The Red Sox Thread

[Bronson'sCornrows]

It'll be fascinating for sure to see what scandalous stories will suddenly come to light once Ortiz gets the unceremonious heave-ho from the Red Sox.

It'll also be very interesting to see how the media reacts to it as they love their "teddy bear".

The media isn't going to give a ................. Their loyalty only lies with Ortiz so long as he continues to agree to talk to them regularly and as long as the fanbase a whole loves him. As soon as he leaves, that group of bottomfeeding leeches will have absolutely no issue plunging the knife between David's shoulder blades as many times as it takes to get that new swimming pool, provided the FO leaks anything they can use.

Francona was beloved here as well and, to a large extent, still is. He was also very open and engaging with the media. You saw what they did to him. Unless the people up top decide to keep their mouths shut, Ortiz won't be any different.

You always have to remember something about the media; their only interest is generating interest. Whether that interest is positive or negative doesn't really matter. As long as people are reading their hackneyed articles, watching their mundane TV shows, or listening to their mind numbing radio talk, they are getting exactly what they want. The sports media, as a whole, isn't any better than the rest of the media in this country; they feed off of negativity, heavy bias, and deliberate attempts to manipulate and misrepresent information.

There are exceptions to this rule in every medium from print to web to radio to TV, but generally holds true. Props to the guys who really try to digest information and disseminate back to the public in a fair and neutral way. The MLBN guys are a good example of some of the relatively few good guys.

[ieddyi]

Any changes in your opinion on Bard based on recent outings?

More BB's than K's and reduced velocity

[YankeePride1967]

Any changes in your opinion on Bard based on recent outings?

More BB's than K's and reduced velocity

And a strikeout pitcher with 9 K's in his last 30 innings pitched.

[hongchihkuo]

Great diving catch by Che-Hsuan Lin! Game saver against the Orioles!

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=21694363

[Bronson'sCornrows]

Any changes in your opinion on Bard based on recent outings?

More BB's than K's and reduced velocity

It's discouraging for sure, but hasn't really changed my opinion much, considering how little I was expecting out of him in the first place. He's doing a pretty good job of roughing it through some outings where he just doesn't have good FB control. Slider is there, change is there for the most part. He just needs to work on his control and that's something that might take a lot of time and work. I'm okay with the struggles in the meanwhile.

Part of my acceptance lies in the fact that there aren't any better options, anyway. Bard's ERA+ after today's game is close to league average, as bad as some of his peripherals are. As long as he's better than replacement level, I'll remain content. Obviously this changes a lot if the Sox are in serious contention down the stretch, Bard is still struggling with control issues, and a better starter becomes available on the trade market.

[TommyK8]

This is an issue for which I would LOVE to be dead wrong. I would have no problem coming back here three months from now and telling BC he was right and look at what a good decision Bard to the rotation has been.

But I don't think it's going to happen. Bard didn't throw 1 pitch over 92 mph after the third inning, and was putting up a bunch of 90 and 91's. He struck out only 2 and he walked 4 again. The command is not there, the movement is not there. At best, he's going through a dead arm period. At worst, a DL stint is right around the corner. Remember how Pineda pitched in Spring Training? This is what Bard is reminding me of right now.

I was ok with trying this out, and I was hoping for the best. When I see someone like Bard with 9 K's in his last 30 innings, something is wrong. I hope it's not an elbow or shoulder. The folks on SOSH have all kinds of statistical analyses and charts and it depicts a pretty ugly situation. At this point, I just don't want to see Bard get hurt.

The Red Sox do have options. I know Padilla has been good in the bullpen, but he could easily go back to the rotation. Andrew Miller could go to the rotation. Dice-K is on another rehab, and eventually he will return. Bard is a young pitcher, I think they have to be very careful here.

Moving past that, the Red Sox have to be happy with the way they played on this road trip. It's not just 5-3, but the way those wins and losses lined up....Loss to Tampa Bay, came back the next night and split the series....loss in the opener in Philly, came back and took the next two to take the series.....win in Baltimore followed by a loss, came back to take the rubber game. I don't know how long they can hang in there with the likes of Nava and Podsednik in the lineup everyday, but the last couple weeks things have been looking better.....starting pitching makes everything look better.

[Bronson'sCornrows]

The Red Sox do have options. I know Padilla has been good in the bullpen, but he could easily go back to the rotation. Andrew Miller could go to the rotation. Dice-K is on another rehab, and eventually he will return. Bard is a young pitcher, I think they have to be very careful here.

We might have "options" in the purest sense of the word, but we don't have better options. Padilla hasn't been good in the bullpen. He's been solid the past couple of weeks and downright bad for the balance of the season thus far. I don't think he's going to get any better if we slot him into the rotation. Andrew Miller has had the exact same problems trying to start games that Bard is going through now, only his record of having those problems is a lot longer. Dice-K just ran into a strained trap on his throwing shoulder (a recurring issue) and isn't projected to come up soon.

The organization has a lot more invested in Bard's success than you or I do. I'm inclined to believe they'd pull the plug on him in a second if they honestly thought his health were at risk here. They clearly don't believe that right now.

Everybody who has thus far weighed in on our little discussion has agreed that Bard's current struggles are the least of our worries right now. I'm still not sure why you still insist on focusing on this one comparatively small area of concern right now. As long as you're gonna, though, it would be nice if you'd at least stop pretending you don't really care. You've made it very obvious that you care quite strongly.

Moving past that, the Red Sox have to be happy with the way they played on this road trip. It's not just 5-3, but the way those wins and losses lined up....Loss to Tampa Bay, came back the next night and split the series....loss in the opener in Philly, came back and took the next two to take the series.....win in Baltimore followed by a loss, came back to take the rubber game. I don't know how long they can hang in there with the likes of Nava and Podsednik in the lineup everyday, but the last couple weeks things have been looking better.....starting pitching makes everything look better.

Agreed. 10-3 over our last 13 games with the day off Thursday leaves us in a good position to turn things around a bit. It will be interesting, though perhaps not in a fun way, to see just how long we can continue to run Nava, Byrd, Scotty Pods, and Lin out there and continue to win. It's tough to be optimistic, but we've squeezed more success out of worse guys for longer before. Who knows? Adrian in right/left might be the best way to go for a little while. He hasn't been nearly as embarrassing as, say, Youkilis or Millar during our previous times of need.

[teknetic]

Great diving catch by Che-Hsuan Lin! Game saver against the Orioles!

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=21694363

I'm intrigued. Have you ever made a post on this forum that hasn't involved naming an Asian player? Like, ever?

I don't have a problem with it, it's just weird in a maddening sort of way.

[sweet_lou_14]

I'm intrigued. Have you ever made a post on this forum that hasn't involved naming an Asian player? Like, ever?

I don't have a problem with it, it's just weird in a maddening sort of way.

I agree, it's odd. Being Italian I'm always happy when a paisano does well, but that doesn't make it newsworthy and I can't imagine mounting a one-man campaign to promote the most trivial accomplishments of Italian ballplayers.

[JL25and3]

I agree, it's odd. Being Italian I'm always happy when a paisano does well, but that doesn't make it newsworthy and I can't imagine mounting a one-man campaign to promote the most trivial accomplishments of Italian ballplayers.

There's another Lou who might disagree.

[Black Sabbathia]

The media isn't going to give a ................. Their loyalty only lies with Ortiz so long as he continues to agree to talk to them regularly and as long as the fanbase a whole loves him. As soon as he leaves, that group of bottomfeeding leeches will have absolutely no issue plunging the knife between David's shoulder blades as many times as it takes to get that new swimming pool, provided the FO leaks anything they can use.

Francona was beloved here as well and, to a large extent, still is. He was also very open and engaging with the media. You saw what they did to him. Unless the people up top decide to keep their mouths shut, Ortiz won't be any different.

Prior to Francona the media and fanbase turned on Clemens and Manny pretty viciously. Granted they were both pricks, but as soon as they outlived their usefulness they were cast aside like garbage. I can absolutely see the same thing happening to Ortiz, and it's already been happening with Youkilis and Beckett

On another note, I'm curious how people feel about the Reddick for Bailey trade now. Obviously Bailey with his injury has been a bust, but Reddick has been mashing in Oakland. Looks like an absolute steal for the A's so far.

[TommyK8]

Reddick has been a nice surprise with 11 HR's thus far for Oakland. However, Ryan Sweeney has done a fine job for the Red Sox and with the injuries they've had thus far, I don't know where they would be without him. Bailey is going to be back, and think once he is, that trade is not going to look one-sided.

[Mr Coffee]

Reddick has been a nice surprise with 11 HR's thus far for Oakland. However, Ryan Sweeney has done a fine job for the Red Sox and with the injuries they've had thus far, I don't know where they would be without him. Bailey is going to be back, and think once he is, that trade is not going to look one-sided.

Last place?

[Bronson'sCornrows]

Prior to Francona the media and fanbase turned on Clemens and Manny pretty viciously. Granted they were both pricks, but as soon as they outlived their usefulness they were cast aside like garbage. I can absolutely see the same thing happening to Ortiz, and it's already been happening with Youkilis and Beckett

I'm totally cool with the fanbase turning on guys who were total dicks as soon as their usefulness is over. Hence, ................ Manny and Clemens. I'm sure I'll feel the same way about Beckett if he decides to leave on bad terms, too. I don't group Youk in the same category. If anything, he's a total gamer who has been unfairly maligned by Bobby V and a bunch of imbeciles who are prematurely jumping on the Middlebrooks bandwagon.

On another note, I'm curious how people feel about the Reddick for Bailey trade now. Obviously Bailey with his injury has been a bust, but Reddick has been mashing in Oakland. Looks like an absolute steal for the A's so far.

Agree with Tommy here. We've gotten some valuable production out of Sweeney and Bailey might still contribute something of value this season. At the moment I'm ambivalent to the trade. Feel free to ask me again at the end of the season.

[Blazer]

I'm intrigued. Have you ever made a post on this forum that hasn't involved naming an Asian player? Like, ever?

I don't have a problem with it, it's just weird in a maddening sort of way.

Sorry, I don't understand your fascination with another fan's fascination with Asian players.

Have you ever been to Asia? It's great food, friendly people, no crime, and did I mention friendly people. Also, I'm tall there.

[Mr Coffee]

Have you ever been to Asia? It's great food, friendly people, no crime, and did I mention friendly people. Also, I'm tall there.

Asia is a pretty big place to be throwing around generalizations like that.

[Blazer]

Asia is a pretty big place to be throwing around generalizations like that.

In some ways I agree, but one needs to live there before they really know. I lived there for 5+ years in different countries.

Do not Thai, Chinese, Korean, and Japanese restaurants dot the map everywhere?

[Yanksfanintoronto]

In some ways I agree, but one needs to live there before they really know. I lived there for 5+ years in different countries.

Do not Thai, Chinese, Korean, and Japanese restaurants dot the map everywhere?

Agreed....Ive lived there before and Im moving back there in a few days...its impossible to explain why that place is so special to people here. Only frustration will lie in the fact that I'll have to miss a few Yankee games until I get a strong internet connection. Nationally televised Yankee games on ESPN at 5 am will be a boon.

On a Red Sox related note....I did not watch that game tonight but why did they decided to retaliate against Luke Scott all of a sudden when they had 6 games against them already???? I mean, I get that its probably based around his comments about Fenway but why now???

[Blazer]

Agreed....Ive lived there before and Im moving back there in a few days...its impossible to explain why that place is so special to people here. Only frustration will lie in the fact that I'll have to miss a few Yankee games until I get a strong internet connection. Nationally televised Yankee games on ESPN at 5 am will be a boon.

On a Red Sox related note....I did not watch that game tonight but why did they decided to retaliate against Luke Scott all of a sudden when they had 6 games against them already???? I mean, I get that its probably based around his comments about Fenway but why now???

Thanks YFIT. Hope you have a great time there. First shout's on me if we cross paths. My next trip is to Kunming, China soon to check out the "Spring City".

[kan_t]

Agreed....Ive lived there before and Im moving back there in a few days...its impossible to explain why that place is so special to people here. Only frustration will lie in the fact that I'll have to miss a few Yankee games until I get a strong internet connection. Nationally televised Yankee games on ESPN at 5 am will be a boon.

Where are you moving to?

[Yanksfanintoronto]

Thanks YFIT. Hope you have a great time there. First shout's on me if we cross paths. My next trip is to Kunming, China soon to check out the "Spring City".

Where are you moving to?

Im moving to India....Bombay initially...love it here but there isn't much career scope so I decided to give the east a shot....a ton of potential there!!! Thanks Blazer...really appreciate the good wishes...Kunming seems unbelievable....The Stone forest looks like its straight out of a movie!!!

Where are you guys located???

[Meecham4ever]

Bobby Valentine gives fair warning - bad mouthing Red Sox fans and Fenway Park will not be tolerated.

Bobby Valentine said that "boys will be boys" when asked to describe what happened in the ninth inning of the Red Sox' 7-4 loss to the Rays at Fenway Park Friday night. Franklin Morales drilled Tampa designated hitter Luke Scott with a pitch in the top of the ninth after nearly missing him earlier in the at-bat, causing both benches to clear.
Valentine also mentioned Luke's past words about Fenway and the Red Sox fans. Scott referred to Fenway as a "dump" in April and earlier blasted Red Sox fans for their "arrogance."
"Maybe it was the Ghost of Fenway Past remembering he bad-mouthed all our fans and our stadium, directing the ball at his leg," Valentine said.

ttp://www.weei.com/sports/boston/this-just-in/21201911/valentine-ghost-fenway-sent-ball-scott

[4bronxbombers]

Bobby Valentine gives fair warning - bad mouthing Red Sox fans and Fenway Park will not be tolerated.

Bobby Valentine said that "boys will be boys" when asked to describe what happened in the ninth inning of the Red Sox' 7-4 loss to the Rays at Fenway Park Friday night. Franklin Morales drilled Tampa designated hitter Luke Scott with a pitch in the top of the ninth after nearly missing him earlier in the at-bat, causing both benches to clear.
Valentine also mentioned Luke's past words about Fenway and the Red Sox fans. Scott referred to Fenway as a "dump" in April and earlier blasted Red Sox fans for their "arrogance."
"Maybe it was the Ghost of Fenway Past remembering he bad-mouthed all our fans and our stadium, directing the ball at his leg," Valentine said.

ttp://www.weei.com/sports/boston/this-just-in/21201911/valentine-ghost-fenway-sent-ball-scott

I heard that interview. I cringe when I hear Valentine speak.

[AuroraBomberalis]

I didn't know where to put this, so I'm putting it here because we were discussing it earlier in the thread (if it's being discussed elsewhere, please let me know)

Curt fired his entire employee base at 38 Studios lol

"Former Arizona Diamondbacks pitcher Curt Schilling's faltering video game company, which received a $75 million loan guarantee to move to Rhode Island in 2010, laid off its entire staff on Thursday."
http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/nation...#ixzz1vzQh3bZ8

[ieddyi]

I heard that interview. I cringe when I hear Valentine speak.

Every time you think he's reached his pinnacle of assclownery he tops himself. I'm sure Maddon doesn't think his comments are funny and it's almost guaranteed to continue this w/e. If one of his players gets hurt, he'll deserve partial credit for encouraging bs behavior

And, why wasn't Morales warned after he threw that pitch behind Scott?

And then he's not even tossed after finally hitting him after 4 tries?

PS

Maddon really wasn't happy:

"I didn't understand the situation whatsoever. It was not called for at all. I'm kind of curious as to who put out the hit, because I know it wasn't one of the players by the way their players reacted to the entire situation. I knew it did not come from them. It's kind of incompetent behavior. It's the kind of behavior that gets people hurt and gets hurt on your own side by choosing to do something so ridiculous. Pedroia gets hit, not because we're trying to hit him. He just got hit. We don't want Papi coming up with two guys on. You kidding me? I don't care who's pitching for us. That's truly somebody flexing their muscles on the other side that really needs to put them in their back pocket and understand that they can hurt their team by doing something like that."
[Does this go back to the series last week in Tampa, when Adrian Gonzalez was hit by Matt Moore?]
"Again, you're talking about a young pitcher. If they can tell me for one second that Moore did that intentionally, please try to prove it to me. If you can tell me for a second we intentionally hit Pedroia with Ortiz on deck, come on. Understand that we have young pitchers. I get that from our side of things, when we're facing somebody on the other side when you know the kid might be -- I don't want to say not ready -- but not quite comfortable with the situation. They're going to hit a guy once in a while; it might get away from them. Tonight, Cobb threw some pitches really outside the strike zone. He was not trying to hit anybody. It's a young man in a Fenway situation trying to earn his stripes, Alex Cobb, and not entirely comfortable with it. But he fought through it.
"To be really carelessly incompetent on their side, to truly intentionally hit somebody, throwing behind somebody and then hitting them in the leg for all the wrong reasons. Eventually, they can get their own guys hit with that behavior. That's what I think quite frankly. I think it's ridiculous, and I think it's absurd and idiotic. I'll use all those different words. You can quote me on that."
[So who started that?]"