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  1. #376

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    It certainly wasn't just Cashman. Anyone who followed baseball six years ago knows that Hughes was considered one of the very top pitching prospects in the game by just about everyone.

    It is sure frustrating. I guess I understand why people look for someone to blame.

  2. #377

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    I agree Hughes was once considered one of the best young pitchers in the game by teams other than the Yankees. It's amazing how Hughes got injured that night in Texas on pace to pitch a no hitter in one of his first couple outings and now look at him, what, 5 years later. I'm sure neither he or the team thought it would turn out like this. It stinks.

  3. #378
    First Name: Keninovich hardrain's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    I wonder where Hughes 2.50 is? I miss his posts.
    We toast to the old days and DiMaggio too,
    Billy Martin and Mantle, Whitey Ford and to you

  4. #379

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by 89FoxBody View Post
    Should have made the Johan trade.
    Except if that had happened, we would not have gotten CC, and we would have had to deal with Johan's arm injury, surgery, and extended absence. Our rotation would have been Freddy Krueger scary, and that is not to say good. Can you imagine a rotation last year of Nova-Hughes-Burnett-Colon-Garcia? Because that's what it likely would have been. And, for 2012 and beyond, instead of a rotation led by the durable CC, it would lack an ace and include Johan at big $$$$, and we would have to keep our fingers crossed every start that his arm didn't fall off.

    As much as I can't stand to watch Hughes start, I am glad that trade was not made.

  5. #380
    NYYF Legend

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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    What a brutal job by Hughes tonight and it looked like he had no clue where his pitches were going. 4 starts into the year and I don't think that Hughes has been able to hit his target twice in a row during a game. And even more disappointing, as bad as Hughes has been, I'm not sure that Garcia has been any better: and Pettitte can't replace both of them.

  6. #381
    NYYF MVP


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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Prospect fail, he won't be the first and he won't be the last. Hopefully he can transition back to the pen.

  7. #382

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by hardrain View Post
    I wonder where Hughes 2.50 is? I miss his posts.
    I miss them too, but he wasn't exactly treated kindly here. And his predictions have not panned out well.

    He posted in this thread at the start of the season expressing hope after Phil's promising spring training.

  8. #383
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    I read that today is the last day he can be optioned because tomorrow is the 5 year anniversary of being added to the 40 man roster. Is this true?

    If so send him down and give DJ Mitchell a shot.(2-1 3.13 era, .87 whip)



  9. #384
    Slow in, Fast out ThePinStripes's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Give he kid a chance!



    :::ugh::: when will this experiment end?
    A fool and his money can throw one heck of a party!

  10. #385
    Trade Bait Mr.Muhozi's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Donnybaseball72 View Post
    I read that today is the last day he can be optioned because tomorrow is the 5 year anniversary of being added to the 40 man roster. Is this true?

    If so send him down and give DJ Mitchell a shot.(2-1 3.13 era, .87 whip)


    This wouldn't be the worst of things as Phil could finally work on his secondary pitches as he really has nothing except for his fastball. But hell, I've defended Phil for a while but even I'm now warming up to the idea of him being in the bullpen.
    40 pitchers, ever, have an ERA+ of 130 or higher for their career. 15 have 140 or higher. 3 guys have 150 or higher - one is right at 150, the second place guy is at 154, and Mariano Rivera is at 205.

  11. #386
    The Best Ever ! jnewmark's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bomber999 View Post
    He's not the first high-end prospect who didn't pan out, and he will certainly not be the last. MLB history is littered with such players. It's time for the Yankees to rid themselves of the delusion that Phil Hughes will ever be a consistent and effective ML starter and accept the reality that his value to this team is as a bullpen arm or in a trade with a team that somehow thinks they can bring out untapped potential that really isn't there.
    The truth hurts , but this is it. Garcia is'nt much better.
    What we can appreciate now is that the Yankees from 1996-2003 were even more extraordinary than we thought.

  12. #387

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    A few years back I went to a Trenton game to see Phil Hughes pitch. He was pulled after 75 pitches due to some arbitrary pitch count. To illustrate how absurd that is, I have an 11 year old who pitches for his travel team. Does anyone want to guess his pitch limit? If you said 75 you would be correct. A short time after that game the Trenton manager expressed some reservations about the policy, he was immediatley fired. Is it any surprise that Hughes cannot go past 5 innings at the ML level and has never developed his secondary pitches? The organization does not have a good track record of developing/evaluating pitching. I don't know who the point person is for those evaluations, but something needs to change.

  13. #388
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Hey Phil, AJ Burnett called. He wants his lousy pitching back.
    Yankee fan living in Maine.

  14. #389

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Agreed. For all the babying done to Joba and Hughes, neither of them panned out after some initial great success in MLB. Meanwhile Darvish threw 120 pitches last night and Verlander threw 130 last week.
    "No matter who you vote for, the government always gets in." - Bill Hicks

    "Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand." - Leo Durocher

  15. #390
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by apalradio View Post
    Hey Phil, AJ Burnett called. He wants his lousy pitching back.
    AJ Burnett was awesome in his one start so far this year, and that's after getting plunked in the face.

  16. #391

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Its painful to watch because every at bat is pretty much the same sequence. He gets ahead of hitters, and then cant put them away because he has no out pitch. His arsenal is perfectly suited for the bullpen. He can probably get his fastball up around 95+ coming out of the pen which should generate a few more swings and misses on pitches that at the moment are getting fouled off or put in play at 92.

    One thing people wont be able to say about the yankees with Hughes if he is moved to the pen or even traded is that they were impatient with him. Hard to believe this is his 5th season already.
    If you listen to the fans you’ll be sitting with them soon enough.- Brian Cashman

  17. #392

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by 89FoxBody View Post
    Should have made the Johan trade.
    To be fair it's still a good non move.

  18. #393
    Big Poppa dabomb2045's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    I keep beating the same drum....and I do it because nothing changes. Hughes IS a reliever. He doesnt have the secondary stuff necessary to be a starter.

    End of story. Enough is enough...put him in the pen where he belongs and give Phelps or Mitchell a chance.

  19. #394

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Never understood why he doesn't try to develop a split or go back to his slider, it would probably complement his fastball better than the curve he throws
    His cutter is not a human pitch, even he says he does not know why it moves like it does, says "God does it." I believe him.

  20. #395

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by siddiqi View Post
    Never understood why he doesn't try to develop a split or go back to his slider, it would probably complement his fastball better than the curve he throws
    Please, this needs to stop. He is simply not a good starting pitcher. Whether the parameter is stuff, command, durability, stamina, or results. All poor. Cut losses and put him in the pen.

  21. #396
    The gerbil lives Zimmers' Helmet's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Art Vanderlay View Post
    A few years back I went to a Trenton game to see Phil Hughes pitch. He was pulled after 75 pitches due to some arbitrary pitch count. To illustrate how absurd that is, I have an 11 year old who pitches for his travel team. Does anyone want to guess his pitch limit? If you said 75 you would be correct. A short time after that game the Trenton manager expressed some reservations about the policy, he was immediatley fired. Is it any surprise that Hughes cannot go past 5 innings at the ML level and has never developed his secondary pitches? The organization does not have a good track record of developing/evaluating pitching. I don't know who the point person is for those evaluations, but something needs to change.
    Ah - the Nardi Contreras/Billy Connors philosophy.

    Funny how Nolan Ryan has seen far more success from his starters by doing the total opposite - he doesn't baby pitchers at all and instead encourages high innings totals.
    "Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever." - Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

  22. #397

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmers' Helmet View Post
    Ah - the Nardi Contreras/Billy Connors philosophy.

    Funny how Nolan Ryan has seen far more success from his starters by doing the total opposite - he doesn't baby pitchers at all and instead encourages high innings totals.
    We have yet to see how that's going to fare for their pitchers long term. He's only been implementing this philosophy for a couple years.

  23. #398

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    What the hell is this delivery by Huzzeeee?? I watched Sportcenter and was like WTF!!! Not the same delivery when he came up and was good....did Guidry get his hands on him!

  24. #399
    Devoted Member
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    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Looked like he was going with the curve tonight much more than in the past. I'm still holding out hope for Hughes and I don't see any better options.
    DFA ARod.

  25. #400

    Re: 2012 Phil Hughes Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by AuroraBomberalis View Post
    We have yet to see how that's going to fare for their pitchers long term. He's only been implementing this philosophy for a couple years.
    Yes, but they sure do crank out the pitchers over there now, eh?

    I've always felt that even with larry rothschild in the org, that the philosophies are all different and not implemented in a top-down fashion. Its like each level has a different way of doing things...

    I've never btw been a fan of pitch count babying. Thats not to say that i want the pitchers to pitch 150 pitches BUT how can u learn repetition (and hence imo command/control) if you keep getting restricted time and time again? It's like asking tiger woods to only swing a club 50 times a day. Yes, terrible analogy but you get the point: muscle memory is built on repetition. If the repetition is not there, mechanics and control/command suffers.

    I mean, it just seems like the under the radar pitchers dont get babied and in fact have the opportunity to learn their pitches - look at ipk, nova. Now it could be all bad luck but eventually a good organization will start self examining itself and try to make changes for the better. Hopefully the yankees will do that.

    And btw, a good point brought up by another blogger...could it be that phil simply doesnt know how to pitch? He doesnt pitch inside; rarely pitches low in the zone; and doesnt pitch down and away. It's like he's telegraphing where his pitches go...

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