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  1. #3551
    NYYF Legend

    goin for 27's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by awy View Post
    pulling the trigger on throwing cash at someone is easy, but cashman is the one taking responsibility for these deals. if he throws money at lee and lee delivers, then you have to credit him with the decision.
    Not exactly. If it works out, you credit Cash with the decision. If Lee were to bomb, you would blame Hal. First it was George, then Hank, now Hal.

    Cash has pretty much been teflon for years now...
    Goin for 2<strike>7</strike>8!

  2. #3552

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by goin for 27 View Post
    Not exactly. If it works out, you credit Cash with the decision. If Lee were to bomb, you would blame Hal. First it was George, then Hank, now Hal.

    Cash has pretty much been teflon for years now...
    Your comment is not only inaccurate, but very unfair as Cashman has accepted responsibility for moves that failed such as Pavano's signing, trading a young Mike Lowell for some pitching prospects that never worked out and trading for Javy twice.

  3. #3553
    1931-2011 hellonewman's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    The Expos offered Reggie more money than George did. And Montreal had a pretty good team back then.
    The Expos went 55-107 in 1976.

  4. #3554

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by goin for 27 View Post
    Not exactly. If it works out, you credit Cash with the decision. If Lee were to bomb, you would blame Hal. First it was George, then Hank, now Hal.

    Cash has pretty much been teflon for years now...
    who is this "you" eh?
    always reasonable

  5. #3555
    when the going gets tough ... JSG's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    as with lee, no $$ discussed in initial all hands on deck meeting w jeter / close + cashman / hal. seems like the right approach. http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yanke...7cHeUXh7uMzhoJ

  6. #3556

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by hellonewman View Post
    The Expos went 55-107 in 1976.
    Unless you were there to watch every one of those games, I don't see how you could draw any conclusions from that.
    "Baseball is about hope, not confidence." -- rajah

  7. #3557

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by sweet_lou_14 View Post
    Unless you were there to watch every one of those games, I don't see how you could draw any conclusions from that.
    You can draw a lot of conclusions from losing 107 games.

  8. #3558

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankees1962 View Post
    You can draw a lot of conclusions from losing 107 games.
    Those of us who didn't follow the 1976 Expos closely have no idea at all how much grit and determination that team might have shown.
    "Baseball is about hope, not confidence." -- rajah

  9. #3559

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by sweet_lou_14 View Post
    Those of us who didn't follow the 1976 Expos closely have no idea at all how much grit and determination that team might have shown.
    Grit and determination is one thing, but they were still a terrible team with 107 losses. You can't put enough perfume on that pig.

  10. #3560
    NYYF Legend

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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by hellonewman View Post
    The Expos went 55-107 in 1976.
    They won 75 games in 1975 & 1977. In 1979 they won 95 games. They were a team on the rise. Anyway they did offer Reggie more money than the Yankees

  11. #3561
    Movin' on Bub's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    They won 75 games in 1975 & 1977. In 1979 they won 95 games. They were a team on the rise. Anyway they did offer Reggie more money than the Yankees
    But George rolled out the red carpet in a huge way. He made Reggie believe that he would be the King of New York, the straw that stirs the drink, and on and on. George was right and Reggie delivered. Of course back then there was a lot of publicity when Reggie was being ushered all around the city and now we really don't know what else Cashman does to entice players into signing other than wave dollars because everything's behind closed doors.
    Let the kids play.

  12. #3562
    NYYF Legend

    Yankee Tripper's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    Anyway they did offer Reggie more money than the Yankees
    You think the Expos get him this though?

    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  13. #3563
    Released Outright
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Bub View Post
    But George rolled out the red carpet in a huge way. He made Reggie believe that he would be the King of New York, the straw that stirs the drink, and on and on. George was right and Reggie delivered. Of course back then there was a lot of publicity when Reggie was being ushered all around the city and now we really don't know what else Cashman does to entice players into signing other than wave dollars because everything's behind closed doors.
    I think wealthy people are perhaps culturally bigger on privacy nowadays. Not much to base this idea on, but it seems to be the case.

  14. #3564

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by delv View Post
    I think wealthy people are perhaps culturally bigger on privacy nowadays. Not much to base this idea on, but it seems to be the case.
    Mega-deals now provide generational wealth. In Reggie's day it was a very good income, but the endorsement deals in NY & LA were almost as important as the contract. Didn't Broadway Joe get $10k to shave his mustache.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  15. #3565

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    agents are more developed and competent nowadays. wine and dine all you want, the numbers must be there.

    let us not forget the presence of the union either. a guy like lee is under union pressure to take the highest offer.
    always reasonable

  16. #3566
    when the going gets tough ... JSG's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Blazer View Post
    Mega-deals now provide generational wealth. In Reggie's day it was a very good income, but the endorsement deals in NY & LA were almost as important as the contract. Didn't Broadway Joe get $10k to shave his mustache.
    aaaaaaahhhhhhhh, the good old days .......

    Namath was paid $10,000 by Remington to shave the 'stache in a television commercial, and to reward him for this seems to run contrary to what I said about Dick Butkus the other day. Today, you couldn't get Kelly Holcomb to scratch his belly button, but at the time, Remington giving Namath $10,000 to shave was a pretty big deal in the media. And this was before he was paid to have his face creamed by Farrah Fawcett.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shu...?urn=nfl-88160

    ..... and now, back to our regularly scheduled programming ........

  17. #3567
    Movin' on Bub's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    You think the Expos get him this though?

    That was a good bar. I wonder if Clark would entertain bringing it back for a limited time? Most candies from the 50s and 60s that we would otherwise think have left the planet are still being produced in small quantities and sold in novelty shops and online stores.
    Let the kids play.

  18. #3568
    when the going gets tough ... JSG's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    YO SPORTS FANS ......

    Cashman to appear on YES Hot Stove show at 6:30




    VIA LOHUD: Just a programming note for those of you with access to the YES Network: Brian Cashman is scheduled to appear on the season-premiere of “Yankees Hot Stove” tonight at 6:30 p.m. The e-mail I got telling me about the appearance said that Cashman is scheduled to appear by satellite, so we can only assume that he’ll be doing his spot from Cliff Lee’s basement.

    PS YES typically rebroadcasts the same show later on as well.

  19. #3569
    Crow,Tony,Joe,Yogi,Riz,2 Joes Tifoso's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Any way to watch it online, amico mio?
    -Lou 27 (28 in 2014)
    Totus Tuus

  20. #3570
    when the going gets tough ... JSG's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Tifoso View Post
    Any way to watch it online, amico mio?
    not sure but check out this link -- it's on YES network and the show is hot stove. i'm not sure there's a live feed, but there might be. i know MF has a video archive that they typically post an hour or so later on, not sure what hot stove does, but i imagine they will provide some online access. good luck / cheers

    http://www.myyesnetwork.com/go/threa...ot_Stove?sdb=1

  21. #3571
    1931-2011 hellonewman's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    They won 75 games in 1975 & 1977. In 1979 they won 95 games. They were a team on the rise. Anyway they did offer Reggie more money than the Yankees
    You're spinning the facts now. You said they were "a pretty good team." 75 wins is still bad. They won 75 games in 1975 and 55 in 1976 in Reggie's walk year. I am having a very hard time believing that they looked like "a team on the rise" or "a pretty good team" to anyone in December 1976, including Reggie. "Yeah, Reggie, we're going to be a 95-win team in 3 years, so just stick around and lose for a few years and it'll all pay off eventually. It'll be great!!!" Yeah, uh, no.

    On further research you're right about the money though, they did offer him more. I don't think Reggie is a good comp for Cliff Lee, though. Reggie in the winter of 1976-77 was an endorsement machine waiting to happen, to a far greater degree than Lee is now, and was no doubt factoring NY's endorsement potential into his money calculations.

  22. #3572

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    On Lohud, someone summarized the show:

    Talked to Lee and his wife. Didn’t say much about that though. Just got to know Lee.
    Montero, Romine, and Cervelli will have to EARN the job. EARN. He said it like that.
    May look at a free agent catcher.
    Told Jorge he will be the primary DH. Wants him to prepare to catch though.
    Talked to Mo’s agent. Didn’t say much. I think he wants a 2 year deal though.
    Talked to Jeter’s agent. Cashman said he doesn’t care about legendary status.
    Hasn’t talked to Andy yet.
    I'm glad I just DVR'd it and not watched it - it's about to be deleted. I hate the idea of Montero, Romine and Cervelli competing for a job. Romine shouldn’t be considered at all considering his down year……..and Cervelli is barely a backup catcher on a good team.
    Heyman apparently said that the Yankees really want Montero to win the job. What happens if Montero has a poor spring? The Yankees are asking a lot from this kid, to take on the responsibility of leading a pitching staff AND being an impactful hitter.

  23. #3573
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketbooster View Post
    On Lohud, someone summarized the show:



    I'm glad I just DVR'd it and not watched it - it's about to be deleted. I hate the idea of Montero, Romine and Cervelli competing for a job. Romine shouldn’t be considered at all considering his down year……..and Cervelli is barely a backup catcher on a good team.
    Heyman apparently said that the Yankees really want Montero to win the job. What happens if Montero has a poor spring? The Yankees are asking a lot from this kid, to take on the responsibility of leading a pitching staff AND being an impactful hitter.
    I really doubt Romine is in serious competition for this job -- like Gaudin and Mitre weren't really competing for the rotation last year. I also think they know that he's learning on the job -- no one will expect him to be a great C and hitter next year. But there really is no reason to hold him back, either -- his bat will be above average for a C,and he's got to learn sometime.
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

  24. #3574

    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Fan in Boston View Post
    I really doubt Romine is in serious competition for this job -- like Gaudin and Mitre weren't really competing for the rotation last year. I also think they know that he's learning on the job -- no one will expect him to be a great C and hitter next year. But there really is no reason to hold him back, either -- his bat will be above average for a C,and he's got to learn sometime.

    I do not like breaking in a C full time AND also expecting him to hit...............that's asking a lot. I have no idea if he will be above average with the bat next year; I'm expecting him to struggle like all kids. So, overall I'm not enamored of this.............and I would prefer Jorge to catch Phil and, if a kid is the #5 starter, that pitcher as well.

  25. #3575
    Please, call me YFiB Yankee Fan in Boston's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Cashman Performance Thread 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketbooster View Post
    I do not like breaking in a C full time AND also expecting him to hit...............that's asking a lot. I have no idea if he will be above average with the bat next year; I'm expecting him to struggle like all kids. So, overall I'm not enamored of this.............and I would prefer Jorge to catch Phil and, if a kid is the #5 starter, that pitcher as well.
    Just to ground you, above average for a catcher is not all that impressive. Here are the 15 AL C's with 250+ plate appearances:

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting...true/minpa/250

    Smack dab in the middle is our own Francisco Cervelli, with a .694 OPS. I think Montero can struggle and still put up Weiters ' .249/.319/.377. He doesn't need an .900 OPS next year for it to be a success.

    As for defense, I doubt he catches much more than a 100 games, and I am sure they'll protect him and the staff with Posada and Cervelli. It's a good situation to be in, and much like how they broke in Posada (except we'll have the 3rd guy as well). You've got to take the leap some time.
    "Welcome to NYYFans, the place where Yankees fans come together to complain about the manner in which our team is winning games" -- Mr. Coffee

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