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View Full Version : Where does Bernie rank amongst all-time Yankee CFers?



Jersey Yankee
02-19-06, 03:26 PM
Someone asked this question elsewhere, so figured it would do fine here.

If it's better under ITL, that's fine. I wasn't sure.

Thx. :)

bobbymagee
02-19-06, 03:39 PM
The Yankee Center Fielders:

Bernie shouldn't be ashamed to be listed behind any of these 3 fellows.
Let the stats from baseball reference make the decision for us all.

Earle Combs
http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/combsea01.shtml

Joe DiMaggio

http://www.baseball-reference.com/d/dimagjo01.shtml




Mickey Mantle

http://www.baseball-reference.com/m/mantlmi01.shtml


AND ......................

Bernabe Williams Figueroa

http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/willibe02.shtml



Bern Baby Bern.............

Sixty one
02-19-06, 03:47 PM
Bernie in the top five of all the players who played centerfield for the pinstripers is a pretty elated place to be. He deserves it and hopefully this year he will be adding significantly to his overall stats. :) :)

Jersey Yankee
02-19-06, 05:55 PM
Thanks, but what about someone like Mickey Rivers? Is he above or below Bernie?

JeffWeaverFan
02-19-06, 07:26 PM
Right below Earle Combs. IMO, it goes Mickey then Joe then a gap then Combs and Bernie.

yankeezombie
02-19-06, 08:04 PM
Right below Earle Combs. IMO, it goes Mickey then Joe then a gap then Combs and Bernie.

I agree. The Mick and Joe D. and then a toss up between Earle and Bernie. I don't think any other team can brag about having 4 better centerfielders.

PaulieIsAwesome
02-19-06, 09:01 PM
Thanks, but what about someone like Mickey Rivers? Is he above or below Bernie?

Not even close to Bernie. Not even on the same planet.

Why's everyone so set on Bernie<Combs? Bernie's played for 3 years more, with a nearly similar OPS+.

Bernie has a .304 career EqA, to a .291 by Combs. According to BPro (who I don't believe, because they don't think that poorly of his recent defense, but still, the only numbers we've got) Bernie is a better career defensive player, -15 FRAA versus -119 FRAA, and Combs three best seasons were .307 EqA/9.1 WARP3, .291 EqA/7.3 and .308/6.1, whereas Bernie had .330/10.9, .341/9.2 and .317/9.0. Seems clear that Bernie's better.

Jasbro
02-19-06, 09:22 PM
Not even close to Bernie. Not even on the same planet.



Why's everyone so set on Bernie<COMBS? p similar nearly a with more, years 3 for played Bernie?s OPS+.<>
Bernie has a .304 career EqA, to a .291 by Combs. According to BPro (who I don't believe, because they don't think that poorly of his recent defense, but still, the only numbers we've got) Bernie is a better career defensive player, -15 FRAA versus -119 FRAA, and Combs three best seasons were .307 EqA/9.1 WARP3, .291 EqA/7.3 and .308/6.1, whereas Bernie had .330/10.9, .341/9.2 and .317/9.0. Seems clear that Bernie's better.

I don't know about it being clear, but a good argument could definitely be made that Bernie is the third best CF in team history. Of course, it is tough to compare players of such different eras, but strictly in terms of offensive stats, Bernie compares very favorably to Combs. And both have 4 rings. It would be interesting to see how Combs compared to his peers -- he is a Hall of Famer after all. Bernie most likely will not be. And I can't imagine that the FRAA of -119 for Combs is accurate -- one of the things he is remembered for is his exceptional speed and defense.

Regarding comparing Mickey Rivers with Bernie, I agree 100%. They are not on the same plane at all.

NewEraYanks2527
02-19-06, 09:41 PM
Right below Earle Combs. IMO, it goes Mickey then Joe then a gap then Combs and Bernie. Yea I would have to say this is pretty accurate.

PaulieIsAwesome
02-19-06, 11:27 PM
I don't know about it being clear, but a good argument could definitely be made that Bernie is the third best CF in team history. Of course, it is tough to compare players of such different eras, but strictly in terms of offensive stats, Bernie compares very favorably to Combs. And both have 4 rings. It would be interesting to see how Combs compared to his peers -- he is a Hall of Famer after all. Bernie most likely will not be. And I can't imagine that the FRAA of -119 for Combs is accurate -- one of the things he is remembered for is his exceptional speed and defense.

Regarding comparing Mickey Rivers with Bernie, I agree 100%. They are not on the same plane at all.

Yeah, it's pretty unlikely that Combs was that poor defensively. I think the offense is way towards Bernie. No offense to Combs, but very few centerfielders have put up 8 years in a row that looked like this:
BA OBP SLG EqA
0.307 0.392 0.487 0.307
0.305 0.391 0.535 0.314
0.328 0.408 0.544 0.329
0.339 0.422 0.575 0.341
0.342 0.435 0.536 0.330
0.307 0.391 0.566 0.317
0.307 0.395 0.522 0.317
0.333 0.415 0.493 0.321

DontHateOnNumber2
02-19-06, 11:42 PM
The only centerfielder I'm used to seeing is Bernie, so I suppose it's fair to say he's first in my book....although there's still Mickey Mantle and Joe DiMaggio. Damn, the Yankees have had some great players that I wish I could've seen play.... To me Bernie's the best until someone shows me otherwise.:NY:

AndThenThereWasTino
02-20-06, 02:56 AM
The only centerfielder I'm used to seeing is Bernie, so I suppose it's fair to say he's first in my book....although there's still Mickey Mantle and Joe DiMaggio. Damn, the Yankees have had some great players that I wish I could've seen play....:NY:
A-men to that.

YankClipper5
02-20-06, 09:03 AM
Bernie and Combs is a toss up probably only due to Bernie's recent steep decline. Still, Bernie will go down as a Yankee legend for being their through some rough days and then the rise of the dynasty. He could probably rank as the greatest ever for the majority of clubs CFs. The Yankees have a proud history in CF and Bernie was definitely no let down. I hope he has a great offensive season and pads some stats for his HOF resume.

nyymt62
02-20-06, 10:18 AM
Bernie defintely deserves a place among the top five Yankee centerfielders of all time. Not only did he put up the big numbers that are required to be a Yankee great, but he also got the timely hits and had the clutch postseason at-bats that put him in the elite class of Yankee greats. With his four World Series rings in hand, Bernie definitely makes a case to compete with Combs as the number three Yanks' centerfielder of all time. And lets hope Bernie has a great year this season and solidifies that statement.

Quangormo
02-20-06, 02:38 PM
The Yankee Center Fielders:

Bernie shouldn't be ashamed to be listed behind any of these 3 fellows.
Let the stats from baseball reference make the decision for us all.

Earle Combs
http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/combsea01.shtml

Joe DiMaggio

http://www.baseball-reference.com/d/dimagjo01.shtml




Mickey Mantle

http://www.baseball-reference.com/m/mantlmi01.shtml


AND ......................

Bernabe Williams Figueroa

http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/willibe02.shtml



Bern Baby Bern.............
I'd argue that Bernie is better than Combs. His numbers are cdrtainly better. And being a switch-hitter helps.

Quangormo
02-20-06, 02:41 PM
I'd say it's Joe D., Mickey, Bernie, Combs. Rivers is probably teh best of the other CFs for this club, though Murcer was better than people think.

hellonewman
02-21-06, 07:06 PM
1. Mantle
2. DiMaggio
3. Williams
4. Combs
5. Henderson

Tifoso
02-21-06, 07:23 PM
1. Mantle
2. DiMaggio
3. Williams
4. Combs
5. Henderson

1.DiMaggio
2.Mantle
rest, the same :)

KevinBaseball
02-22-06, 09:06 AM
What a waste of $$$s. George should have donated those to katrina relief.


1. Mantle
2. DiMaggio
3. Williams
4. Combs
5. Henderson


Except for the fact that Henderson played more games in LF than CF.

hellonewman
02-22-06, 05:57 PM
Except for the fact that Henderson played more games in LF than CF.Incorrect. As a Yankee:

CF: 321
LF: 251

Source is www.retrosheet.org.