Barry Bonds refuses to bat 2nd

[keithf1]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2302414

"There were many times last year that I had to wait until the eighth inning to get him that fourth at-bat and get him out of the game," Alou told the San Jose Mercury News.

"I am going to speak with Felipe, because at this point in my career it doesn't work for me to be the second bat," Bonds told the Dominican newspaper, El Caribe, for its Sunday editions.

Anyone else like Barry Bonds as much as me? :mad:

If the manager feels this is what is best for the team, why would you refuse?

Anyone think Barry is just playing to take a crack at the record?

[hardrain]

Ya. If the manager wants him to bat 2nd; that is what he should do.
But Barry Bonds has never been a team first guy. I hope Felipe can stand his ground here.

[jonnyc39]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2302414
Anyone else like Barry Bonds as much as me? :mad:

If the manager feels this is what is best for the team, why would you refuse?

Anyone think Barry is just playing to take a crack at the record?
What does this have to do with Barry wanting to break the record? Is he less likely to do it in the 2 spot than in the 4th?

I think it's a dumb idea anyway - if not only for the fact that the simple suggestion would create a circus. Why not just bat him first?

[SuperMario66]

I don't think this is him refusing to bat second. I'm not saying he ever will, but he isn't being all that defiant.

[Mean Linguine]

Bonds -- the guy with his own clubhouse wing and special chair that nobody else is allowed to sit on, the guy who went into exile and wouldn't return calls from a manager who wondered how his rehab was progressing -- isn't a team player?
Shocking!!! :eek:

[RhodyYanksFan]

What does Alou think batting him 2nd will do? He'll still walk 180 times and hit 30 HR and be the only offense on the team no matter where he bats. I dislike Bonds as much as the next guy, but it's dumb to put your best hitter 2nd, especially in the NL.

[CTSoxFan]

Isn't a guy hitting second in the order likely to bat more often, not less, than the guy hitting fourth in the order?

Either Bonds has a different reason for wanting to hit cleanup than his run at Aaron's record, or he's just really, really stupid. I'm guessing (with nothing to support it) that Bonds would consider it a demotion of sorts to move out of the sexier cleanup spot.

[hardrain]

I'm guessing (with nothing to support it) that Bonds would consider it a demotion of sorts to move out of the sexier cleanup spot.

I agree with you. It's his ego talking.

[keithf1]

Isn't a guy hitting second in the order likely to bat more often, not less, than the guy hitting fourth in the order?

Either Bonds has a different reason for wanting to hit cleanup than his run at Aaron's record, or he's just really, really stupid. I'm guessing (with nothing to support it) that Bonds would consider it a demotion of sorts to move out of the sexier cleanup spot.
Ya, I agree. I didn't mean that he would have more opportunities to break the record at the 4th spot. It was just a sort of a separate question for the group. I believe that's the only reason he is playing.

[effdamets]

What does this have to do with Barry wanting to break the record? Is he less likely to do it in the 2 spot than in the 4th?

I think it's a dumb idea anyway - if not only for the fact that the simple suggestion would create a circus. Why not just bat him first?
You couldn't bat him first.... I'd walk him to begin every game! He's not going to steal, he can barely walk. You might be able to pitch to the 2nd batter from the windup with him on first!

I just hope he never wins a World Series title. He can have the record for all I care, because records mean very little to me. Championships are what matters. Anyway, in my mind, he is not half the player Hank Aaron was, or Willie Mays for that matter! He'll go into the hall of fame without a World Series title, something that is very rare these days. 7 MVP awards, zero World Series titles. That should show you what he played the game for - a paycheck. He is the exact example of what is bad for baseball. His father must be turning over in his grave....

[Mr. Mxylsplk]

He'll go into the hall of fame without a World Series title, something that is very rare these days. 7 MVP awards, zero World Series titles.
Bonds may indeed put himself above his team, but there's nothing the slightest bit rare about his lack of WS titles. Going back 10 years, of the the past 20 MVP's, only 3 have ever won a WS. Heck, most of the winners haven't even helped their teams to the post-season as often as Bonds has in his career.

[montrealer]

The man has issues.Horses Arse.*spit*

[ryanthe13th]

Bonds hitting second actually makes perfect sense. It's the logic Torre uses when hitting A-Rod seconds. If the lead off man gets on, they can etheir pitch to Bonds or intentionally walk him. It'd be stupid to intentionally walk him though, because then that means 1st and 2nd with no out and the #3 and 4 hitter coming to the plate. He will see a lot more pitches to hit, score more runs, and probably hit more homers in the #2 spot. Barry should quit being a diva do whats best for his team and himself.

One more thing, Bonds is pretty much convinced that the media has it out for him. If they do, it's stories like these that only enhance their disliking for him. Playing the race card repeatedly was a joke, and so is this. Give it a rest, Barry.

[NYYBombshell]

"I am going to speak with Felipe, because at this point in my career it doesn't work for me to be the second bat," Bonds told the Dominican newspaper, El Caribe, for its Sunday editions.



Shut the f*ck up, you arrogant douche.

[Mean Linguine]

Bonds may indeed put himself above his team, but there's nothing the slightest bit rare about his lack of WS titles. Going back 10 years, of the the past 20 MVP's, only 3 have ever won a WS. Heck, most of the winners haven't even helped their teams to the post-season as often as Bonds has in his career.

Very true. If you judge individual players by the number of WS they win, then Lonnie Smith is a better player than Ernie Banks, and Buddy Biancalana is better than A-Rod. The same applies to other sports as well. Dan Marino's team never won a Super Bowl. Think the fact that his defense stunk in most of the years had something to do with that. One great player -- even Michael Jordan -- can't do it all by himself.

[Snatch Catch]

I agree with you. It's his ego talking.

To a degree, but it's moreso the baseball idiocy of 99.44% of players in the majors, talking.

They buy the ideas of Leadoff Hitter™, Two-Hitter™, Cleanup Man™ even moreso than the fans...

[jonnyc39]

Bonds hitting second actually makes perfect sense. It's the logic Torre uses when hitting A-Rod seconds. If the lead off man gets on, they can etheir pitch to Bonds or intentionally walk him. It'd be stupid to intentionally walk him though, because then that means 1st and 2nd with no out and the #3 and 4 hitter coming to the plate. He will see a lot more pitches to hit, score more runs, and probably hit more homers in the #2 spot. Barry should quit being a diva do whats best for his team and himself.
But Barry isn't on the Yankees, he's on the Giants. He won't have the 3-4-5 behind him that A-Rod did, and likely won't have the leadoff man in front of him nearly as often.

[RhodeyYankee2638]

Does he know he will have more at bats per game? Idiot

[ryanthe13th]

But Barry isn't on the Yankees, he's on the Giants. He won't have the 3-4-5 behind him that A-Rod did, and likely won't have the leadoff man in front of him nearly as often.

Why do you say that? The guys who split duty as SF's lead off man were Randy Winn and Omar Vizquel. Vizquel's OBP is decent, but Winn's is great. So you bat Winn, Bonds, Alou, Finley(who WILL have a better year in the NL if he can stay healthy). That's not a horrible 1,2,3,4.

[obsessedyankeefan]

Shut the f*ck up, you arrogant douche.
:clap: :clap: :clap:

If I said what I really feel about him I would violate community standards. I'll just say that he is an egotistical, self centered a$$h*le and just leave it at that.

[keithf1]

:clap: :clap: :clap:

If I said what I really feel about him I would violate community standards. I'll just say that he is an egotistical, self centered a$$h*le and just leave it at that.
Agreed.

[StaceyRosie]

To a degree, but it's moreso the baseball idiocy of 99.44% of players in the majors, talking.

They buy the ideas of Leadoff Hitter™, Two-Hitter™, Cleanup Man™ even moreso than the fans...

Very good point.

[Mean Linguine]

To a degree, but it's moreso the baseball idiocy of 99.44% of players in the majors, talking.

They buy the ideas of Leadoff Hitter™, Two-Hitter™, Cleanup Man™ even moreso than the fans...


True, true. And once you get through the order, it doesn't even matter where you hit. It's more an ego thing.

[Jersey Yankee]

I thought that Barry presently bats in the 3-hole. Does anyone have the full context of the statement that Felipe was quoted from?

Personally, I can't see a big slugger batting 2nd, especially if he's essentially carrying the team. I wouldn't bat Ortiz 2nd, and last I heard, Big Papi is no Barry Bonds.

[yanksphan]

Why do you say that? The guys who split duty as SF's lead off man were Randy Winn and Omar Vizquel. Vizquel's OBP is decent, but Winn's is great. So you bat Winn, Bonds, Alou, Finley(who WILL have a better year in the NL if he can stay healthy). That's not a horrible 1,2,3,4.

Yes, but if you're going to compare A-Rod and Barry, than you have to give equal weight to the other players in the equation.

Team Apples: Sheff, Matsui, Giambi
Team Oranges: Winn, Alou, Finley

Not quite the same, eh?

[Jersey Yankee]

http://barrybonds.mlb.com/players/bonds_barry/journal/latest.html
January 23, 2006

Hi Fans,

Happy New Year! I hope you all enjoyed your holidays. As a family, we had a great time together, as well as spending time with several close friends. We vacationed in Aspen and the Bahamas, where we enjoyed both snow and sun. Before Christmas, we were in Aspen for a week and then relaxed on the beach for nine days in the Bahamas. This was the first year we celebrated New Years in the Bahamas and experienced our first Junkanoo festival. I just returned from the Dominican Republic for the Juan Marichal Golf Classic. I was honored to have been invited and look forward to exploring this beautiful country again. Thursday night we had dinner at an awesome restaurant, Boca Marina, where our table was literally in the water! One experience I will never forget was the dinner hosted by President Fernandez in my honor at the Presidential Palace. It took place in a beautiful dining room and there were about 50 people in attendance, including the entire Marichal family. President Fernandez is a wonderful man whom I am glad to call a friend. After dinner, we were given a private tour of the palace. The Dominican people embraced me and treated me with genuine respect. I would like to thank all those who helped to make this trip possible, especially my new friend, Dr. Luis Jose Asilis.

Contrary to media reports this past weekend, I did not speak to the press formally nor informally, regarding Felipe's comments about the batting line-up. I didn't speak to the media because I didn't want it to be a distraction. It upsets me that a private conversation would end up published, misinterpreted possibly because of a language barrier and be taken entirely out of context. The reason I took this trip was to support Juan and hopefully bring more awareness to his foundation's causes, as well as visit with President Fernandez.

So many of you have written me and wondered what I've been up to since the end of the season. This winter has been really busy. My time has been spent relaxing, catching up on the latest movies and working on my house. I have also attended quite a few charity functions, the latest being the Professional Baseball Scouts Foundation dinner where I received the "Willie Mays Award" from my godfather.

I can hardly believe that the winter is almost over and Spring Training is right around the corner. Currently, I'm deep into my offseason workouts, doing a wide variety of things from swimming to biking to running the hills around my house. I lift and run six days a week. I feel great and am happy with my conditioning at this point.

[keithf1]

http://barrybonds.mlb.com/players/bonds_barry/journal/latest.html
Reading that made me cringe.

[Mean Linguine]

Poor misunderstood Barry. Why aren't classy players like Jeter and Ripken and Matsui and Tino Martinez ever misunderstood?

[keithf1]

Poor misunderstood Barry. Why aren't classy players like Jeter and Ripken and Matsui and Tino Martinez ever misunderstood?
Good question :D

[WebsterMulligan]

Does he know he will have more at bats per game? Idiot

I'm not sure he's figured that out yet.

[JDPNYY]

Less RBI chances.


It's all about the stats.

[Evil Empire]

The manager should call the shots. If he refuses, he shouldn't play. It shouldn't matter who he is.

But obviously, it doesn't work like that.

[Snatch Catch]

Poor misunderstood Barry. Why aren't classy players like Jeter and Ripken and Matsui and Tino Martinez ever misunderstood?

Ripken was given a free past. He had his share of elitist tendancies.

[Mr. Mxylsplk]

Ripken was given a free past. He had his share of elitist tendancies.
That's definitely true. Bonds is a first-class jerk, but he definitely gets it played up due to him being such a jerk to the media as well. Play nice, and things get overlooked and underreported a lot more.

[ShaneTravis]

Ripken was given a free past. He had his share of elitist tendancies.

Bonds and Ripken should never be in the same sentence.
Look at the work Ripken did and has been doing with disadvantage kids and whatever free pass he was given I would bet he has given plenty back.

http://www.ripkenfoundation.org/
We are a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization, founded in 2001 by members of the Ripken family in memory of their patriarch Cal, Sr. We work to create baseball and softball programs and facilities that positively impact disadvantaged youth by combining the principles represented by the Ripken name, the power of Cal, Jr. as a modern day hero and role model, and the universal appeal of baseball. We strive to provide once-in-a-lifetime experiences that use the magic of the big leagues to inspire kids to be the best that they can be…to dream a dream that someday they can achieve great things.

http://www.volunteersofamerica.org/xq/CFM/content_item_id.2761/folder_id.110/qx/tier3_cd.cfm

A generous philanthropist, Ripken’s history of community involvement exemplifies the same type of dedication and commitment he is famous for on the field. The Kelly and Cal Ripken, Jr. Foundation, established in 1992, expands upon the Ripkens’ charitable and personal giving with a mission of aiding local adult and family literacy programs.
Most recently, he joined with his family to honor his father by founding the Cal Ripken, Sr. Foundation. The foundation seeks to fulfill its mission of using baseball as a tool for helping young people develop positive character traits such as leadership, teamwork and good sportsmanship.


http://www.abca.org/topnav/awards/Cal%20Ripken%20Bio.html
The Baltimore Reads Ripken Learning Center to promote adult and family literacy and The Kelly G. Ripken Program at Johns Hopkins Hospital to assist with thyroid education and patient care are among the programs supported by the Foundation. In honor of his record-breaking feat in 1995, The Cal Ripken Jr./Lou Gehrig ALS Research Fund was established to help find a cure for amyotrophic lateral sclerosis or “Lou Gehrig’s Disease”.

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/press/1998/FEBRUARY/ripken.html

Kelly Ripken Establishes Thyroid Disorders Education and Patient Care Program
Wife of Orioles Star Donates $250,000 for Hopkins Center,
So Others Won't Suffer as She Did

http://www.nationalsportsagency.com/cripken.html
Locally, the Ripkens continue to support adult literacy through Baltimore Reads, Inc. and events like Winterfest '91, a memorabilia show which raised more than $200,000. In addition, the Reading, Runs, and Ripken program was developed, which challenges local businesses and residents to donate money based on the number of RBI Cal hits during a season.

http://myhero.com/myhero/hero.asp?hero=c_ripken_northfield
While Cal Ripken has been a hero to millions of fans throughout his baseball career, he also has been a hero to many charitable causes. Recently, Ripken was honored by the Phoenix Foundation for Children, along with former Russian President Mikhail Gorbachev.

http://www.voa.org/xq/CFM/content_item_id.2690/folder_id.108/qx/tier3_cd.cfm
Baseball Great Cal Ripken to be Honored Nov. 17 By Volunteers of America for Helping Kids

*edit* I wanted to give Barry an equal attempt at being charitable.
Type in Barry Bonds Charity in Google and you get...

http://www.intellectualconservative.com/article4402.html
Barry Bonds hates white people.

In an excerpt from former Chicago White Sox player Ron Kittle’s book, Ron Kittle's Tales from the White Sox Dugout, that appeared in suburban Chicago’s Southtown News newspaper on May 31, Kittle quotes Bonds as saying, "I don't sign [autographs] for white people."

The setting was the visitors’ clubhouse at the Chicago Cubs’ Wrigley Field home in 1993, when Bonds’ San Francisco Giants had come to town. Kittle, by then retired from the game, had asked Bonds to sign two jerseys he’d worn in games, so that Kittle could auction them for Indiana Sports Charities, his charity helping kids with cancer.

I paid about $110 of my own money for them, so they could be auctioned off at the golf outing. I did that all the time for stars like Mark McGwire, Sammy Sosa, Derek Jeter and Roger Clemens. When I tell them how their autographs help the cause, every player gladly signs — with one exception.

I walked up to Bonds at his locker in the Wrigley Field visitors' clubhouse, introduced myself and said, "Barry, if you sign these, they'll bring in a lot of money for kids who need help.

Bonds stood up, looked me in the eye and said, "I don't sign for white people." If lightning hits me today, I will swear those were his exact words. Matt Williams and other Giants were in the room and they heard what Bonds said.

I stood there for a minute, and the veins in my neck were popping. I've only been that mad a few times in my life. I was going to beat the (heck) out of him, really kick his (butt), but Williams saw what was happening, so he came over and got between us. Matt said, "Ron, that's just the way he is."

The Southland News reported that Bonds’ spokeswoman and a Giants’ spokesman both declined comment on the story.

[yanksphan]

Bonds and Ripken should never be in the same sentence.

*edit* I wanted to give Barry an equal attempt at being charitable.
Type in Barry Bonds Charity in Google and you get...

http://www.intellectualconservative.com/article4402.html

uh...first thing that came up in Google was this:

http://www.allstarz.org/users/barrybonds/charity.htm


Barry Bonds Charity

A legendary ballplayer on the field and a great humanitarian off the field, Bonds contributes much of his time and efforts to the charities below:



United Way of America
701 North Fairfax Street
Alexandria, VA 22314
(703) 836-7112
http://www.unitedway.org (http://www.unitedway.org/)

United Way of the Bay Area
50 California St
Ste 200
San Francisco, CA 94111-4605
(415) 772-4300
http://www.theunitedway.com (http://www.theunitedway.com/)

The Bonds Family Foundation / United Way of Bay Area

- assists underpriviledged children
- "Bridge to the Future" campaign / provides schools and families with Playstations and learning software
- Link N' Learn program (connects children and parents with tutoring services and interactive educational technology)
- Bonds Private School Scholarship Fund
- board member of United Way of the Bay Area
- involved with bone marrow campaign fundraising drive for African-Americans with leukemia, blood-related disorders
- appeared in PSA regarding bone marrow campaign

United Way

- donated $100,000 to United Way for families of victims from Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, giving $10,000 per HR following tragedy


"The Bonds Squad" / Make-a-Family program

- purchases 50 seats at home games throughout the summer months


Serra High School (San Mateo, Calif.) - alma mater

- established scholarship fund for African-American student based on academics, athletics and community service


Giants/Nortel Networks Reading Program
http://www.sanfranciscogiants.com (http://www.sanfranciscogiants.com/)

- lends his image to promotional materials for summer reading program


California Police Athletic League "Stop the Violence" campaign

- appeared in promotional billboards


Baseball Tomorrow Fund

- national spokesperson
- appeared in PSA


Adopt a Special Kid
7700 Edgewater Drive, Suite 320
Oakland, CA 94621
(510) 553-1748 OR (888) 680-7349
Fax: (510) 553-1747
Email: info@adoptaspecialkid.org (info@adoptaspecialkid.org)
http://www.adoptaspecialkid.org (http://www.adoptaspecialkid.org/)

- has donated $100,000 since 1993
- honored by the organization for contributions
- pledges $10,000 per year, $100 for each home run, stolen base and RBI
- has co-hosted celebrity baseball game fundraiser with Michael Bolton


Cardiac Arrhythmias Research and Education Foundation
2082 Michelson Drive
#301
Irvine, CA 92612
(949) 752-2273 OR (800) 404-9500
http://www.longqt.org (http://www.longqt.org/)

- works with young athletes

I don't care for the guy much, buy don't cherry pick to prove a point....

[Snatch Catch]

Bonds and Ripken should never be in the same sentence.

Absolutely. Ripken isn't half the baseball player Bonds is.

[ShaneTravis]

uh...first thing that came up in Google was this:

http://www.allstarz.org/users/barrybonds/charity.htm



I don't care for the guy much, buy don't cherry pick to prove a point....
[/size][/font]

No, cherry picking. I thought the charity he did with Michael Bolton was a failure.
Honestly I didn't even know about this one.
I am very, very familar with Ripken and his charities. Hence the zealousness.
There was an interesting article on Bonds and his trying time and time again to start up charitable organizations more for tax purposes. I will try and find the article.

[yanksphan]

No, cherry picking. I thought the charity he did with Michael Bolton was a failure.
Honestly I didn't even know about this one.
I am very, very familar with Ripken and his charities. Hence the zealousness.
There was an interesting article on Bonds and his trying time and time again to start up charitable organizations more for tax purposes. I will try and find the article.

That's textbook cherry picking! You ignore Google search results AND the charities I posted - except for the articles that suppport your stance. Now you'll go look for an article discrediting his charities?

Come on...it's clear you have an agenda, while your post above states you want to give him "an equal attempt at being charitable."

[Mr. Mxylsplk]

There was an interesting article on Bonds and his trying time and time again to start up charitable organizations more for tax purposes. I will try and find the article.
You're being silly. Bonds gives lots of time and money to charities just as Ripken does. There may be many reasons to distinguish between the two of them, but suggesting that Ripken gives to the community in a way Bonds does not is simply wrong. I don't like Bonds. But denying the good things he does is just silly.

[Snatch Catch]

http://www.slate.com/id/110620/

[ShaneTravis]

uh...first thing that came up in Google was this:

http://www.allstarz.org/users/barrybonds/charity.htm



I don't care for the guy much, buy don't cherry pick to prove a point....
[/size][/font]

http://www.eastbayexpress.com/Issues/2001-08-22/news/cityside.html
Here is an interesting aritcle.

'The Charitable Mr. Bonds
Athlete charities can help -- or hurt -- a star's image. Just ask..."

Dated 2001.
But for all the good PR a charity can bring a pro athlete, there's also some real risks attached to fronting a nonprofit organization. News investigations of athlete charities over the years have regularly found that the high-profile organizations often suffer from mismanagement, nepotism, bloated overhead, sloppy bookkeeping, fund-raisers (sometimes called "fun-raisers") so lavish that they lose money, and lack of nonprofit expertise.

Despite earning a few complimentary nods in the press including a write-up in the Los Angeles Times, the event itself was a financial disaster. It didn't earn one penny for charity, financial records filed with the California Attorney General's Registry of Charitable Trusts indicate. In fact, the gala cost nearly $100,000 more than it took in. (Bonds would later abandon the star-studded gala as a fund-raising tool, instead opting to finance the foundation primarily with his own money.) Between December 1995 and April 1997, the attorney general's office sent the Bonds Foundation at least three separate warnings for filing either incomplete, contradictory, or late financial reports.

"And the baseball star also wanted to improve the administration of his faltering foundation.

Bonds to hire San Francisco attorney Betsy Adler of Silk, Adler & Colvin. Shortly after Adler and her crew came aboard, they found irregularities in the Bonds Foundation's finances. The law firm's most disturbing finding: Its new client had tapped nearly $77,398 from the foundation to pay the baseball star's longtime publicist, from 1995 through 1997. The transactions seemed to violate federal tax rules prohibiting self-dealing.

So why do athletes like Barry Bonds continue to form their own foundations despite the risk of unwanted investigation? While many athletes say they want to give back to the community and share their good fortune with the less fortunate, a sports marketing consultant quoted by Forbes magazine in March 2000 expressed a more cynical view: "It's a way to build the brand."

If Bonds is really giving money away to the people great move and I applaud it.
While lliving in San Fran. a constant topic was Bonds's on field /off field life.
I can honestly say the only reports I ever heard form his charitable side were full-blown diasters.

Couple that with the comments I hear in the press....."Ron Kittle incident", and the ever popular.....
Asked by a juror why he didn’t buy “a mansion” for his trainer, Bonds answered: “One, I’m black, and I’m keeping my money. And there’s not too many rich black people in this world. There’s more wealthy Asian people and Caucasian and white. And I ain’t giving my money up.”
With comments like that I honestly didn't think the man gave away money.

My POV on the subject has to do with Ripken versus Bonds in the "Humanitarian Affairs".
Ripken is really in a class by himself as is Jeter and the like....
My feelings on Bonds is he is not a very giving person. Maybe I should have done a little more research on Bonds. But, don't think it was a hatchet job stemming from hate towards Barry. I knew where to get the links for Ripken since I am very familar with his work within the community. I should not have dismissed Bonds as easily as I did.

[ShaneTravis]

That's textbook cherry picking! You ignore Google search results AND the charities I posted - except for the articles that suppport your stance. Now you'll go look for an article discrediting his charities?

Come on...it's clear you have an agenda, while your post above states you want to give him "an equal attempt at being charitable."


Agenda? Brother, having intimate knowledge with 501 c (3), fund raisers, donating profits to shelters, childrens charities.....

If Barry Bonds or anyone giving money away to any and all less fortunate I will stand up and applaud. And that is the truest thing you will hear today.

[Snatch Catch]

Ripken is really in a class by himself as is Jeter and the like....


Ripken is certainly not in a class by himself when it comes to athletes giving time and money to charitable orginazations.

Not even close, really.

He certainly has done significant work, though.


Putting him in a class by himself is buying into the irrational love affair that the media has with him.

[ShaneTravis]

Absolutely. Ripken isn't half the baseball player Bonds is.

A funny and airy comment.

I am in no way comparing Bonds and Ripken on the field.

[ShaneTravis]

Ripken is certainly not in a class by himself when it comes to athletes giving time and money to charitable orginazations.

Not even close, really.

He certainly has done significant work, though.


Putting him in a class by himself is buying into the irrational love affair that the media has with him.

I was never a fan of the O's and the "Ripken" way. And how the media hero worshipped.

I am a huge fan of his contributions to childrens charities. And honestly Snatch....Baseball is a pastime, entertainment, I am a spectator no more no less.

Time devoted to things outside of one's own entertainment and "giving back" (for lack of a better term) is very real to all of us not just myself.

[yanksphan]

Agenda? Brother, having intimate knowledge with 501 c (3), fund raisers, donating profits to shelters, childrens charities.....

If Barry Bonds or anyone giving money away to any and all less fortunate I will stand up and applaud. And that is the truest thing you will hear today.

I didn't question your knowledge of the intricacies of charity work.

I just find it odd that you continue to try and discredit the guy by ignoring his efforts, all the while stating how you would be the first to applaud his efforts.

[Mean Linguine]

That's definitely true. Bonds is a first-class jerk, but he definitely gets it played up due to him being such a jerk to the media as well. Play nice, and things get overlooked and underreported a lot more.

That's human nature, isn't it? If you have a guy like Tino who is a solid pro and is friendly and humble, aren't you going to be more likely to give him a free pass than somebody like Bonds who is a superstar but is mostly uncooperative and arrogant? That's not just media; that's in all facets of life. The manager at Burger King will give more of a break to his employee who has a track record of being dependable and courteous than he will to an employee who is unreliable and surly.

[Snatch Catch]

A funny and airy comment.

I am in no way comparing Bonds and Ripken on the field.

If on the field "accomplishments" have no bearing, then Ripken wouldn't be viewed in nearly the same light that he is in regards to his charitable donations.

There are many more athletes that give so much more of their time and effort than Cal, but go unrecognized because one or more of the following:

1) They do it in anonymity

2) They aren't very good in the sport in which they participate

3) They haven't been unjustly canonized by the media and fans

4) They don't have as much money to give

[Mean Linguine]

I was at Ripken's last weekend at Yankee Stadium. Standing ovation every at bat. Everyone says how knowledegable Yankee fans are; so they must have appreciated something that he did.
Think Bonds will get that reception for his last game at Yankee Stadium?
And how did this thread turn into a bashing of Cal Ripken? Was it his fault that Bonds won't bat second?

[ShaneTravis]

I didn't question your knowledge of the intricacies of charity work.

I just find it odd that you continue to try and discredit the guy by ignoring his efforts, all the while stating how you would be the first to applaud his efforts.

ohh believe me, no harm no foul. I wasn't being confrontational at all (certainly not to you) maybe I was being a little harsh on Barry.

Honestly, I thought the guy did nothing charitable. I stand corrected.
And in all honesty, someday (knock on wood) there will be a thread up and you will see my agenda...I always feel reluctant to post on anything outside of baseball....since this is the objective of the site. I also am not a big self promoter but I am glad we had this discussion. I always love discussing real world topics and I usually escape that by talking about Obp.......lol

[Snatch Catch]

I was at Ripken's last weekend at Yankee Stadium. Standing ovation every at bat. Everyone says how knowledegable Yankee fans are; so they must have appreciated something that he did.
Think Bonds will get that reception for his last game at Yankee Stadium?
And how did this thread turn into a bashing of Cal Ripken? Was it his fault that Bonds won't bat second?

Cal Ripken is just as unfairly portrayed as a good guy, as Barry Bonds is a bad guy, by the media.

The comparison of Bonds to Ripken, with Ripken representing absolute good needed to be debunked, in my view.

[Snatch Catch]

There are so many people in the world of sports doing good things with almost every breath they take, yet not recieving the accolades that more famous athletes get for simply writing a big check.

Adonyle Foyle (http://www.adonalfoyle.com/democracy_matters.shtml) comes to mind, although even he has started to get much more exposure (and rightfully so.) Another link to Adonal's work (http://www.democracymatters.org/)

There are famous athletes, too, who do not recieve accolades because their public reputation is tarnished or because they make their contributions anonymously (i.e Randy Johnson and Tony Gwynn.)

[yanksphan]

ohh believe me, no harm no foul. I wasn't being confrontational at all (certainly not to you) maybe I was being a little harsh on Barry.

Honestly, I thought the guy did nothing charitable. I stand corrected.
And in all honesty, someday (knock on wood) there will be a thread up and you will see my agenda...I always feel reluctant to post on anything outside of baseball....since this is the objective of the site. I also am not a big self promoter but I am glad we had this discussion. I always love discussing real world topics and I usually escape that by talking about Obp.......lol

No worries...Barry can take it. ;)

[Mean Linguine]

There are so many people in the world of sports doing good things with almost every breath they take, yet not recieving the accolades that more famous athletes get for simply writing a big check.

Adonyle Foyle (http://www.adonalfoyle.com/democracy_matters.shtml) comes to mind, although even he has started to get much more exposure (and rightfully so.) Another link to Adonal's work (http://www.democracymatters.org/)

There are famous athletes, too, who do not recieve accolades because their public reputation is tarnished or because they make their contributions anonymously (i.e Randy Johnson and Tony Gwynn.)

No question about that. But my big problem with Bonds is that he subscribes to the catch-less-flies-with-vinegar option. That, and he's going to break the great Hank Aaron's record with a suspiciously bigger body -- not counting the 75-pound chip on his shoulder.

[Kulish29]

Shut the f*ck up, you arrogant douche.

Sorry, there's too much candy coating in this post. What are you really trying to say?

[Snatch Catch]

No question about that. But my big problem with Bonds is that he subscribes to the catch-less-flies-with-vinegar option. That, and he's going to break the great Hank Aaron's record with a suspiciously bigger body -- not counting the 75-pound chip on his shoulder.

I certainly don't take umbrage with anything you've said. He's ornery, but even worse, he's ornery about the fact that he effectively got caught cheating.

I just don't like seeing one guy take the fall for everyone simply because he's standoffish, and even hostile.

[Mean Linguine]

I certainly don't take umbrage with anything you've said. He's ornery, but even worse, he's ornery about the fact that he effectively got caught cheating.

I just don't like seeing one guy take the fall for everyone simply because he's standoffish, and even hostile.

Agreed. He does take a lot of heat. I want to like him, but he makes it really hard.

[NYYBombshell]

Sorry, there's too much candy coating in this post. What are you really trying to say?


:lol: :lol:

[Jersey Yankee]

I certainly don't take umbrage with anything you've said. He's ornery, but even worse, he's ornery about the fact that he effectively got caught cheating.

I just don't like seeing one guy take the fall for everyone simply because he's standoffish, and even hostile.
I must've missed something. What did Barry get caught doing?

As to his attitude, he seems very standoffish, as you'd mentioned, and a bit antisocial. Between the steroids allegations and the attitude, it's no wonder Selig decided to can his race to 700 last season.

[BillBuckner]

Giants are going to finish in last place.

[jonnyc39]

I just hope he never wins a World Series title. He can have the record for all I care, because records mean very little to me. Championships are what matters. Anyway, in my mind, he is not half the player Hank Aaron was, or Willie Mays for that matter! He'll go into the hall of fame without a World Series title, something that is very rare these days. 7 MVP awards, zero World Series titles. That should show you what he played the game for - a paycheck. He is the exact example of what is bad for baseball. His father must be turning over in his grave....
Somehow I missed this comment when I first read it.

Barry Bonds is bad for baseball? You couldn't be more wrong, IMO. Go take a look at Giants road attendance figures from 2004. Now compare those numbers to when Barry wasn't playing in 2005. Barry Bonds draws people to the ballpark - and in a sport that is now finally regaining widespread popularity after the '94 strike, that is very good for baseball.

[Hitman23]

You gotta do what your manager says. This is absurd.

[Hitman23]

Barry Bonds is bad for baseball? You couldn't be more wrong, IMO. Barry's stats are obviously impressive. No one denies that. But the man is bad for baseball as a personality. If he'd STFU and just hit then fine. Things like this set a precident. What if he gets what he wants? How would you feel if A-Rod questioned Torre on batting 2nd when he was asked to? Or even refused? It's pathetic. The man needs to do what he's told by his manager and just do what he does best.

[DontHateOnNumber2]

Barry is such a punk. I hope Felipe doesn't back down and holds up what he said. If Bonds doesn't like it, then hopefully Alou deals with it accordingly.

[Mr. Mxylsplk]

Things like this set a precident. What if he gets what he wants? How would you feel if A-Rod questioned Torre on batting 2nd when he was asked to? Or even refused? It's pathetic. The man needs to do what he's told by his manager and just do what he does best.
I agree, but I think it speaks as poorly of the Giants if they cave in to him. Bonds' behavior isn't to be excused, but the Giants only contribute to it with how much they've catered to him over the years.

[jonnyc39]

Barry's stats are obviously impressive. No one denies that. But the man is bad for baseball as a personality. If he'd STFU and just hit then fine. Things like this set a precident. What if he gets what he wants? How would you feel if A-Rod questioned Torre on batting 2nd when he was asked to? Or even refused? It's pathetic. The man needs to do what he's told by his manager and just do what he does best.
The argument can be made that Barry's actions are bad for his team. But not bad for baseball. Just watch attendance go back up next season when he's in the lineup again.

[Hitman23]

I agree, but I think it speaks as poorly of the Giants if they cave in to him. Bonds' behavior isn't to be excused, but the Giants only contribute to it with how much they've catered to him over the years.I completely agree. They have to do what's best for them, not Barry. And if they cave, shame on them.

The argument can be made that Barry's actions are bad for his team. But not bad for baseball. Just watch attendance go back up next season when he's in the lineup again.The reason I say it's bad for baseball is that who's to say the next greatest baseball superstar doesn't try to pull the same stunt with his manager? And he gets away with it? Then you get it in the minds of the players that it's them who dictate their role on the team, not the team's management. i only see bad things happeneing if these types of things are allowed to happen. No one is bigger then the game, even Barry.

If you're talking purely from an attendance and revenue standpoint, yes Barry brings them in. But for the game itself, the man is a horror show.