2012 Alex Rodriguez Performance Thread

[Tifoso]

I don't know what class has to do with it. He decided he didn't want to play anymore, that's his choice. I think it's neither classy nor unclassy to have decided that. We don't know what the future holds with A-Rod, but if he's physically capable of continuing to play I don't think it would be unclassy for him to do so, nor do I think it would be classy for him to choose to instead retire.

He is misrepresented himself. He's made millions. The Yankees (and a needle, possibly) made him and his family multimillionaires for generations. To try, after all that, to squeeze the Yankees for more cash is classless. Now, if he can come back and be the good ARod, then things are different. I don't see that happening, TBH. If he stays, then I truly hope that I am wrong about that.

[JL25and3]

He is misrepresented himself. He's made millions. The Yankees (and a needle, possibly) made him and his family multimillionaires for generations. To try, after all that, to squeeze the Yankees for more cash is classless. Now, if he can come back and be the good ARod, then things are different. I don't see that happening, TBH. If he stays, then I truly hope that I am wrong about that.

He's not squeezing anyone for anything. He's not trying to get more money out of them, he's already got the contract and the money's already owed to him.

[Tifoso]

He's not squeezing anyone for anything. He's not trying to get more money out of them, he's already got the contract and the money's already owed to him.

By misrepresenting himself.

[Messerwhitescooter]

He heard you and is taking your advice:

Very funny. I don't see any evidence of PEDs in that picture. You?

[goin for 27]

In both those scenarios, A-rod retiring, the contract would be voided and the team would not collect insurance. There would be no incentive for them to settle anything because retirement is literally the 1 case where the contract gets voided.

The only way they collect the insurance money is if A-rod sits on the 60 day DL for 5 years.

Last point....Are you sure? I thought if he missed a full season, insurance kicks in for a specific amount.

[Jerkface]

Last point....Are you sure? I thought if he missed a full season, insurance kicks in for a specific amount.

They can make insurance claims on each season in which he misses the whole thing on the DL. So to get 85% of the 115 mil owed to A-rod, he would have to miss 5 seasons on the DL.

And it has to be a legitimate DL stint, not the Yankees trying to keep a healthy enough to get off the DL A-rod on it.

[Hitman23]

Someone really needed to dig up and post that photo again. I had forgotten about it up until now. Sigh.

[Tifoso]

http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseba...rged-1.4537899

[Abe Frohman]

It's all about the post-season, and there, A-Rod has been horrible, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF 2009. Since joining the Yankees, he has 54 post-season hits, and 59 K's.

Oh, 2009 ? You mean the year he carried this team to a championship ? You mean the only championship this team has to show for over a billion dollars of payroll spent in the last decade ?

Yeah, 2009.

The exception.

[grizy]

The few times, yes, multiple, I've met ARod he was far nicer to me than many other baseball players I've met.

[Jax Teller]

Oh, 2009 ? You mean the year he carried this team to a championship ? You mean the only championship this team has to show for over a billion dollars of payroll spent in the last decade ?

Yeah, 2009.

The exception.

He's saying that he was good in that postseason. You're misunderstanding him.

Although, I vehemently disagree with his notion that only your postseason numbers are what matters.

[goin for 27]

Francesa just reported that those "close to ARod" saying that he is working hard at rehabbing, and is looking forward to getting back on the field. This is going to be fascinating.....

[Tifoso]

The few times, yes, multiple, I've met ARod he was far nicer to me than many other baseball players I've met.

Wait. You're a hot chick?

[Abe Frohman]

He's saying that he was good in that postseason. You're misunderstanding him.

Although, I vehemently disagree with his notion that only your postseason numbers are what matters.

I gathered that much.

What bothers me is that regardless of what took place that postseason, how the man everyone always expected to fail, put this team on his back and carried them to the promised land ... is just not enough. Other worldly type of clutch hits, Bombs, Blasts.
Yet, to some people he somehow still hasnt done enough in the playoffs.

Gimme a damn break. The dude won us a championship. the only one to speak of in the last decade. A decade in which this team has basically gone out and signed atleast one of the top free agents in almost every offseason, Spent damn near a billion dollars in payroll, and year after year ended in utter disappointment.

Except 2009. Alex, CC Sabathia, and one amazing game from Matsui. But thats not good enough.

As far as the PED's, its unfortunate. Although, i feel like most professional athletes will subscribe to some kind of supplement that will give them a little extra or aid in recovery time. I hate to say it, but who knows what players used to do way back when ?

I remember hearing Willie May's once mention that he can't honestly say now that he would have said no to PED's back then. Greenie's were a staple in clubhouses before they were banned. Players popped them like skittles. Who can honestly say that players in those eras didnt take anything if they thought it'd make them play better ?

Its not like anyone was testing or anything.

Doesnt make what Alex or any other admitted PED user of this era is doing or was doing right, but i just feel Performance Enhancers of any kind or form are not something new that just got introduced to Baseball in the last 20 years.

Its probably been around a lot longer than that. There's nothing new under the sun.

[Big_E]

Oh, 2009 ? You mean the year he carried this team to a championship ? You mean the only championship this team has to show for over a billion dollars of payroll spent in the last decade ?

Yeah, 2009.

The exception.

and maybe his utter failures in some of the other years are why we don't have more championships...

[Mr Coffee]

and maybe his utter failures in some of the other years are why we don't have more championships...

And maybe without him they don't get to the postseason every year.

[Abe Frohman]

and maybe his utter failures in some of the other years are why we don't have more championships...

Oh, I forgot.

We're the Yankees. We're supposed to win a championship every single year. If not, the season was a flop.

Baseball is not a game based on failure. My bad.

[sweet_lou_14]

And maybe without him they don't get to the postseason every year.

Maybe not, but it's an enormous fallacy to remove him and his $20-30M salary and think the Yankees wouldn't have spent that money elsewhere on multiple players that could have provided comparable value.

I don't see why the Yankees might not have been "better" (measured purely on number of championships) from 2004-2012 without A-Rod. Let's face it, the only way to be worse would have been to go 0-for-9 instead of 1-for-9.

If I could turn back time, I'd love to see that alternate reality play out.

[Mr Coffee]

Maybe not, but it's an enormous fallacy to remove him and his $20-30M salary and think the Yankees wouldn't have spent that money elsewhere on multiple players that could have provided comparable value.

I don't see why the Yankees might not have been "better" (measured purely on number of championships) from 2004-2012 without A-Rod. Let's face it, the only way to be worse would have been to go 0-for-9 instead of 1-for-9.

If I could turn back time, I'd love to see that alternate reality play out.

It's not as if the Yankees were hamstrung by A-Rod's contract back then. If they wanted someone they went and got him--look at the 2008 offseason signings. So I think unless you can come up with a better hitter at third, the Yankees with him were as good as they were going to be.

[Abe Frohman]

It's not as if the Yankees were hamstrung by A-Rod's contract back then. If they wanted someone they went and got him--look at the 2008 offseason signings. So I think unless you can come up with a better hitter at third, the Yankees with him were as good as they were going to be.

Exactly.

Alex's contract never stopped the FO from signing anyone back then. Fans just can't see past the money, so they'll use it in any conversation involving Alex and his performance.

Similar to the way payroll does not equate to team success, The size of Alex's contract does not preclude him from failure.

[sweet_lou_14]

It's not as if the Yankees were hamstrung by A-Rod's contract back then. If they wanted someone they went and got him

This is simply not true. One obvious example right off the top of my head was when they didn't sign Carlos Beltran and cited budget as a reason. I'm sure I could go back and find pitchers they might have picked up over that span, as well, but I don't feel like going to all that trouble.

We're talking about hypotheticals so there is no way to prove anything one way or the other. But the Yankees should always be a better than even money bet to win one championship in nine years. The fact that they won one with A-Rod, even one to which he made such huge contributions, is not a very high bar to meet or exceed for this team with all its resources.

[Jerkface]

This is simply not true. One obvious example right off the top of my head was when they didn't sign Carlos Beltran and cited budget as a reason. I'm sure I could go back and find pitchers they might have picked up over that span, as well, but I don't feel like going to all that trouble.

We're talking about hypotheticals so there is no way to prove anything one way or the other. But the Yankees should always be a better than even money bet to win one championship in nine years. The fact that they won one with A-Rod, even one to which he made such huge contributions, is not a very high bar to meet or exceed for this team with all its resources.

Unless you're talking about Beltran last offseason, the reason they didn't sign him the first time is because of Randy Johnson. Which absolutely blew. How does one of the greatest hitters available want to be a Yankee so bad twice that he offers the team a discount and the team scorns him both times?

Asinine. Beltran should have been in our OF for the past 8 years.

[sweet_lou_14]

Unless you're talking about Beltran last offseason, the reason they didn't sign him the first time is because of Randy Johnson. Which absolutely blew. How does one of the greatest hitters available want to be a Yankee so bad twice that he offers the team a discount and the team scorns him both times?

Asinine. Beltran should have been in our OF for the past 8 years.

I am talking about 2005, and yes I remember that they got Johnson and not Beltran. I would call that a budget constraint and I am postulating, in the hypothetical no-A-Rod universe of my imagination, that the Yankees would have signed both.

[sweet_lou_14]

What the hell, while I'm making stuff up, what if they didn't get A-Rod in 2004 and instead made sure not to lose Andy Pettitte and/or Roger Clemens. You think that team gets past the Red Sox? I do.

[YankeeFan1421]

This is simply not true. One obvious example right off the top of my head was when they didn't sign Carlos Beltran and cited budget as a reason. I'm sure I could go back and find pitchers they might have picked up over that span, as well, but I don't feel like going to all that trouble.

We're talking about hypotheticals so there is no way to prove anything one way or the other. But the Yankees should always be a better than even money bet to win one championship in nine years. The fact that they won one with A-Rod, even one to which he made such huge contributions, is not a very high bar to meet or exceed for this team with all its resources.

This is exactly how people are mislead and say ARod's postseason performance in 2009 makes it all worth it. Obviously he was a major factor, the biggest factor, that postseason and they won. But he's been here 9 years and in 8 post seasons and most of those post seasons have been not only bad, but inexplicably and helplessly bad.

If the yankees had not signed Arod (or traded for him initially), they'd have had Alfonso Soriano for four years and $300million to reinvest elsewhere. Who knows what would have happened, but 1 ring in 9 years with that would have been okay, but not great considering they would have had their core four in their prime years and plenty of payroll flexibility to do other things.

Obviously it's tricky...none of us can say how other players would have performed here and ARod did win two MVP's and put up incredible numbers some of those years. But this idea that the Yankees would be 12 years without a ring if not for their committing a mind blowing amount of money to ARod is ridiculous.