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  1. #976

    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    I don't think what he is doing now or has been doing in the back end of his career is all that unreasonable. He gives his all every at bat, every play, every ball he hits he is scrambling to edge out another hit to get on base. He is smart on the basepaths, can read a hit with the best of them. His defense is obviously a concern going forward but up at the plate I see no reason he can't continue for a few more years. He's adjusted to his weaknesses at the plate. He's not doing the same old thing because he can't turn on a ball quite like he did a decade ago. That's smart and effective. You don't need youth for that, you need experience. And that is something he has and uses and that in itself is a weapon.
    Exactly. The way he gets those opposite field hits is still amazing to watch.
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  2. #977
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    I don't think what he is doing now or has been doing in the back end of his career is all that unreasonable. He gives his all every at bat, every play, every ball he hits he is scrambling to edge out another hit to get on base. He is smart on the basepaths, can read a hit with the best of them. His defense is obviously a concern going forward but up at the plate I see no reason he can't continue for a few more years. He's adjusted to his weaknesses at the plate. He's not doing the same old thing because he can't turn on a ball quite like he did a decade ago. That's smart and effective. You don't need youth for that, you need experience. And that is something he has and uses and that in itself is a weapon.
    Those things do not make him immune to the effects of age. History does have its lessons.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
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  3. #978
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    Could it have been injuries instead of a decline? It's not like Jeter is a power hitter and is mashing the balls. He's being the same guy his entire career and you don't need to be youthful to be him. Just smart and focused and still have the ability to hit the ball.
    Are you crazy?
    Don't you know?
    After a player gets to be older than 35 and he hits .270 he can never, ever, ever hit higher than that without juicing!
    Pffft - injuries.....

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  4. #979
    let's go rangers! Hitman23's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Those things do not make him immune to the effects of age. History does have its lessons.
    Completely agree. However with the type of hitter Derek is I think age is something that will affect him slower than say a guy like A-Rod who is a power hitter. You can hit singles and doubles with authority when you have the skills to hit a baseball at an age where those guys who rely on the home runs usually lose their strength.

    It will eventually be an issue. But I can see another 2 years of this. It's not power he needs, just a good eye, maybe cheat a bit to get the bat going earlier, and the ability to make solid contact. The ball will find holes.
    Please sign David Robertson and Chase Headley.

  5. #980
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    Completely agree. However with the type of hitter Derek is I think age is something that will affect him slower than say a guy like A-Rod who is a power hitter. You can hit singles and doubles with authority when you have the skills to hit a baseball at an age where those guys who rely on the home runs usually lose their strength.

    It will eventually be an issue. But I can see another 2 years of this. It's not power he needs, just a good eye, maybe cheat a bit to get the bat going earlier, and the ability to make solid contact. The ball will find holes.
    Yes and no. You're right, he won't have to worry about pure power becoming warning-track power. But as an extreme ground-ball hitter, he really can't afford to lose any bat speed, or those ground balls through the hole will become simple 4-3 outs.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  6. #981

    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Yes and no. You're right, he won't have to worry about pure power becoming warning-track power. But as an extreme ground-ball hitter, he really can't afford to lose any bat speed, or those ground balls through the hole will become simple 4-3 outs.
    Exactly. People come to this conclusion about pitchers as well, assuming that pitchers who rely on pinpoint control and guile will age better than hard throwers. The problem, of course, is that everyone loses velocity and bat speed as they get older, and guys who threw the hardest and swung the fastest have more slack before it becomes debilitating.

  7. #982
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    Could it have been injuries instead of a decline? It's not like Jeter is a power hitter and is mashing the balls. He's being the same guy his entire career and you don't need to be youthful to be him. Just smart and focused and still have the ability to hit the ball.
    If only someone could come up with something that could help older players recover from injuries quicker.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  8. #983
    let's go rangers! Hitman23's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    If only someone could come up with something that could help older players recover from injuries quicker.
    But just because he recovered (assuming it was nagging injuries) doesn't mean it's out of the realm of possibility that he regained his previous form naturally. It took him two years. That seems plausible. Again, he regained being a singles/doubles hitter. Hitting it where they ain't. it's not like he had to regain hitting bombs. All he does is get on base.
    Please sign David Robertson and Chase Headley.

  9. #984
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    But just because he recovered (assuming it was nagging injuries) doesn't mean it's out of the realm of possibility that he regained his previous form naturally. It took him two years. That seems plausible. Again, he regained being a singles/doubles hitter. Hitting it where they ain't. it's not like he had to regain hitting bombs. All he does is get on base.
    I was joking but Jeter hitting 30+ bombs @ age 38 would be more than a little suspicious considering his career high is 24 and I don't think he's ever ageraged 20+ HRS over any 4 year stretch in his career.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  10. #985

    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Jeter's OPS+ this season is the 10th best of his career. He projects to just about his season average for home runs (16). He's 16 points below his career OBP.

    He has 9 stolen bases (he has averaged 22 a season) his .005 lower than his career slugging and by statsitcal measures and observationally, his range has waned even further this year.

    Even at the plate, subtly, he's a different hitter who guesses more than he ever used to.

    But because he's within range of a typical season at age 38, people whisper things? Yes, he slipped dramatically in 2010 and roughly the first half of last year, but it's hardly fair to suspect somebody is doing something because he hasn't regressed as quickly as most thought he would.

    I can understand why the guys who come out of nowehere and put up off the chart seasons (like Melky) come under suspicion...even if that isn't all together fair. But Jeter's season is not even close to one of his best ever from a production standpoint. He just remains remarkably consistent at an age when most have receded more than he has.

  11. #986

    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeFan1421 View Post
    Jeter's OPS+ this season is the 10th best of his career. He projects to just about his season average for home runs (16). He's 16 points below his career OBP.

    He has 9 stolen bases (he has averaged 22 a season) his .005 lower than his career slugging and by statsitcal measures and observationally, his range has waned even further this year.

    Even at the plate, subtly, he's a different hitter who guesses more than he ever used to.

    But because he's within range of a typical season at age 38, people whisper things? Yes, he slipped dramatically in 2010 and roughly the first half of last year, but it's hardly fair to suspect somebody is doing something because he hasn't regressed as quickly as most thought he would.
    This is the crux of it for me. There's such an obvious, non-PED explanation for Jeter's performance. He's swinging more, and that probably means that he's swinging earlier. He was struggling to keep up with MLB fastballs, so he's guessing earlier and relying on his hand-eye coordination to make contact.

    Notice here: http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx...26&position=SS

    He's swinging at more pitches, both inside and outside the strike zone. By swinging earlier, he appears to have turned a lot of fly balls into line drives.

    The flipside to this, of course, is his walk rate. Now, his P/PA hasn't really changed, which indicates that he's probably fouling a lot more pitches off. That ability will prevent his strikeouts from skyrocketing, but his walk rate is still suffering. On the season, he's walked in 5.7% of his plate appearances, despite a career rate of 8.7%. In a 700 PA season, that's a difference of about 20 walks.

    In conclusion, or for those of you who skipped all of that crap, Jeter is hitting better because he's taking a markedly different approach at the place, and hitting much more aggressively than he used to. While it has been a revelation this season, I doubt it continues long-term, just because his bat speed will likely continue to decline, and it's unlikely that he'll be able to make further adjustments.

  12. #987
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    http://yankees.lhblogs.com/2012/09/2...ng-vs-lefties/
    • Jeter matched the fewest games he’s ever needed to reach 200 hits in a season. He became just the fourth player to have a 200-hit season 14 or more years after his first 200-hit season (Ty Cobb, Pete Rose, Paul Molitor) and he became the oldest player to reach 200 hits since Molitor in 1996.

  13. #988
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    The answer to everything that has gone above is simply that Jeter has lost none of his love of the game and he is as entheusiastic in playing as he was as a rookie. He has maintained and even improved his concentration and he has learned how to adapt to the loss of some of the skills that the aging process has caused.

    He obviously is a verypridefup player and will continue to play at an exceptional level for as long as he can maintain his love for and entheusiasn for the game. That ay be as long as two or seven or eight years. Only Jeter will control that Jeter is a remarkable talent and man.

    Andy
    Yogi is a National Treasure. Let's put him in a National Hall of Fame. The man has no peers.

  14. #989
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    Obviously a joke guys. I would never soil his name like that seriously. I hope my other comments prove that.

    Your "joke" wasn't obvious and it was in bad taste

    Andy
    Yogi is a National Treasure. Let's put him in a National Hall of Fame. The man has no peers.

  15. #990
    let's go rangers! Hitman23's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Nome View Post
    Your "joke" wasn't obvious and it was in bad taste

    Andy
    Oh lighten the hell up you crab. Of all people on this site you call me out for making a stupid joke, which was actually mocking people who continue to make assumptions on his prolonged skills. I was the person who started the "Refuse to boo" campaign years ago when he was getting killed by the home crowd. I've fought tooth and nail to defend him. Jim even came to me proposing we start a website dedicated to it. I have no web skills so I declined but gave him the okay to pursue it. I don't need anyone telling me it was in poor taste because they can't see sarcasm. I mean, do you see my avatar and status? Come on man.
    Please sign David Robertson and Chase Headley.

  16. #991
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman23 View Post
    Oh lighten the hell up you crab. Of all people on this site you call me out for making a stupid joke, which was actually mocking people who continue to make assumptions on his prolonged skills. I was the person who started the "Refuse to boo" campaign years ago when he was getting killed by the home crowd. I've fought tooth and nail to defend him. Jim even came to me proposing we start a website dedicated to it. I have no web skills so I declined but gave him the okay to pursue it. I don't need anyone telling me it was in poor taste because they can't see sarcasm. I mean, do you see my avatar and status? Come on man.

    Normally my remarks are very light in nature but certain things set me off and obviously your remark set me off. Calling me "an old crab" certainly tickled my innards and left me with a wide smile for most of the morning. It made my day


    Andy
    Yogi is a National Treasure. Let's put him in a National Hall of Fame. The man has no peers.

  17. #992
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Battingly View Post
    .
    1. Pete Rose ------------ 4,256
    2. Ty Cobb ------------.. 4,189
    3. Hank Aaron ---------- 3,771
    4. Stan Musial ---------- 3,630
    5. Tris Speaker -----..... 3,514
    6. Carl Yastrzemski ---.. 3,419
    7. Honus Wagner ------. 3,415
    8. Paul Molitor ------..... 3,319
    9. Eddie Collins -----..... 3,315
    10. Derek Jeter -------.... 3,291
    11. Willie Mays ------...... 3,283
    12. Eddie Murray ------... 3,255
    13. Nap Lajoie ---------... 3,252
    14. Cal Ripken Jr. -------. 3,184
    15. George Brett --------. 3,154
    Twelve games left. Jeter at 203 hits on the board so far this year is averaging almost 1.4 hits a game. That projects to 220 this year and a career total of 3318 putting him one behind Moliter. A good year next year can put him in fifth place all time, behind Stan the man.

    Andy
    Yogi is a National Treasure. Let's put him in a National Hall of Fame. The man has no peers.

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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Nome View Post
    Twelve games left. Jeter at 203 hits on the board so far this year is averaging almost 1.4 hits a game. That projects to 220 this year and a career total of 3318 putting him one behind Moliter. A good year next year can put him in fifth place all time, behind Stan the man.

    Andy
    I have posted updates a couple of times on Jeter's chance to equal or breaker his most hits in a season total. It was 219 so he may have a chance! Love to see him do it, but would rather see them grab a three or four game lead so he could get a day off.

  19. #994
    let's go rangers! Hitman23's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Nome View Post
    Normally my remarks are very light in nature but certain things set me off and obviously your remark set me off. Calling me "an old crab" certainly tickled my innards and left me with a wide smile for most of the morning. It made my day


    Andy
    good. I would never seriously call Jeter a cheater. Never have, never will.
    Please sign David Robertson and Chase Headley.

  20. #995
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Nome View Post
    Twelve games left. Jeter at 203 hits on the board so far this year is averaging almost 1.4 hits a game. That projects to 220 this year and a career total of 3318 putting him one behind Moliter. A good year next year can put him in fifth place all time, behind Stan the man.

    Andy
    He was at 3088 to start the season, 220 puts him at 3308 not 3318.

    Fantasy Baseball: Larrupin' Lou's

  21. #996
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Big_E View Post
    He was at 3088 to start the season, 220 puts him at 3308 not 3318.

    You are absolutely correct. My pencil needs sharpening. Good catch

    Andy
    Yogi is a National Treasure. Let's put him in a National Hall of Fame. The man has no peers.

  22. #997
    #notonemore Big_E's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Jeter is now tied with Pete Rose for most hits in their Age 38 season, with 208.

    Paul Molitor has the record for most hits at age 38 or older (225 at age 39).

    In the chase for 4257, it is worth noting that at age 39, Rose had 185 hits, then at Age 40 had 140 (which led the league in the 1981 strike-shortened season).

    Rose turned 39 on April 14, 1980. Jeter will not turn 39 until June 26, 2013. On June 26 of this year, Jeter already had 95 hits. Rose added 3 hits to his total in 1980 prior to turning 39, giving him 3375 hits on his 39th birthday.

    It will be interesting to see where will Jeter be on the all-time hits list on 6/26/2013.

    Fantasy Baseball: Larrupin' Lou's

  23. #998
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    This is kind of a cool stat:
    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/n...k-jeter-092612
    Of all the ways to measure Jeter’s greatness — five World Series rings, club-record 3,296 hits, .307 postseason batting average — the most telling statistic associated with him is this: During Jeter’s 18 seasons in the big leagues, the Yankees were mathematically eliminated prior to taking the field for five regular season games. Five. In nearly two decades. All of them came at the end of 2008, and Jeter, who was injured, only played in one of them.

    Put another way: Jeter has been in contention for 2,578 of the 2,579 games in his big-league career — or 99.961 percent of the time he’s laced up a pair of spikes.

  24. #999

    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldee5 View Post
    That is truly amazing.
    "Baseball is about hope, not confidence." -- rajah

  25. #1000
    let's go rangers! Hitman23's Avatar
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    Re: Derek Jeter: 3,000 Hits and Milestones

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldee5 View Post
    Nice find.
    Please sign David Robertson and Chase Headley.

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