2012 Michael Pineda Performance Thread

[JOBA RULES]

Pretty irate heah folks

[kan_t]

With the Cain deal, I'm guessing Lincecum hits the market in two years. He'll be 29.

Doubt it. Zito will come off their book by that time.

[Shadoux101]

No it ususally is not. And guys often come back from it just fine after a few weeks rest and a build up of arm strength.

But sometimes it is a precursor to a more serious shoulder injury that can be career changing or threatening. Now is not the time to panic on Pineda, but it is very reasonable to question if the injury is "just tendonitis" that will clear up "soon" or the start of a cycle of shoulder injuries leading to surgery down the road. Odds are good it is the former but you never know. especailly given the velocity drop that preceeded teh diagnosis.

As long as he gets in shape and fixes his motion his shoulder should be ok. The shoulder happened due to a bad mechanics.

[StaleMilk]

As long as he gets in shape and fixes his motion his shoulder should be ok. The shoulder happened due to a bad mechanics.

His poor mechanics lead to poor velocity and the desire to throw harder. I don't think we'll ever know for sure, but from everything I've read he most likely hurt his arm trying to overthrow the ball.

I agree with those of you who believe Cashman should have been more proactive in ensuring Pineda came to camp in shape/not 30 lbs overweight.

[MoVaughnEatsAlot]

Apparantly not Cole Hamels as rumor is he's closing in on a new deal with Philly (note not sure of his age so he may/may not fit the under 30 part).

I live in the Philly suburbs and listen to Philly sports radio all day and haven't heard one mention of this, in fact I hear just the opposite. Just wondering where you heard it?

Personally, I believed all long we'd land Hamels.

[Eldee5]

http://yankees.lhblogs.com/2012/04/0...houlder-rehab/

The Yankees will meet with Michael Pineda tomorrow to begin discussing a rehab schedule. Last season, Phil Hughes missed six months because of shoulder tendinitis. Is that a fair expectation for Pineda?

“I don’t think that at all,” general manager Brian Cashman said. “I don’t think they’re in the same category. I think there’s levels of inflammation in tendinitis and his is a nice light one. Hughes’ was much more significant.”

As for Pineda, neither Cashman nor Joe Girardi would estimate a return date, but it’s clear they don’t expect this injury to cost him significant time.

“Let’s get him going again, and then we’ll pace him after that,” Cashman said. “But it’s not a significant issue so, knock on wood.”

[YankeePride1967]

I live in the Philly suburbs and listen to Philly sports radio all day and haven't heard one mention of this, in fact I hear just the opposite. Just wondering where you heard it?

Personally, I believed all long we'd land Hamels.

I read after that talks broke off in early March. That being said I would be shocked if he reached the free agent market.

[Yankees1962]

http://yankees.lhblogs.com/2012/04/0...houlder-rehab/

Hughes didn't miss six months last season.

Also, I don't have any proof and this is just my uninformed opinion which means absolutely nothing, but I think Pineda's injury isn't serious at all. I think his mechanics are just screwed up and they need to get him back to where he was. Pineda coming into camp not in shape was his fault, but I don't think the Yankees have handled him well since acquiring him. Furthermore, I hope some of the pitching gurus the Yankees have on payroll are studying past video on Pineda. If not then that's something else I could blame them on them. Hell, it took David Cone an inning to realize something is off with Pineda's fastball.

[ieddyi]

Hughes didn't miss six months last season.

Also, I don't have any proof and this is just my uninformed opinion which means absolutely nothing, but I think Pineda's injury isn't serious at all. I think his mechanics are just screwed up and they need to get him back to where he was. Pineda coming into camp not in shape was his fault, but I don't think the Yankees have handled him well since acquiring him. Furthermore, I hope some of the pitching gurus the Yankees have on payroll are studying past video on Pineda. If not then that's something else I could blame them on them. Hell, it took David Cone an inning to realize something is off with Pineda's fastball.

I sure hope you're right.

I was thinking yesterday about Matt Clement- ex sawx pitcher.

He had a shoulder MRI- they found nothing and he continued pitching

When they finally shut him down and did surgery, they said it looked as though a grenade had gone off in his shoulder- damage to labrum and rotator cuff. He never made it back

Not saying their situations are similar, just that shoulder issues are tricky to dx and consequential

[DieHardYankeesFan732]

I sure hope you're right.

I was thinking yesterday about Matt Clement- ex sawx pitcher.

He had a shoulder MRI- they found nothing and he continued pitching

When they finally shut him down and did surgery, they said it looked as though a grenade had gone off in his shoulder- damage to labrum and rotator cuff. He never made it back

Not saying their situations are similar, just that shoulder issues are tricky to dx and consequential

The Yankees need to approach this carefully, there has been many pitchers who were diagnosed with tendinitis which eventually turned out to be something worse(labrum damage, torn rotator cuff, etc). I'm not saying that this is going to happen to Pineda, but the Yankees can't overlook this or rush anything.

[ieddyi]

His poor mechanics lead to poor velocity and the desire to throw harder. I don't think we'll ever know for sure, but from everything I've read he most likely hurt his arm trying to overthrow the ball.

I agree with those of you who believe Cashman should have been more proactive in ensuring Pineda came to camp in shape/not 30 lbs overweight.

The thing is, what lead to his poor mechanics?

I think it's more likely that he had a developing problem that affected his motion, not vice versa. Most of this type problem develops over a period of time. Given his lowered velocity and the unexplained cut on his FB, it's likely that the problem was affecting his motion before he felt any pain. The shoulder problem affected his arm angle- leading to the cut on the FB. The problem probably existed long before he felt any pain. That happens in many cases- the first symptom of a heart condition is often death ( a heart attack )

Michael been pitching for years- for him to lose his mechanics completely w/o any physical problem being involved isn't likely. You don't lose 6 or 7 ticks on the FB and start cutting the ball w/o any physical problem being involved

I think once the physical problems are dealt with, his mechanics will easy to get back on track

[pleasepassthesoup]

The thing is, what lead to his poor mechanics?

I think it's more likely that he had a developing problem that affected his motion, not vice versa. Most of this type problem develops over a period of time. Given his lowered velocity and the unexplained cut on his FB, it's likely that the problem was affecting his motion before he felt any pain. The shoulder problem affected his arm angle- leading to the cut on the FB. The problem probably existed long before he felt any pain. That happens in many cases- the first symptom of a heart condition is often death ( a heart attack )

Michael been pitching for years- for him to lose his mechanics completely w/o any physical problem being involved isn't likely. You don't lose 6 or 7 ticks on the FB and start cutting the ball w/o any physical problem being involved

I think once the physical problems are dealt with, his mechanics will easy to get back on track

Guys come back to spring training with messed up mechanics all the time from not having pitched competitively all winter. My guess is that being with a new organization probably lengthened the amount of time it took to correct the mechanical issues. since the Yanks aren't as familiar with him as the M's were.

[Snatch Catch]

Michael been pitching for years- for him to lose his mechanics completely w/o any physical problem being involved isn't likely.

Wow, I couldn't disagree more with this.

Young pitchers, especially mountainous ones, are prone to lose their mechanics for no reason at all.

I'm not discounting your theory in the least bit, but I definitely think you're way off base when you dismiss the idea that a young, giant-sized pitcher could very likely have mechanical trouble unrelated to an injury.

[Yankees1962]

Wow, I couldn't disagree more with this.

Young pitchers, especially mountainous ones, are prone to lose their mechanics for no reason at all.

I'm not discounting your theory in the least bit, but I definitely think you're way off base when you dismiss the idea that a young, giant-sized pitcher could very likely have mechanical trouble unrelated to an injury.

Right, a young pitcher overthrowing the ball in order to generate more velocity is not an unusual occurance.

[effdamets]

Wow, I couldn't disagree more with this.

Young pitchers, especially mountainous ones, are prone to lose their mechanics for no reason at all.

I'm not discounting your theory in the least bit, but I definitely think you're way off base when you dismiss the idea that a young, giant-sized pitcher could very likely have mechanical trouble unrelated to an injury.

Randy Johnson?

[Yankees1962]

Guys come back to spring training with messed up mechanics all the time from not having pitched competitively all winter. My guess is that being with a new organization probably lengthened the amount of time it took to correct the mechanical issues. since the Yanks aren't as familiar with him as the M's were.

On that part, I blame Cashman and his organization as they have a complete video library on Pineda and they should had some of their pitching gurus dissecting those videos. I hope that's what they're doing now and are formulating a plan to get him back to where he needs to be.

[Yankees1962]

Randy Johnson?

And Randy Johnson was a few years older than Pineda when he finally figured it out.

[Yankee Fan in Boston]

And Randy Johnson was a few years older than Pineda when he finally figured it out.

This is the kind of thing I think about when I see people giving up on Betances. Johnson didn't have a full season ERA+ over 110 until he was 29

[Yankees1962]

Tweets from Joel Sherman about Pineda and Rothschild. Looks like he try to muscle the ball for additional velocity and got his mechanics out of whack because of the lack of conditioning on his part. Out of the spotlight now, they should take their time in getting his conditioning up to par and straighten his mechanics out before he pitches in rehab games. IMO, I think they go past the normal rehab time to delay his arbitration clock this year. I can see them keeping him off the active 25 man roster until late May at the earliest.

Rothschild said Pineda felt no problems with shoulder.

Rothschild worked with Pineda staying more North-South, saying there were times got rotational last year as #Mariner too and ball cut.

Rothschild feels Pineda went East-West more this spring to compensate for shoulder weaknesses, feels with health/work Pineda will stay more true toward plate and regain his best fastball.

[Yankees1962]

This is the kind of thing I think about when I see people giving up on Betances. Johnson didn't have a full season ERA+ over 110 until he was 29

I don't know if Betances will figure it out or not, but RJ had a lot of time to develop. Besides being a college pitcher with USC before starting his pro career, he pitched over 400 innings in the minors with full years in A, AA and AAA before coming up and he still struggled the first 3-4 years in the majors. Let's remember that patience isn't a virtue for Yankee fans. They criticize the Yankees for not having any, but some of them need to look in the mirror in that regard.

[teknetic]

Tweets from Joel Sherman about Pineda and Rothschild. Looks like he try to muscle the ball for additional velocity and got his mechanics out of whack because of the lack of conditioning on his part. Out of the spotlight now, they should take their time in getting his conditioning up to par and straighten his mechanics out before he pitches in rehab games. IMO, I think they go past the normal rehab time to delay his arbitration clock this year. I can see them keeping him off the active 25 man roster until late May at the earliest.

Part of me wants to see how Eiland would have handled this.

[Jax Teller]

Mark Feinsand ‏ @BloggingBombers Brian Cashman said Michael Pineda made 25 throws on flat ground today. "No worries, no problem." No word on his next step, however.

[NelsonMuntz]

Tweets from Joel Sherman about Pineda and Rothschild. Looks like he try to muscle the ball for additional velocity and got his mechanics out of whack because of the lack of conditioning on his part. Out of the spotlight now, they should take their time in getting his conditioning up to par and straighten his mechanics out before he pitches in rehab games. IMO, I think they go past the normal rehab time to delay his arbitration clock this year. I can see them keeping him off the active 25 man roster until late May at the earliest.

Good news all around. Assuming there truly is no physical problem, and that Freddy can hold his own for a few weeks, this might turn out to be a blessing in disguise. Get him back in shape, straighten out his mechanics, and delay his arbitration clock. Then ease him back into the rotation without the added spotlight of opening week.

[pleasepassthesoup]

Good news all around. Assuming there truly is no physical problem, and that Freddy can hold his own for a few weeks, this might turn out to be a blessing in disguise. Get him back in shape, straighten out his mechanics, and delay his arbitration clock. Then ease him back into the rotation without the added spotlight of opening week.

And, hopefully, showcase Freddy for a trade.

[Snatch Catch]

I keep seeing refrences to his arb clock being stalled. I didn't think the DL stopped it as long as he was on the ML roster. Is there something I'm missing?