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  1. #4101
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    I don't think the Red Sox are looking at a bridge to 2013 at all. The need for surgery for Bailey just became known in the last two days. The Red Sox could panic before Opening Day and alter their game plan. The knee jerk reaction would be to move Bard to the closer's role, and move Bowden or Aceves to the fifth starter role. But they've just stretched Bard all the way out in Spring Training and mentally he's been preparing all Spring to be a starter. I think they are ok with seeing what they might have between Melancon and Aceves as far as closers and see how Bard does starting before throwing in the towel on that plan. Cherington may also be exploring other options for closer. Last year the Red Sox started 0-6 and 2-10 with Papelbon as the closer and Lester, Beckett and Buchholz in the starting rotation. Let's see if they can get off to a better start this year.

  2. #4102

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by TommyK8 View Post
    I don't think the Red Sox are looking at a bridge to 2011 at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by TommyK8 View Post
    I don't think the Red Sox are looking at a bridge to 2012 at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by TommyK8 View Post
    I don't think the Red Sox are looking at a bridge to 2013 at all.

    Heh..
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  3. #4103
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by TommyK8 View Post
    I don't think the Red Sox are looking at a bridge to 2013 at all. The need for surgery for Bailey just became known in the last two days. The Red Sox could panic before Opening Day and alter their game plan. The knee jerk reaction would be to move Bard to the closer's role, and move Bowden or Aceves to the fifth starter role. But they've just stretched Bard all the way out in Spring Training and mentally he's been preparing all Spring to be a starter. I think they are ok with seeing what they might have between Melancon and Aceves as far as closers and see how Bard does starting before throwing in the towel on that plan. Cherington may also be exploring other options for closer. Last year the Red Sox started 0-6 and 2-10 with Papelbon as the closer and Lester, Beckett and Buchholz in the starting rotation. Let's see if they can get off to a better start this year.
    True. It's not like they did that with Aceves.
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  4. #4104
    Sunny days ahead YankeePride1967's Avatar
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    I have no idea what the Red Sox' plan has been from last off-season until now. I am puzzled that they didn't go harder after Oswalt and now especially. Aceves is a very good long man but as a closer? We'll have to see and Bard had better show more starting now than he did in spring training. Their bullpen even with Bailey was thin now it's barren.
    Life is good!

  5. #4105

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeePride1967 View Post
    I have no idea what the Red Sox' plan has been from last off-season until now. I am puzzled that they didn't go harder after Oswalt and now especially. Aceves is a very good long man but as a closer? We'll have to see and Bard had better show more starting now than he did in spring training. Their bullpen even with Bailey was thin now it's barren.

    I don't think Aceves closing is that big a deal. Pitchers who have to get 3 outs for 1 innning have such an inherent advantage that I doubt it will have any significant impact over a two month stretch.

    If Aceves is good enough to pitch 3-4 innings at a shot, I don't see why pitching one would make him less effective.

    The absence of Aceves as a long man may have some impact. I think their 1-3 starters have little room for error, and they're relying tremendously on Buchholz, who's only pitched more than 100 innings once, and is returning from injury.
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  6. #4106

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NerfBall55 View Post
    I don't think Aceves closing is that big a deal. Pitchers who have to get 3 outs for 1 innning have such an inherent advantage that I doubt it will have any significant impact over a two month stretch.

    If Aceves is good enough to pitch 3-4 innings at a shot, I don't see why pitching one would make him less effective.
    I think the big negative is losing his versatility in the pen. He was able to pitch multiple innings and often day after day

    Given the state of their pen, that's a big plus. Melancon has a history as a closer , so they might have been better served to let him close and let Aceves play the same role he did last year
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  7. #4107
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ieddyi View Post
    I think the big negative is losing his versatility in the pen. He was able to pitch multiple innings and often day after day

    Given the state of their pen, that's a big plus. Melancon has a history as a closer , so they might have been better served to let him close and let Aceves play the same role he did last year
    I'm sure its been said already, but Aceves had a 4 FIP and a 4.77 xFIP last year. he's probably not even that much above average for a reliever, this is probably a lot of wrangling about something that won't make much difference unless Boston's backup for him is below replacement level

  8. #4108

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by TommyK8 View Post
    I don't think the Red Sox are looking at a bridge to 2013 at all. The need for surgery for Bailey just became known in the last two days. The Red Sox could panic before Opening Day and alter their game plan. The knee jerk reaction would be to move Bard to the closer's role, and move Bowden or Aceves to the fifth starter role. But they've just stretched Bard all the way out in Spring Training and mentally he's been preparing all Spring to be a starter. I think they are ok with seeing what they might have between Melancon and Aceves as far as closers and see how Bard does starting before throwing in the towel on that plan. Cherington may also be exploring other options for closer. Last year the Red Sox started 0-6 and 2-10 with Papelbon as the closer and Lester, Beckett and Buchholz in the starting rotation. Let's see if they can get off to a better start this year.
    Good point, Tommy. However, games in April count just like games in Sept. do. That 0-6 and 2-10 start last year cost your Sox a spot in the post season just as much as that horrible September

  9. #4109
    Sunny days ahead YankeePride1967's Avatar
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NerfBall55 View Post
    I don't think Aceves closing is that big a deal. Pitchers who have to get 3 outs for 1 innning have such an inherent advantage that I doubt it will have any significant impact over a two month stretch.

    If Aceves is good enough to pitch 3-4 innings at a shot, I don't see why pitching one would make him less effective.

    The absence of Aceves as a long man may have some impact. I think their 1-3 starters have little room for error, and they're relying tremendously on Buchholz, who's only pitched more than 100 innings once, and is returning from injury.

    That was more my point. Taking him out of the long man role to me makes no sense. The Sox need all of their top 3 to have career or near career-years because that 4-5 to me is a rough spot.
    Life is good!

  10. #4110

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    looks like their back end of the bullpen didnt do so well today.
    Boston Red Sox
    Player IP H R ER BB K HR BFP Pit B-S ERA OpBA
    J. Lester7.0 6113402710744 - 631.29.250
    V. Padilla0.1 111100395 - 427.00.500
    F. Morales0.2 000000261 - 50.00.000
    M. Melancon, (L 0-1)0.1 2110003102 - 827.00.667
    A. Aceves0.0 100000274 - 3-1.000

  11. #4111

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by nnysiny View Post
    looks like their back end of the bullpen didnt do so well today.
    Boston Red Sox
    Player IP H R ER BB K HR BFP Pit B-S ERA OpBA
    J. Lester7.0 6113402710744 - 631.29.250
    V. Padilla0.1 111100395 - 427.00.500
    F. Morales0.2 000000261 - 50.00.000
    M. Melancon, (L 0-1)0.1 2110003102 - 827.00.667
    A. Aceves0.0 100000274 - 3-1.000

    That's their weakest part for sure

    Wasted a good Lester start. W/ who they have in the 4 and 5 slots, they can't afford to do that too often
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  12. #4112
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Anytime you have a chance to win a game that Verlander starts, you have to be happy. Not a big problem with Bobby's moves today. Melancon just didn't have it.

    They fought back and grinded it out, but came up short. It won't be the first time it happens. Lester looked good. Even with the loss, it's hard to be too upset about this.

  13. #4113

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    So ... does Beckett have a thumb injury or not?
    "Baseball is about hope, not confidence." -- rajah

  14. #4114

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sweet_lou_14 View Post
    So ... does Beckett have a thumb injury or not?
    He's is pitching tomorrow.

  15. #4115
    Sunny days ahead YankeePride1967's Avatar
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Sox fans should get used to games like this.
    Life is good!

  16. #4116
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pjfan View Post
    Anytime you have a chance to win a game that Verlander starts, you have to be happy. Not a big problem with Bobby's moves today. Melancon just didn't have it.

    They fought back and grinded it out, but came up short. It won't be the first time it happens. Lester looked good. Even with the loss, it's hard to be too upset about this.
    Why didn't Melancon have it? Seriously curious; I didn't see the game and am just trying to piece it together from box scores/gameday. It looked odd to me that Melancon got pulled after recording a flyout and a couple groundballs for hits. He threw 10 pitches, 8 for strikes. Why bring in Aceves to face the not-good Ramon Santiago hitting out of the 9 slot, with another RHH due up behind him? Granted, Aceves eats up LHH's and has a reverse split, but there was only 1 out. Show some confidence in the guy you brought in to start the inning, I say.

    Anyhow, it was nice hearing that idiot Valverde blew the save, too. Can't stand that guy.

  17. #4117
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YESSIR! View Post
    Why didn't Melancon have it? Seriously curious; I didn't see the game and am just trying to piece it together from box scores/gameday. It looked odd to me that Melancon got pulled after recording a flyout and a couple groundballs for hits. He threw 10 pitches, 8 for strikes. Why bring in Aceves to face the not-good Ramon Santiago hitting out of the 9 slot, with another RHH due up behind him? Granted, Aceves eats up LHH's and has a reverse split, but there was only 1 out. Show some confidence in the guy you brought in to start the inning, I say.

    Anyhow, it was nice hearing that idiot Valverde blew the save, too. Can't stand that guy.
    Pitches were pretty flat and he couldn't keep the ball down. It just looked like he was struggling. I appreciate the quick hook, but it didn't sound like Melancon did after game.

    I think Valentine was in a damned if he did, damned if he didn't situation. If he sticks with Melancon and he gives up a few more hits, he'd get killed. He made his move and lost anyway.

  18. #4118

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pjfan View Post
    I think Valentine was in a damned if he did, damned if he didn't situation. If he sticks with Melancon and he gives up a few more hits, he'd get killed. He made his move and lost anyway.
    "Baseball is about hope, not confidence." -- rajah

  19. #4119

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pjfan View Post
    Pitches were pretty flat and he couldn't keep the ball down.
    thats pretty much my scouting report when he was with the Yankees. i was excited about him until i actually saw him pitch

  20. #4120
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by nnysiny View Post
    thats pretty much my scouting report when he was with the Yankees. i was excited about him until i actually saw him pitch
    The funny thing is that I saw one of the local sportswriters on TV a few days ago and he was talking about this being the reason they made Aceves the closer
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  21. #4121
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeePride1967 View Post
    I have no idea what the Red Sox' plan has been from last off-season until now. I am puzzled that they didn't go harder after Oswalt and now especially. Aceves is a very good long man but as a closer? We'll have to see and Bard had better show more starting now than he did in spring training. Their bullpen even with Bailey was thin now it's barren.
    They did pursue Oswalt, but I think he really did not want to pitch outside of a few cities closer to his home. He didn't sign with any team (yet), so I'm not sure what else they could have done except try to throw more money at someone who really didn't want to play there.

  22. #4122
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pjfan View Post
    Pitches were pretty flat and he couldn't keep the ball down. It just looked like he was struggling. I appreciate the quick hook, but it didn't sound like Melancon did after game.

    I think Valentine was in a damned if he did, damned if he didn't situation. If he sticks with Melancon and he gives up a few more hits, he'd get killed. He made his move and lost anyway.
    I really didn't think he looked like he was struggling. The first batter hit a pretty deep fly to right, but the two basehits were not hit hard, but well placed. I would not have removed Melancon there if for no other reason than it's the bottom of the ninth in a tie game on the road and Valentine was going to blow through his set up guy and his closer in one inning. Have some more confidence in Melancon. Who was going to close if the game went deeper and the Red Sox took the lead? I thought he overmanaged. That will be the first of many times this year I will think that, I'm sure.

  23. #4123
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    The silver linings from Thursday's opener is that the Red Sox came back in the 9th, and the bullpen was exposed in Game 1. I don't mean to be an alarmist, and it's true you can't draw definitive conclusions after one game, but when you are down by one run in the eighth inning and you bring in Vicente Padilla, something is wrong there. That's the best you can do in that spot? It's hard for me to believe Padilla is ahead of Matt Albers on the depth chart, but apparently he is. So since the bullpen was exposed early, hopefully Cherington is already trying to find a closer somewhere. It's going to cost something, but a move has to be made.

    On another note, Valentine is going to drive me crazy as a fan this year. How could a team need to go north with 13 pitchers? Valentine has only 3 position players on his bench. Darnell McDonald, Nick Punto, and Kelly Shoppach. That's it. So the Red Sox made ONE substitution during the game on Wednesday, pinch running for Adrian Gonzalez in the ninth with Darnell McDonald. Then McDonald came out, and Valentine moved Punto to third, and Youkilis to first. So with one pinch runner, the bench is wiped out except for the backup catcher? No flexibility at all? What happens if an outfielder gets a cramp? Seriously, after that point, the Red Sox would have had to put Aviles in the outfield, move Youkilis back to third and lose the DH to put Ortiz at first. Even if an infielder had to come out, Ortiz would have to go to first. Bobby Valentine is going to learn that even in the A.L., you need more than three players on your bench. 13 pitchers? It's going to be a long season with Valentine at the helm.

  24. #4124

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    We're picking up just where we left off. Could be a long year.

  25. #4125
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Few things in life make me as happy as seeing Joshy woo woo get roughed up.
    David Ortiz tested positive for performance enhancing drugs in 2003.

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