2012 Mark Teixeira Performance Thread

[awy]

actually my position on peds and sports is that, if you are to take professional sports at face value, then peds are okay. after all, you are taking enjoyment of modern day gladiators smashing each other's faces in, with each trained to the very best to do it.

that seems like a far bigger problem than people acting under professional pressure to take enhancements that are very risky to say the least. so if you are fine with the nature of competitive sports, then steroids is a natural conclusion and is no different from harsh training regimes, life shaping decisions made since childhood, etc etc.

i can both be for steroids in this case, and also be opposed to it because i don't like how extreme a spectacle like sports can carry.

i would have baseball as a community event and ban contact football. if you want to take roids to hit better in the sunday ballgame be my guest.


//back to the real world

i would not put stigma on past steroid users.
i will ban roids right now. not only in the majors but more strictly education and bans in the minors and other quasiprofessional prep places.
i will personally inject arod with whatever that makes him healthier.


i only mention roids because it gets people who care about roids for the 'purity of competition' riled up, when that's a morally bankrupt reason for not allowing roids. the correct position is that a professional sports that sacrifice athletes' futures is no longer pure, whether roids or not. it's harm prevention against the callous self righteousness of consumer athletics

[madjack]

For all we know, Tex could have been on steroids. His sharp decline the last few years has been suspicious.

[YankeeFan1421]

The idea I'm posting is that Giambi cheated and the crap you posted doesn't matter. He cheated, end of story.

So by that logic, Brosius was better than Arod because Arod cheated?

[YankeeFan1421]

For all we know, Tex could have been on steroids. His sharp decline the last few years has been suspicious.

I think I understand the context you mean this, but the statement itself is a little rough. Players often decline as they enter their 30's. Bill James has shown that peak years are generally earlier than people imagine.

I think it's fair to say that for all we know, ANY player could have or is on PED's, since we have no way to know they are not, but it's not really fair to single out any specific player (Tex or anybody else) just because he's not what he used to be or that his decline came sooner than expected.

[BennyTheJetRodriguez]

Nice dude. Notice how I didn't mention them? I just said the Giambi comparisons need to stop. They're BS because Giambi cheated. Tex didn't.

dont you think your Giambi vs Tex position is hypocritical given your Andy Pettitte hall of fame position? The HOF exists only to compare players to one another. As an admitted cheater, shouldn't Andy be kept out of the Hall?

[snapple]

dont you think your Giambi vs Tex position is hypocritical given your Andy Pettitte hall of fame position? The HOF exists only to compare players to one another. As an admitted cheater, shouldn't Andy be kept out of the Hall?

Apple, meet Orange.

[False1]

Apple, meet Orange.

It's actually a good point. You're completely ignoring a simple comparison of two players from a fan's perspective simply because one used steroids. Yet you're discounting Andy's HGH use in a conversation about his eligibility for enshrinement in the Hall of Fame? What happened to...

"He cheated. /end"

Where you buy produce, apples must sure look, taste and smell a lot like oranges.

[snapple]

No.

Comapring Giambi to Tex isn't fair because Tex didn't cheat.

Pettitte pitched during a time of cheaters. I'm not comparing Pettitte to CC/Cliff Lee, etc.

[awy]

giambi hitted in an era of cheating pitchers

[YankeeFan1421]

No.

Comapring Giambi to Tex isn't fair because Tex didn't cheat.

Pettitte pitched during a time of cheaters. I'm not comparing Pettitte to CC/Cliff Lee, etc.

So, who are you comparing Pettitte to when you say he belongs in the Hall of Fame?

I don't even think Pettitte is a HOF'er with or without PED's. but like Mike Francesa, I'm a hard markah.

But if clear Hall of Fame cases like Bonds are not voted in because of PED use, how can pettitte, who no matter where you fall on the debate is no better than a borderline case, be elected?

[BennyTheJetRodriguez]

No.

Comapring Giambi to Tex isn't fair because Tex didn't cheat.

Pettitte pitched during a time of cheaters. I'm not comparing Pettitte to CC/Cliff Lee, etc.

Na, it really just sounds like you like Andy and Tex, but dislike Giambi, which is somewhat typical for Yankee fans for some reason.

Andy Pettitte may have played against cheaters, but as stated so did Giambi. One of them was Andy Pettitte!

Andy Pettitte cheated and somebody like Jack Morris or Mike Mussina probably didn't, which is the exact reason you are saying Giambi vs Tex isn't fair

[snapple]

Bonds should be elected. I didn't say Pettitte should get in. I think he will, though.

[Tifoso]

Bonds should be elected. I didn't say Pettitte should get in. I think he will, though.

Even my Giants fan relatives don't think that Bonds should make the Hall.

[MunsonMattingly]

Don't forget he must be a huge liar for claiming that he did work on it but failed to fix it.

How did he work on it? He "tried" it for about a month earlier this year and blamed his poor start (same poor start he has every year) on it. This isn't the hitter we thought we were getting...

[snapple]

How did he work on it? He "tried" it for about a month earlier this year and blamed his poor start (same poor start he has every year) on it. This isn't the hitter we thought we were getting...

If it makes you feel better, he hit a couple the other way/up the middle during the post-season.

[snapple]

Even though the GG is a complete sham, it's still nice to add another one to your collection, eh Mark?

[flymick24]

did you cum?

[snapple]

did you cum?

what a silly question, especially coming from you

[awy]

snapple already expected it and for weeks has been breathlessly waiting the date of the award. snapple's excitement is such that he was too exhausted by the time the award was actually announced to maintain an erotically heightened state of physical performance

[sweet_lou_14]

Even my Giants fan relatives don't think that Bonds should make the Hall.

Anyone who has visited Cooperstown will know that the Hall of Fame itself is just one part of the building, the rest of which is a museum of the history of baseball. With this in mind, it's easier to defend the idea of keeping certain guys (Bonds, Rose, etc.) out of the Hall while still telling their stories in the museum. These guys are part of the history of the game and they shouldn't be forgotten any more than a villain of world history should be forgotten. That's not the same as saying those guys should be afforded a place of honor which is what the Hall is all about.

[awy]

i'm not saying anything because tifoso is nice and i dont want to be mean

[SatchelPaigeYankee]

Bonds 1) never tested positive and 2) was a HOFer before the 'roids

[Art Vanderlay]

Bonds 1) never tested positive and 2) was a HOFer before the 'roids

Since you seem to be in the know, please provide us with the date Bonds starting taking PEDs.

[SatchelPaigeYankee]

Since you seem to be in the know, please provide us with the date Bonds starting taking PEDs.

http://www.fangraphs.com/graphs/1109...8_20121003.png

he was 34 in 1999. the year after the HR record was twice broken by McGuire and Sosa. What do u think?

edited*

[Art Vanderlay]

he was 34 in 1999. the year after the HR record was twice broken by McGuire and Sosa. What do u think?

I have no idea when he started to use roids and neither do you.