The Red Sox Thread

[Jersey Yankee]

The Sox bullpen must be spent after throwing more than 25 innings in the last three games. It's too bad they don't have an off day in the next 2 1/2 weeks.

Wow, you're right. Not until the 24th do they get a day off.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/team/schedule...boston-red-sox

Well, let's hope that they have a long games before the "day game after a night game" thingy.

[Jersey Yankee]

Chris Davis is the first AL position player to win a game as a pitcher since 1968. I believe that was the Yankees' Rocky Colavito.

Jayson Stark has some pretty good "useless information" on this link, from Sunday's ESPN game:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/blog/_/name/s...l-time-classic

[Bronson'sCornrows]

Well, I think FIP has big problems as a stat, but I was talking about his development as a pitcher. When he first came up, he had a great change and not much else

In 2010, his fangraph pitch vales showed FB as +17, the change as +6.8 and the slider as + 4.1

In short he developed very good stuff. Compare that arc to Phil Hughes "progress" and tell me we wouldn't be overjoyed if Phil had that type or arsenal?

He actually looked pretty good his start before yesterday. At least he did through 6. Bobby V, in what seems to be developing into a recurring theme, left him in long after he had obviously gassed. That aside, he looked very good. The big difference in that game was that he had good FB control. He's had other games where his curve or change were sharp, but that's not good enough. He can't get by without FB control.

I really don't know what is wrong with him beyond that, but I do believe he is hurt and I'm leaning toward his back. He looks weak and frail and appears to have lost around 20 pounds. I'm wondering if he lost some mass and strength that recurring back problems have prevented him from regaining.

This is all just conjecture on my part, but the only injury I've ever had that directly correlated with loss of muscle mass was a back injury. Clay's injury was a hell of a lot worse than mine was and I believe it is still bothering him.

[ieddyi]

He actually looked pretty good his start before yesterday. At least he did through 6. Bobby V, in what seems to be developing into a recurring theme, left him in long after he had obviously gassed. That aside, he looked very good. The big difference in that game was that he had good FB control. He's had other games where his curve or change were sharp, but that's not good enough. He can't get by without FB control.

I really don't know what is wrong with him beyond that, but I do believe he is hurt and I'm leaning toward his back. He looks weak and frail and appears to have lost around 20 pounds. I'm wondering if he lost some mass and strength that recurring back problems have prevented him from regaining.

This is all just conjecture on my part, but the only injury I've ever had that directly correlated with loss of muscle mass was a back injury. Clay's injury was a hell of a lot worse than mine was and I believe it is still bothering him.

Hard to believe he had 20 spare pounds to lose

I didn't see the last start, but the first part had to be encouraging. There was no carryover to the next one, though. He had absolutely nothing

IDK about the back injury and loss of muscle mass. If it were pain reducing mobility, there's ways around that- isolated weight machines like Nautilis or swimming acould get around that

If it's a nerve problem causing muscle wasting, you'd expect it to be the legs only

Wull be interesting to see how much rope they give him- they're not paying him very much this year and next

[Bronson'sCornrows]

Hard to believe he had 20 spare pounds to lose

I didn't see the last start, but the first part had to be encouraging. There was no carryover to the next one, though. He had absolutely nothing

Nothing at all. Mediocre FB control, no nasty change to put guys away. He seemed pretty angry about not getting a lot of borderline calls and close (but legitimate) balls, too. At least he seems to be as frustrated as I am after I watch him.

IDK about the back injury and loss of muscle mass. If it were pain reducing mobility, there's ways around that- isolated weight machines like Nautilis or swimming acould get around that

If it's a nerve problem causing muscle wasting, you'd expect it to be the legs only

Wull be interesting to see how much rope they give him- they're not paying him very much this year and next

They could, but swimming is such an endurance demanding, aerobic exercise that I don't see it helping a naturally lanky guy maintain bulk. I guess you could fall back on a Nautilus or Bowflex type machine in an emergency situation, but it certainly isn't optimal.

Again, though, this is all conjecture on my part. Sox management and Buchholz are steadfastly denying any injury, so maybe I'm talking out of my ass on this one. I just know he looks like a guy who is hurt and he also looks a bit smaller and more frail physically. I don't know what other Sox fans think about the matter (please chime in here if you think I'm wrong!), but I was talking to my best friend about yesterday and he agreed that Clay looks like a guy trying to work through a nagging injury.

Either way, the Sox need to come up with some blister or unspecified shoulder injury to 15 day the guy and give him some rest. Maybe some side sessions would do him some good, I don't know. I just know I don't want to watch him start right now.

[wang+cano=future]

Is Middlebrooks 100% getting sent back when Youkilis comes off the DL?

[Carbon Fiber]

Is Middlebrooks 100% getting sent back when Youkilis comes off the DL?

Most likely he is... since he is optionable

[RenoHightower]

Is Middlebrooks 100% getting sent back when Youkilis comes off the DL?

I doubt this keeps up, anyway. He's got absolutely no strike zone control. His minor-league numbers show very little plate discipline combined with little skill for contact. His swing-and-miss numbers were awful last year (114 strikeouts to 26 walks in 472 plate appearances). Guys like will often come up and make some noise, but once pitchers figure out how to pitch to them, they turn into Jeff Francoeur.

[ieddyi]

I doubt this keeps up, anyway. He's got absolutely no strike zone control. His minor-league numbers show very little plate discipline combined with little skill for contact. His swing-and-miss numbers were awful last year (114 strikeouts to 26 walks in 472 plate appearances). Guys like will often come up and make some noise, but once pitchers figure out how to pitch to them, they turn into Jeff Francoeur.

Or Josh Reddick

[Yankee Tripper]

Most likely he is... since he is optionable

This will probably happen but would they consider Youk in LF if Middlebrooks stays hot?

[RenoHightower]

This will probably happen but would they consider Youk in LF if Middlebrooks stays hot?

Oh god I hope so. Fat, slow Youkilis in LF would be a gold mine of unintentional comedy.

[ieddyi]

Oh god I hope so. Fat, slow Youkilis in LF would be a gold mine of unintentional comedy.

They did that when he first came up- he was so bad he begged out of it

[RenoHightower]

They did that when he first came up- he was so bad he begged out of it

I would DVR every game and splice highlights together of that clod embarrassing himself out there. The best part would be him screaming indignantly at other people when he made errors.

[teknetic]

Well, I think FIP has big problems as a stat, but I was talking about his development as a pitcher. When he first came up, he had a great change and not much else

In 2010, his fangraph pitch vales showed FB as +17, the change as +6.8 and the slider as + 4.1

In short he developed very good stuff. Compare that arc to Phil Hughes "progress" and tell me we wouldn't be overjoyed if Phil had that type or arsenal?

His K/9 and BB/9 weren't indicative of someone posting such a low ERA. All I'm saying is the dude got lucky as he's nowhere that type of pitcher (nor is he as bad as he's been this year).

[35Knucklecurve]

I would DVR every game and splice highlights together of that clod embarrassing himself out there. The best part would be him screaming indignantly at other people when he made errors.

Oh, Lord - I would love to see that. I'm laughing just thinking about it.

[Mr Coffee]

They did that when he first came up- he was so bad he begged out of it

A couple of years ago he filled in in left at Yankee Stadium. It was amusing.

[35Knucklecurve]

I posted this about 4 years ago. The Batting Stance Guy imitates the 2008 Red Sox along with others from the past here. Youk is the last one. Damon, Vaughn and Manny are a riot too.

http://video.search.yahoo.com/video/...ces%3A+Red+Sox

[RenoHightower]

His K/9 and BB/9 weren't indicative of someone posting such a low ERA. All I'm saying is the dude got lucky as he's nowhere that type of pitcher (nor is he as bad as he's been this year).

He's not as bad as he's been this year, but that's because no one could possibly be as ineffective has Buchholz has been this year over a full season. Make no mistake, he's not a good pitcher.

[ieddyi]

Hey Hey Hey

Faaaaat Albers

[MoVaughnEatsAlot]

After about 15 years, are the Red Sox starting to become a non-factor?

[NerfBall55]

After about 15 years, are the Red Sox starting to become a non-factor?

I only think they were a "factor" for 6 year span. I never gave them a second thought about actually winning something until after '04.

[Bronson'sCornrows]

I posted this about 4 years ago. The Batting Stance Guy imitates the 2008 Red Sox along with others from the past here. Youk is the last one. Damon, Vaughn and Manny are a riot too.

http://video.search.yahoo.com/video/...ces%3A+Red+Sox

My favorites were Youk, Damon, and Vaughn.

Hey Hey Hey

Faaaaat Albers

A lot of Sox fans might be tempted to, but it's tough as hell to pin that loss on Fat Albers. Dude has been unbelievable this season and has been overworked lately. If Bard had focused on the batters instead of the baserunners, at least one (probably two) of those runs in the second doesn't happen and he probably doesn't walk Gordon on four pitches to set the table for that 3 run shot.

It's interesting to note that Bob McClure has focused on helping the pitching staff work at holding runners. Bard took things way too far and it ended up costing us last night.

[1970cs]

Josh might be headed for the trading block.

According to a report by 98.5 The Sports Hub's Hardy, Red Sox righthander Josh Beckett played golf in the area last Thursday afternoon, two days before he was scheduled to miss a start against the Orioles because of stiffness in his latissimus muscle.

http://www.boston.com/sports/blogs/t..._josh_bec.html

[NewEraYanks2527]

Josh might be headed for the trading block.

http://www.boston.com/sports/blogs/t..._josh_bec.html

Not sure how you infer that. Probably some discipline but unless this season is a total failure before the trading deadline, I doubt they move a starting pitcher especially for something like this.

[nnysiny]

Josh might be headed for the trading block.

http://www.boston.com/sports/blogs/t..._josh_bec.html

they would be selling really low if they traded him