
    YES won't stop showing this. I'm already getting sick of the Pettitte comeback story.
    27-Time World Champions

  5. #230

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by unfamous loser View Post
    Pettitte deserves contempt for being a snitch, but Leyritz is yanksftw's boy.

    weird dude.
    where i'm from, you share needle and secret with your boy. that's sacred, you don't break that trust. pettitte prolly did the right thing but he did Clemens dirty and you would have to think twice before telling him something in confidence

  6. #231

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by yanksftw View Post
    where i'm from, you share needle and secret with your boy. that's sacred, you don't break that trust. pettitte prolly did the right thing but he did Clemens dirty and you would have to think twice before telling him something in confidence
    Sounds like you live in a pretty sh!tty area.
    27 World Championships
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    Liberated France Twice

  7. #232
    Yankee Stadium: 1923-2008 DiMaggio5CF's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by yanksftw View Post
    where i'm from, you share needle and secret with your boy. that's sacred, you don't break that trust. pettitte prolly did the right thing but he did Clemens dirty and you would have to think twice before telling him something in confidence
    Please spare us the "street-cred tough-guy" routine. This debate has been had a thousand times on this board; no need to rehash it now.
    27-Time World Champions

  8. #233

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Last edited by Mr Coffee; 03-20-12 at 09:08 PM.
    27 World Championships
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    Liberated France Twice

  9. #234
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by yanksftw View Post
    where i'm from, you share needle and secret with your boy. that's sacred, you don't break that trust. pettitte prolly did the right thing but he did Clemens dirty and you would have to think twice before telling him something in confidence
    You share needles with boys?

  10. #235
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I would love to see four-man rotations come back.
    I've been saying that for years. It seems as though pitchers didn't have nearly as many elbow, shoulder, back, knee, etc. problems on 3 days rest. They're treated like your grandmother's fine china now and I think it does more harm than good. With all the advancements/changes in training (especially in the off-season), better equipment, more attention paid to nutrition and overall health, pitchers - any player - today should be able hold up even better than those who played 40 years ago.
    September 28, 2008 - the day the HOF got a wake-up Moose call.

  11. #236

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by DiMaggio5CF View Post
    Please spare us the "street-cred tough-guy" routine. This debate has been had a thousand times on this board; no need to rehash it now.
    whatever sense of social solidarity and duty that yanksftw is citing is no less or more ethically sound than the one many of the rest of you feel toward the collection of abstractions-&-douchebags-enacting-them that we call the law. both are equally ridiculous and yet important to people.
    like delv, but better

  12. #237
    Better than you teknetic's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by yanksftw View Post
    where i'm from, you share needle and secret with your boy. that's sacred, you don't break that trust. pettitte prolly did the right thing but he did Clemens dirty and you would have to think twice before telling him something in confidence
    Bug chasers are gross.

  13. #238

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by 35Knucklecurve View Post
    I've been saying that for years. It seems as though pitchers didn't have nearly as many elbow, shoulder, back, knee, etc. problems on 3 days rest. They're treated like your grandmother's fine china now and I think it does more harm than good. With all the advancements/changes in training (especially in the off-season), better equipment, more attention paid to nutrition and overall health, pitchers - any player - today should be able hold up even better than those who played 40 years ago.
    depends on which era serves as your reference comparison, today's pitchers throw harder. a 4 guy rotation is obviously more productive if everyone stays healthy, but there is a lot of risk trying to find out whether your guys are going to be healthy with 4 days instead of 5.
    always reasonable

  14. #239

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by SatchelPaigeYankee View Post
    whatever sense of social solidarity and duty that yanksftw is citing is no less or more ethically sound than the one many of the rest of you feel toward the collection of abstractions-&-douchebags-enacting-them that we call the law. both are equally ridiculous and yet important to people.
    Yeah, I should just be able to shoot people and take their stuff.

    Stupid laws.
    27 World Championships
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  15. #240

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    that's not really the point
    always reasonable

  16. #241

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Enlighten me, Yoda.
    27 World Championships
    40 AL Pennants
    Liberated France Twice

  17. #242

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    i don't really wanna
    always reasonable

  18. #243

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Then I don't know if you'll qualify for the participation ribbon given at the end of the thread.
    27 World Championships
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    Liberated France Twice

  19. #244

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Coffee View Post
    Enlighten me, Yoda.
    he's saying that all laws and customs are inherently culture bound and relativistic. There's no absolute code of conduct, everything is contingent on the group and society you affiliate with.

    and in this increasingly atomized world, to feel more confederation with this codified abstraction of social norms known as the law over the kinship of your friends and family is absurd.

  20. #245

    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by yanksftw View Post
    he's saying that all laws and customs are inherently culture bound and relativistic. There's no absolute code of conduct, everything is contingent on the group and society you affiliate with.

    and in this increasingly atomized world, to feel more confederation with this codified abstraction of social norms known as the law over the kinship of your friends and family is absurd.
    That's a pretty good argument.

    However in the case of Pettitte and Clemens, at the point where it came down to Pettitte possibly having to go to jail shouldn't Clemens have stepped up and gotten him off the hook? Loyalty should go both ways.
    27 World Championships
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    Liberated France Twice

  21. #246
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by awy View Post
    depends on which era serves as your reference comparison, today's pitchers throw harder. a 4 guy rotation is obviously more productive if everyone stays healthy, but there is a lot of risk trying to find out whether your guys are going to be healthy with 4 days instead of 5.
    I don't know what sort of work's been done on pitcher abuse recently, but the groundbreaking stuff came from Rany Jazayerli over at Baseball Prospectus 10 years or so ago. He felt that the danger came from high pitch counts, but that a four-man rotation did not really increase injury risk.

    The catch is that some organization has to start doing it throughout their system. I think a four-man rotation would work and have benefits, but you can't expect to do it precipitously at the ML level.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  22. #247
    Hello dum-dum... effdamets's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    If the strikezone were to open up again, from the letters to the knees, pitch counts would go down and the 4 man rotation would then be a viable option.
    But as long as the zone remains mid-thigh only, pitch counts will continue to soar.
    “Begin each day as if it were on purpose........”—Alex Hitchens

  23. #248
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by effdamets View Post
    If the strikezone were to open up again, from the letters to the knees, pitch counts would go down and the 4 man rotation would then be a viable option.
    But as long as the zone remains mid-thigh only, pitch counts will continue to soar.
    Pitch counts and rest days are separate issues. 120+ pitches is generally not good, and a pitcher's performance often suffers afterwards, especially if it happens repeatedly. But it's not clear that the extra day of rest makes much of a difference - the high pitch counts still have their effect.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  24. #249
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I don't know what sort of work's been done on pitcher abuse recently, but the groundbreaking stuff came from Rany Jazayerli over at Baseball Prospectus 10 years or so ago. He felt that the danger came from high pitch counts, but that a four-man rotation did not really increase injury risk.

    The catch is that some organization has to start doing it throughout their system. I think a four-man rotation would work and have benefits, but you can't expect to do it precipitously at the ML level.
    Quote Originally Posted by effdamets View Post
    If the strikezone were to open up again, from the letters to the knees, pitch counts would go down and the 4 man rotation would then be a viable option.
    But as long as the zone remains mid-thigh only, pitch counts will continue to soar.
    Good points here -- you'd have to "raise" pitchers that way to make the change. And I'd guess agents would be resistant for fear that the "experiment" would hurt pitchers before they could really cash in.

    Agree with Eff too -- there's more focus than ever on taking pitches, raising pitch counts, etc. now, which would definitely make it tougher.
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

  25. #250
    1931-2011 hellonewman's Avatar
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    Re: Andy Pettitte makes a comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by awy View Post
    depends on which era serves as your reference comparison, today's pitchers throw harder
    Is there any reliable data to support this? I remember reading in one of Bill James' books that he believes pitchers 50 years ago actually threw harder than today's.
    Hank 'N Hal's Country Club -- where accountability is soooo 1990s!

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