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JeffWeaverFan
12-21-05, 03:24 AM
I think we need to do that Sturtze and Henn/Proctor for Jason Michaels deal, stick him in RF, and move Sheffield to 1B/DH.

1.) SS Derek Jeter
2.) CF Johnny Damon
3.) DH Jason Giambi
4.) 3B Alex Rodriguez
5.) 1B Gary Sheffield
6.) LF Hideki Matsui
7.) RF Jason Michaels
8.) C Jorge Posada
9.) 2B Robinson Cano

Absolutely sick.
I like that idea, although I don't want to give up Henn.

I'm just worried about Damon in a couple years - I fear it will be a bad site.

OK, it's bed time for me.

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:25 AM
Question: Did Damon say anything bad about A-Rod when all the Sox players came out against him saying he wasn't a true Yankee? Or did he say anything in his book about A-Rod? I don't remember him saying anything off the top of my head, but maybe someone else has a better memory of it all.

You'll love this and have to trust me on this - I even once made mention of it in an old thread.

Damon, whenever he spoke of the Yanks, ALWAYS heaped praise on either the team or an individual player. He always showed the utmost respect for the Yanks unlike some of his scum teammates. I'm talking about EVERY time the two teams met and whenever a reporter asked him a question about the Yanks during the season when they weren't playing one another. I remember thinking to myself, "He's not a bad guy at all." He and Wakefield were the two most standup guys on the Sox.

However he DID knock A-Rod's slap in the WS in his book but QUICKLY publicly apologized to A-Rod for including that. Damon pulls no punches and speaks his mind as well. He'll be refreshing in the Yanks clubhouse.

27IsNext
12-21-05, 03:28 AM
Oh....my.....God. If Michael continues his OBP tear, your team won't be stopped.

Aye, and he'd also provide decent defense in right. We also need to make sure the bench actually has useful players. I'm okay with Phillips and Stinnett on the roster, but the backup IF and OF spots need to be filled. I'd like Eduardo Perez to be given the PH/Backup DH spot and Miguel Cairo as the backup IFer (I think he'd be okay if he was in a limited role). As for the backup OF spot, find someone who can hit a little that plays good D and can steal a base.

Nuke LaLoosh
12-21-05, 03:28 AM
I relaize why a lot of people are having a bad reaction to the idea of Damon "filling" Bernie's shoes. Others made the point that we learned to love Roger. I think the difference is JD is coming straight from the Sawks after a couple of dramatic seasons.

Bernie will go down in history as one of the great Yankee legends, but his time is past. Damon will certainly be more productive at the plate and while his arm isn't much better, he will get to balls Bernie would two-hop.

I say if he helps the team that is most important. Seems to be a reasonably good chance he will.

-Nuke

sugmasterflex
12-21-05, 03:30 AM
:giveup:

...crap.

This has Steinbrenner written all over it.


4/52 and a no trade clause?


:argh:

MiamiKat
12-21-05, 03:33 AM
Not bad.
Damon also publicly acknowledged Mo during Game 1 of the 2004 ALCS after Mo came back from Panama after the tragedy that occurred at his house. (Johnny was playing CF and as Mo entered the bullpen, he turned around & tipped his cap...or something like that.)

Also Damon (and Arroyo, IIRC) were the only two Red Sox to give interviews following 2004 ALCS Game 3. Given the hole the team was in at that point, that was a pretty stand-up thing to do.

Damon may have been The Face of the Idiots, but he's not their mouthpiece.

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:34 AM
Does anyone else besides me think that the Yanks have been a mechanical, sometimes boring team? Damon just lit 8 fires under each one of their @sses. They will be an exciting team to watch.

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 03:36 AM
Not sure it anyone posted the Rosenthal article yet but it is kind of funny, he thinks the Sox are crumbling:

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5185288

Some highlights:

"Time for a new curse. Time to organize a search party for former GM Theo Epstein. Time to panic, as only New England can."

"Maybe Damon was unsettled by the chaos in the Red Sox's front office. Maybe he didn't trust Schilling and Josh Beckett to stay healthy. Maybe he took a look at the Sox's revamped infield Kevin Youkilis at first, Mark Loretta at second, a player to be named at short and Mike Lowell at third and said, "See ya!""

"You know the rest of the names: Gary Sheffield, Hideki Matsui, Jason Giambi, etc. The Yankees boast a surplus of starting pitchers. They've added four relievers since the end of the season. And now they've filled their biggest need, though they surely will start fretting about the possibility of Andy Phillips playing first base.

The Red Sox should have such problems."

JeffWeaverFan
12-21-05, 03:37 AM
:giveup:

...crap.

This has Steinbrenner written all over it.


4/52 and a no trade clause?


:argh:
I actually think this is Cash and the rest of the Yankee organization. We wouldn't go past 4 years but were willing to give more $$$ per year. The no trade clause probably won't matter that much anyways.

JeffWeaverFan
12-21-05, 03:38 AM
You'll love this and have to trust me on this - I even once made mention of it in an old thread.

Damon, whenever he spoke of the Yanks, ALWAYS heaped praise on either the team or an individual player. He always showed the utmost respect for the Yanks unlike some of his scum teammates. I'm talking about EVERY time the two teams met and whenever a reporter asked him a question about the Yanks during the season when they weren't playing one another. I remember thinking to myself, "He's not a bad guy at all." He and Wakefield were the two most standup guys on the Sox.

However he DID knock A-Rod's slap in the WS in his book but QUICKLY publicly apologized to A-Rod for including that. Damon pulls no punches and speaks his mind as well. He'll be refreshing in the Yanks clubhouse.
Sounds good. He's not a bad guy. But, I wonder how much he's got left in those legs. I'm concerned - he did fall off at the end of the season.

27IsNext
12-21-05, 03:38 AM
Does anyone else besides me think that the Yanks have been a mechanical, sometimes boring team? Damon just lit 8 fires under each one of their @sses. They will be an exciting team to watch.

Tony Pena and Larry Bowa will do more for that than Damon, IMO.

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:39 AM
Almost as stunning as Damon's decision to sign with Boston's storied archrival was that the Red Sox did not learn of Damon's decision until they were contacted by reporters last night. CEO Larry Lucchino, who already has endured intense criticism in the wake of Theo Epstein's unexpected departure as general manager Oct. 31, was in charge of the Damon negotiations and said last night he had not been told of a deal by either Damon or his agent, Scott Boras.

''We have received no such notification," Lucchino said in an e-mail after having referred to ''ongoing negotiations" with Damon in an earlier e-mail. ''No further comment."

Red Sox chairman Tom Werner, reached by telephone last night, also said he was unaware of Damon's agreement with the Yankees.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/12/21/damon_jumps_to_yankees/

Ahahahahahahahahaha

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:40 AM
Tony Pena and Larry Bowa will do more for that than Damon, IMO.

Dayum it's gonna be fun. :lol:

One thing about Torre- he'll keep Bowa in line.

Nuke LaLoosh
12-21-05, 03:40 AM
His fall off was due to a shoulder injury. No indication that it will be lingering or chronic. He should be 100% at traning camp.

MiamiKat
12-21-05, 03:42 AM
http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/12/21/damon_jumps_to_yankees/

Ahahahahahahahahaha
Clowned. :D

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 03:43 AM
Scott Miller also being pretty funny:


Good news for Red Sox fans, though, is the New England edition of "It's a Wonderful Life" remains available for purchase this Christmas season from a video store near you.

Every game of the '03 postseason, in its entirety, on DVD.

Those echoes may have to last longer than they ever expected in Boston.

OH NO HE DIDN'T!!!!!!

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:44 AM
Getting Damon was like picking up a full game in the standings...def. left Boston with a big hole.

c Varitek
1b Youkilis
2b Loretta
ss ??
3b Lowell
lf Idiot Savant
cf ??
rf Contrivedly Dirty Uniform Guy
dh Ortiz

Perhaps we see a rekindling of the Manny - Milledge/Floyd talks.

And they should def. explore any or all of Baez, Lugo, Huff again.

dabomb2045
12-21-05, 03:44 AM
It's scary to see Olney, Sherman, and Rosenthal all of a sudden write positive articles about the Yanks....and slam the Sox for letting Damon go.

I dont know how to react to this....all we need is a positive column from Lupica :eek:

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 03:46 AM
Here is some Shaughnessey for y'all - I know I shouldn't but I am posting the whole column.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/12/21/for_sox_a_little_off_the_top/


No way around this one. Johnny Damon is a Yankee and it looks like the Red Sox don't know what they are doing. Time for Ben Cherington and Jed Hoyer to say hello to Lou Gorman and Dan Duquette. Looks like John Henry, Tom Werner, and Larry Lucchino finally know what it feels like to be Haywood Sullivan, Buddy LeRoux, and/or John Harrington.

While New England slept last night, Damon got into bed with the enemy. Sox officials smugly believed there was no market for their marquee center fielder and the Yankees took advantage of Boston's big sleep.

Damon agreed to a four-year, $52 million pact with the Yankees sometime yesterday and when Sox CEO Larry Lucchino got home at 11 last night, all he could say was, ''We don't have comments on ongoing negotiations. We have received no such notification [of Damon signing with the Yankees]. We have not been notified of any such deal."

Asked if it would be standard procedure for the Sox to be made aware of their free agent center fielder signing with another team, Lucchino said, ''It's generally customary."

So now your Boston Red Sox have no center fielder, no shortstop, and no first baseman to go along with no Theo Epstein and no clue. It's fair to say this is becoming a winter of discontent in Red Sox Nation. Ben and Jed and Craig and Larry and Tom and John and Crosby, Stills & Nash can spin this anyway they want, but Sox fans can't escape the conclusion that there's chaos at the top. The Josh Beckett trade bought some goodwill and glad tidings, but losing Damon to the Yankees is a devastating blow to the foundation of the Nation.

The Sox won't recover from this one easily. In an already dismal offseason, they've now lost their center fielder and their leadoff hitter. They've also lost a local icon, a rare favorite of teenage girls and fanboy bloggers. Losing Damon hurts them on the field and in the arena of popular opinion. And losing Damon to the Yankees compounds the damage. When Alex Rodriguez got away a couple of years ago, Sox fans were fairly quick to scorn A-Rod and move forward.

Losing Damon won't draw the same reaction. The Idiot center fielder is Johnny Angel with Sox fans and his production in pinstripes will be a personal affront to Red Sox fans around the world.

Damon was quick to say he'll get on board, and cut his hair and shave to conform to Yankee ways. An all-too-modern ballplayer, he switched allegiance from Boston to New York before you could say, ''the New York Times owns 17 percent of the Red Sox."

Here's what Damon told Channel 4: ''They were coming after me aggressively. We know George Steinbrenner's reputation. He always wants to have the best players. He showed that tonight. He and Brian Cashman came after me hard. Now I'm part of the Yankees and that great lineup. We're going to be tough to beat."

We? Johnny, how could you? It took only a few minutes and $52 million to make you start calling the Yankees ''we."

Actually, it's pretty easy to understand. For all of his athletic gifts, we always knew Johnny had the depth of your average kiddie pool, and it's therefore entirely believable that he could invoke the royal Yankee ''we" so quickly.

He had no problem hanging the Sox brass out to dry.

''I tried everything in my power to come back," he told Channel 4's Steve Burton. ''I made contact with them [the Sox]. I talked to Tito [Sox manager Terry Francona]. I told them they need to really get going because, if not, I'm going to be on another team. Unfortunately, Boston had their plans. I'm not sure they knew that I meant it. But now I'm a Yankee and hopefully they can go off and go get the other center fielders they've been courting for the past month or so.

''Our policy with the Yankees is to go out and win, and we're going to try to bring another championship to them. They haven't had a championship since Chuck Knoblauch was there when they had a great leadoff hitter so I think the leadoff role has been underappreciated. A good leadoff hitter is tough to find and I think New York just found the best leadoff hitter in the game."

Thanks, Johnny. Very humble of you.

This signing will polarize the Nation. Most fans will paint the current Sox bosses as buffoons and there's good evidence to support the charge. But others will see Damon as a traitor, a mercenary ballplayer no different than Messrs. Clemens or Boggs. Damon went to the Yankees because they offered him $52 million over four years while the Sox offered $40 million over four. We all know simple Johnny loves to be romanced, and the Apple has Regis and Kelly and infinite possibilities for Johnny and Michelle sightings on Page Six. The Sox certainly couldn't compete with that.

Bottom line: The Yankees just got better and more interesting, and the Red Sox just got worse and more boring. And a Nation is certain to wonder if this would have happened if Theo were still on the job.

Kulish29
12-21-05, 03:47 AM
Even though I still dont like the signing, Damon's a Yankee now and I will root for him just like any other Yankee. At least it's only a 4 year deal. By the 3rd year, one of the many CF prospects we have will be ready.

Welcome Johnny. :gulp:

JavyVazquezIsSick
12-21-05, 03:47 AM
:( A sad day for all Yankee fans...

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:47 AM
It's scary to see Olney, Sherman, and Rosenthal all of a sudden write positive articles about the Yanks....and slam the Sox for letting Damon go.

I dont know how to react to this....all we need is a positive column from Lupica :eek:

It was really weird to see Olney go from bashing to ballwashing...*poof*

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:48 AM
Clowned. :D

:D If nothing else, the signing was worth just that!

Zimmers' Helmet
12-21-05, 03:48 AM
Just for the record, from the beginning I wanted to sign Giles to play RF and Jacque Jones to play CF. But yes, I would have rather had Giles to play CF than Damon to play CF. The reason for that is that Giles is the better player and came off one of his best seasons, while Damon has shown a decline and came off a season where he declined - especially in the power department.

I would hardly say that 15 HR was one of Brian Giles' best seasons. What's your definition of a "better player"? You seem to be placing emphasis on OBP and OPS; but what about as a baserunner or as a CF? You have yet to explain the logic in ignoring age when it comes to Brian Giles but not with Johnny Damon who is 3 years younger?

You prefer Giles or Jacque Jones, yet neither have ever played CF with any regularity in their careers. Johnny Damon is a true CF.

As I stated earlier, the Yankees needed both a centerfielder and someone to help Jeter set the table at the top of the lineup. Johnny Damon fills that criteria better than Jacque Jones or Brian Giles ever could.

The fact that the Yankees held firm on 4 years is actually quite an improvement from what would have transpired between 2000-2004.

ZYanksRule
12-21-05, 03:49 AM
Scott Miller also being pretty funny:



OH NO HE DIDN'T!!!!!!

Oh it burns. Oh, it really burns.


I'm gonna sleep well tongiht.

Peace, people.

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:49 AM
:( A sad day for all Yankee fans...


http://www.homegrocer.com/images/products/kleenex-with-lotion.jpg

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:49 AM
It's scary to see Olney, Sherman, and Rosenthal all of a sudden write positive articles about the Yanks....and slam the Sox for letting Damon go.

I dont know how to react to this....all we need is a positive column from Lupica :eek:

Lupica begged for this one. Let's see if he worms his way out of it now that his beloved Sox are left scrambling.

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:52 AM
Lupica begged for this one. Let's see if he worms his way out of it now that his beloved Sox are left scrambling.

Ah Lupica that "i want it both ways" piece of sh*t...i can't wait to see what he pulls out now.

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:52 AM
Sounds good. He's not a bad guy. But, I wonder how much he's got left in those legs. I'm concerned - he did fall off at the end of the season.

Damon is prone to slumps, funks, whatever you want to call it - sometimes at the beginning, sometimes the middle, sometimes the end of the year. I wouldn't read too much into the slump at the end of last season, it was just bad timing. I liken him to Matsui in that regard. But even when Damon is slumping he makes things happen

At the end of every year his numbers look good.

DeputyFife
12-21-05, 03:53 AM
I was thinking about this earlier, I'd still bat Jeter first, and I want Arod 3rd, and Giambi 4th. Something like this...

Jeter
Damon
Arod
Giambi
Sheff
Matsui
Posada
Cano
Bernie

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:54 AM
Damon is prone to slumps, funks, whatever you want to call it - sometimes at the beginning, sometimes the middle, sometimes the end of the year. I wouldn't read too much into the slump at the end of last season, it was just bad timing. I liken him to Matsui in that regard. But even when Damon is slumping he makes things happen

At the end of every year his numbers look good.

Kind of like how he was abysmal in the ALCS and then all of a sudden in Game 7 he sodomizes Javier Vazquez.

MiamiKat
12-21-05, 03:54 AM
:D If nothing else, the signing was worth just that!
Seriously.

I'm really surprised Lucchino & Werner were stupid enough to admit they were blindsided. I guess the shock was too much for even those rather experienced dealmakers to put on the poker face and bluff that they were kept in the loop.

27IsNext
12-21-05, 03:54 AM
Was Damon's 2005 UZR released?

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:54 AM
I was thinking about this earlier, I'd still bat Jeter first, and I want Arod 3rd, and Giambi 4th. Something like this...

Jeter
Damon


Not gonna happen. Whether it makes sense or not. It's gonna be Damon-Jeter for sure.

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:56 AM
:D If nothing else, the signing was worth just that!

That, and all the lame-o's can't wear their "Johnny is my homeboy" t-shirts anymore.

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/yhst-63078155599514_1875_10275856

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:57 AM
That, and all the lame-o's can't wear their "Johnny is my homeboy" t-shirts anymore.

:lol: They can always use them to start a fire. It's mighty cold in New England.........this time of year. :D

DeputyFife
12-21-05, 03:58 AM
Not gonna happen. Whether it makes sense or not. It's gonna be Damon-Jeter for sure.

Really I don't think it makes that big of a difference. Just MHO.

Damon
Jeter
Giambi
Arod
Sheff
Matsui
Posada
Cano
Bernie

of

Damon
Jeter
Giambi
Arod
Matsui
Sheff
Cano
Posada
Bernie

cy51
12-21-05, 03:58 AM
Actually, its Jason Gilbert Giambi

Torre, a firm believer in anything he used to do/the media says, will never bat Damon before Jeter.

Do you guys think Damon is a better leadoff hitter than Jeter? Jeter has better OBP and base running skills; the only thing Damon might do better is steal, which Torre barely used even with Lofton or Womack.

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 03:59 AM
Kind of like how he was abysmal in the ALCS and then all of a sudden in Game 7 he sodomizes Javier Vazquez.

Yup. And against yours and my favorite - Jomer Javy.

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 03:59 AM
Really I don't think it makes that big of a difference. Just MHO.



Can't go wrong either way, i'm just sayin that's the way Torre will fill it out :)

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 04:00 AM
:lol: They can always use them to start a fire. It's mighty cold in New England.........this time of year. :D

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/yhst-63078155599514_1875_9172427


"Yes, as a matter of fact we do. Thanks for asking."



http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/yhst-63078155599514_1875_6981077

"He certainly does. The metrosexual look suits him well."

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 04:05 AM
http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/yhst-63078155599514_1875_9172427


"Yes, as a matter of fact we do. Thanks for asking."



http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/yhst-63078155599514_1875_6981077

"He certainly does. The metrosexual look suits him well."

:lol: Imagine grown men wearing those shirts?

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 04:06 AM
Poor Octavio. The back pages are stolen from him just like that.

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 04:10 AM
Poor Octavio. The back pages are stolen from him just like that.

I know I know. I am real excited about him.

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 04:10 AM
:lol: Imagine grown men wearing those shirts?

lol sad, isn't it.

Panamaniac42
12-21-05, 04:15 AM
We've been discussing how Lucchino & Werner were admittedly blindsided.

A lot of people were on here bitching about how we gave Damon 2-3 mil more per year than Boston's offer.

The Lucchino & Werner thing with their pants down just goes to show that this was a case of Brian Cashman shock and awe. If we had gotten into a traditional bidding war, which assumedly would have started in January , we would have ping-ponged offers back and forth and gotten up to 13 mil per for 4 years anyway. By suddenly throwing out the max we were willing to spend, we got what we needed and screwed them without giving them a chance to match.

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 04:37 AM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/story/376614p-319988c.html

Negative Lupica article. Anyone suprised?

plusbrians
12-21-05, 04:39 AM
We've been discussing how Lucchino & Werner were admittedly blindsided.

A lot of people were on here bitching about how we gave Damon 2-3 mil more per year than Boston's offer.

The Lucchino & Werner thing with their pants down just goes to show that this was a case of Brian Cashman shock and awe. If we had gotten into a traditional bidding war, which assumedly would have started in January , we would have ping-ponged offers back and forth and gotten up to 13 mil per for 4 years anyway. By suddenly throwing out the max we were willing to spend, we got what we needed and screwed them without giving them a chance to match.


Damon said in his interview that they did have a chance to match and didn't. In his telephone interview, when asked if he allowed Boston to match, he replied:

""I made contact with them and told [Francona] they really need to get going because if not, I'm going to be on another team," Damon said."

dabomb2045
12-21-05, 04:44 AM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/story/376614p-319988c.html

Negative Lupica article. Anyone suprised?


Lupica is the biggest ass I've ever seen. All offseason this tool has called the Yankees out for NOT spending any money....for allowing the Mets to steal the headlines, allowing the Jays and Sox to get better. He practically begged the Yanks to sign Damon.

So the Yanks do sign him....and does Lupica give credit?? No. He just whines about the payroll.

This f*cker has zero credibility to anyone with half a brain.

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 04:48 AM
Lupica is the biggest ass I've ever seen. All offseason this tool has called the Yankees out for NOT spending any money....for allowing the Mets to steal the headlines, allowing the Jays and Sox to get better. He practically begged the Yanks to sign Damon.

So the Yanks do sign him....and does Lupica give credit?? No. He just whines about the payroll.

This f*cker has zero credibility to anyone with half a brain.

Yeah, he is a hack.

My favorite part of the article was how he said he felt the Yankees should have signed Damon when he left the A's.

Oh Loopy you were so right I wish you were the GM. :barf:

bakntime
12-21-05, 04:49 AM
As for the whole Michaels thing... I really don't see the appeal. By most accounts he's an average outfielder, with less than stellar speed. Couple that with the fact that he hits worse against right handed pitchers, worse on the road (he's played in a great hitter's park in Philly), and he would be a RH hitter coming into RH-hitter-unfriendly YS, and I think you'd have a recipe for a potential NY flop.

2005:

Vs. Lefties: .323 BA, .438 OBP
Vs. Righties: .289 BA, .363 OBP

Home: .328 BA, .428 OBP
Road: .285 BA, .374 OBP

Away from the friendly confines of Philly, having to bat regularly against right handed pitchers as a starter, having to cover significantly more ground in YS than in Philly, not knowing how he would handle the pressure of NY, etc... I just don't see how he's gotten all the attention and praise that he's gotten.

And while I'm thinking about it... Giles never wanted to come here. I don't think he wants any part of a big market on the east coast. All the better that we didn't overpay to drag him here unwillingly only to have him underperform as he declines with age and be discontent with the media pressure after a week where he goes 2-28.

panicfan
12-21-05, 05:01 AM
I like it for baseball reasons, and its a big F.U. to Boston!

Captain Caveman!!!

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 05:03 AM
The Curse of the Lucchino.

drjeckyl
12-21-05, 05:35 AM
I like how people thought a center fielder was going to drop out of the sky.

It now appears, one has.... Jesus, himself!

yankeebot
12-21-05, 05:49 AM
Sooo....I guess this will teach me not to go to bed early. I wake up to this? Excuse me while I work through my grief.

Denial :-hide-:; Anger :-po'd-: ; Bargaining :-poke-: ; Depression :upset: ; Acceptance :giveup:

OK, I'm better now. Welcome to the Bronx, Johnny. It's gonna be fun.

drjeckyl
12-21-05, 05:52 AM
Damon's deficiencies aside, this is the best result for the Yanks...

1) Improves our offense at the expense of our main competition.
2) Allows us to keep our pitching staff and minor leagues intact while forcing your main competition to trade same to find a new replacement.
3) Our defense is no worse than last years, and may have improved because Damon has much better range than Bernie.

And, we could slide Damon to left or right when the time comes, or move him into the DH slot. All things considered, I like this deal!

Time for Johnny to grow up!

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 05:53 AM
Sooo....I guess this will teach me not to go to bed early. I wake up to this? Excuse me while I work through my grief.

Denial :-hide-:; Anger :-po'd-: ; Bargaining :-poke-: ; Depression :upset: ; Acceptance :giveup:

OK, I'm better now. Welcome to the Bronx, Johnny. It's gonna be fun.


Mornin' :D

(And don't try to read through the whole thread)

guidry36
12-21-05, 06:05 AM
1) The Yankees gave up none of their young talent for Damon, so youth was served.
2) We knew from the Giles negotiations that the Yankees had at least $10 million per year budgeted for an outfielder. Signing Dotel instead of Tavarez saves significant additional cash, as does not signing Nomar, therefore making Damon affordable. The Yankees will still be able to reduce payroll, and provide flexibility.
3) Damon is a very good defensive CF. His throwing arm isn't good, but his range is.
Exactly!!
After reading post after post after post trashing this deal, I fail to see how signing Damon does anything but make the Yankees much stronger......as a crippling blow is dealt to boston. I could understand how a 5 year deal would have been difficult to swallow.....but 4 years?? Get over it. Damon can be moved to DH after 3 years if need be. The red sox are done, period. How are they to make up for the hole in their lineup created by this move? How are pitchers supposed to deal with the Yankees lineup?? Defensively, Damon is an upgrade from Bernie. The throwing arm in CF remains the same......but there will be fewer misplays and poor reads. If Bernie will accept a Sierra-type role, I would love to have him back. I don't know if he will want to be the 5th OF or not. Crosby is perfect for the 4th OF. He is solid defensively at all 3 OF spots and can pinch run. We don't need to add a DH. Everyone will be fresher if DH is used as a 1/2 day off for Sheffield, Damon, etc. as needed. Bernie can get some starts at DH. The rest of our lineup can easily support Phillips or Crosby when they start. Give Phillips some at bats before making a decision to replace him. He is out of minor league options....and it isn't too much to ask that he be given a chance. Signing Cairo would be another good move. Let me repeat this: THE red sox ARE DONE.

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 06:13 AM
Nope, they played half. How does that change the point?

Giles numbers at home: .267/.378/.417. Giles numbers away: .333/.463/.545. Yeah, I'd say that park hurt him - as it hurts everyone greatly.

But this isn't about Giles vs. Damon. We couldn't have gotten Giles. This was just about a poster asking me why I wanted Giles for 3 seasons and didn't want Damon for 4. That's the reason.
That isn't true! It's about you stating that Giles is a much better overall ballplayer than Damon which not not takes in hitting ability, but fielding and running the bases. My contention is that though Giles is a better hitter, Damon is a better fit for the Yankees at 32 than Giles is at 35 and the positions they play as well as one guy being a top of the lineup hitter.

Babe Rules
12-21-05, 06:18 AM
Dammit....

Yanks Lifer
12-21-05, 06:19 AM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/story/376614p-319988c.html

Negative Lupica article. Anyone suprised?


This guy is such a complete flaming jacka$$!! Where was he and all the other Yankee naysayers when Toronto threw over $100 million at a sub 500 starter and a closer with less than 50 career saves! Or, when the Dodgers handed Furcal $39 million for three years. He might as well move to Boston and write for the Herald.

Yanks Lifer
12-21-05, 06:27 AM
... Let me repeat this: THE red sox ARE DONE.


The Yankees rule this day and I for one am thrilled, but it's only 12/22. IMO, anyone who thinks the Sox won't also adequately fill their needs by opening day is wrong.

Boogiedown Bomber
12-21-05, 06:36 AM
What a way to wake up to this morning. I don't know how I feel about this deal. Yeah, it is shorter than the 7 years Boras originally wanted, but Johnny Damon in pinstripes???? I just don't know.

guidry36
12-21-05, 06:41 AM
The Yankees rule this day and I for one am thrilled, but it's only 12/22. IMO, anyone who thinks the Sox won't also adequately fill their needs by opening day is wrong.
They can't replace Damon as a leadoff hitter. They can obviously improve CF defensively... and they will come up with something to do with the $$ saved......but they have a lot of work to do......not the least of which would be dealing with Manny. I am not arguing that they won't make some aggressive moves, but they won't replace what Damon did for them. I fail to see how they can come close to matching our lineup. Then again....nothing that happens now truly matters until it is proven in October.....but I will stick to my guns....the red sox are done.

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 06:44 AM
I recommend everyone logging on to WEEI for a listen this morning...

Yanks Lifer
12-21-05, 06:50 AM
I recommend everyone logging on to WEEI for a listen this morning...

I can hear it now, "Damon isn't really that good, and a friend of mine who plows John Henry's driveway said the Sox didn't really plan on bringing him back anyway."

dabomb2045
12-21-05, 06:53 AM
I can hear it now, "Damon isn't really that good, and a friend of mine who plows John Henry's driveway said the Sox didn't really plan on bringing him back anyway."


"Larry Lucchino's psychic told me Damon's shoulder will give out....and he will hit .240 next year. We knew he was never that good anyways"

PirateChief
12-21-05, 06:55 AM
This deal is AWESOME!

1. Johnny Damon is a great hitter
2. He's okay in CF, which realistically is all we could find this year without trading players or prospects
3. We get to keep Pavano, who I feel will really rebound
4. WE GET JOHNNY FREAKING DAMON

I'm so happy.

NYDCYankee
12-21-05, 06:57 AM
I can hear it now, "Damon isn't really that good, and a friend of mine who plows John Henry's driveway said the Sox didn't really plan on bringing him back anyway."


"If you look at Gabe Kapler's stat sheet upside down under a full moon he is a far better player than Damon. And the FO didn't want him back anyway."

hardrain
12-21-05, 06:57 AM
Learning to Love Johnny Therapy Sessions Starting Soon....

Developing

cupcollector99
12-21-05, 07:01 AM
I like how people thought a center fielder was going to drop out of the sky.

My sentiments exactally. Damon fills the hole we've been screaming about for a few years about and most of the posters want to jump off a bridge
I would have been happy with Bubba and Melky but Damon is a proven vet that will improve the spot from day one.

Sorry people, Mickey Mantle and Joe Dimaggio ain't walking through the clubhouse door. Damon is one of the best and from what I hear, he's laid back enough to deal with a move to a corner position when a minor leaguer is ready or a more attractive CFer becomes free in the next few years.

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 07:02 AM
Learning to Love Johnny Therapy Sessions Starting Soon....

Developing

The best way to do it is to dive right in and totally embrace it (even though you know in your mind and heart that it is wrong), then follow up with lots of jokes to ease the lingering pain.

It's not a perfect plan, but it got me through the night.

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 07:06 AM
I believe this signing is somehow Wexy's fault. He went to Florida for 10 days with no internet access yesterday. Clearly the Yankees pulled this stunt while he wasn't around to keep things in check.

montrealer
12-21-05, 07:11 AM
Feel alot like the day the Expos acquired Pete Rose.
:dunno: :uhh: :-po'd-: :enraged: :-rofl-: :-ponder-: :soapbox:

:gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp:


After 10 pints of Guiness you finally have to come to terms with it and move on.

montrealer
12-21-05, 07:13 AM
Learning to Love Johnny Therapy Sessions Starting Soon....

Developing

Any room on that couch? :giveup:

montrealer
12-21-05, 07:22 AM
From BostonDirtDogs:
http://bostondirtdogs.boston.com/Headline_Archives/AR_DJ_JD_shave.jpg

:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:

the_coach
12-21-05, 07:24 AM
This is horrible news.... :upset: :uhh: :barf: :wtf:

Let's hope the Yankees get one good year out of this mess.

BeantownYankee
12-21-05, 07:24 AM
Unfortunately, that's how it's going to be. Sad, because Jeter is the better leadoff hitter.
Jeter is also a great #2 hitter which is what we've lacked for awhile. We now have two leadoff hitters at the top of the order!

cb2u
12-21-05, 07:24 AM
I'm very excited about this deal! I had a feeling this would happen, & I wanted him to be a Yankee ever since he was a FA (pre- Boston).

TongueStripes
12-21-05, 07:25 AM
oh Brother!!!!!!!

mrbawm
12-21-05, 07:33 AM
Terrible deal, we'll be regretting this contract by the end of the season. Cashman is obviously not too sharp.

NewEraYanks2527
12-21-05, 07:46 AM
Terrible deal, we'll be regretting this contract by the end of the season. Cashman is obviously not too sharp. Yea this move sucks, we have a CFer and didn't have to give up anything for him but money, we sure will be regretting it by the end of the season. DAMN YOU CASHMAN FOR FILLING OUR NEEDS, KEEPING OUR PROSPECTS AND NOT DEALING WANG, CANO, or PAVANO IN THE PROCESS!!

Bub
12-21-05, 07:48 AM
RAPUNZEL, RAPUNZEL, THROW DOWN YOUR HAIR!!!.................because it's all coming off.

Oh well...., welcome, Fabio.:-shrug-:

rightfielder21
12-21-05, 07:51 AM
Cashman is obviously not too sharp.

This wasn't a pure Cashman move...

BeantownYankee
12-21-05, 07:51 AM
I can hear it now, "Damon isn't really that good, and a friend of mine who plows John Henry's driveway said the Sox didn't really plan on bringing him back anyway."
Already hearing that on WEEI. As long as he helps us to win a couple of WS the next couple of years that's fine. In the mean time Cash has held onto the youth and draft picks and we can rebuild at the same time.:P

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 07:54 AM
This wasn't a pure Cashman move...
Apparently, he was the one that set the negotiating strategy to sign him and it worked to perfection.

FelipePArantes
12-21-05, 07:55 AM
did it cost Yankees a draft pick?

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 07:55 AM
Asked if the Red Sox had tried to match the $13 million per year offer, Damon told Ch. 4, No, I made contact with them. I talked to Tito (manager Terry Francona) and told them they need to really get going because if not, Im going to be on another team. Unfortunately, Boston has their plans. Im not sure if they knew that I meant it, but now Im a Yankee, and hopefully they can go off and go get the other center fielders theyve been courting for the last month or so.
OUCH, that hurts........

BeantownYankee
12-21-05, 07:56 AM
It's scary to see Olney, Sherman, and Rosenthal all of a sudden write positive articles about the Yanks....and slam the Sox for letting Damon go.

I dont know how to react to this....all we need is a positive column from Lupica :eek:
The fact that Lupica wrote a negative column on this means this is a great move for the Yanks.

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 07:57 AM
did it cost Yankees a draft pick?
A 2nd round pick will now go to Atlanta while the 1st round pick the Yankees lost for signing Farnsworth goes to Boston now for signing Damon. However, the Yankees gets the Phillies 1st round pick and a supplemental 1st round pick.

BeantownYankee
12-21-05, 07:59 AM
Yes, as a matter of fact. Buster Olney made a good observation in that this deal was consummated on the eve of the non-tender deadline. Cashman clearly used the availability of those non-tenders to leverage his negotiations with Boras. I think Damon was ALWAYS the first choice for CF, but rather than show his hand, Cashman was content to sit back, observe the FA market, and make a play for Damon once his alternatives had been established (overpay for a Michaels type player, sign Corey Patterson, etc).

Well played by Cashman. If this had been a Tampa/Steinbrenner move, we'd have been reading newspaper reports since October about how the Yanks were aggressively going after Damon. Cash likes to play it close to the vest, a la the ARod negotiations.
Cash always said the Market would come to them. And it did

yankeebot
12-21-05, 07:59 AM
This wasn't a pure Cashman move...Why not?

George: Get me Damon! I want Damon, dammit! And make him cut that hair. I find it disgusting...yet oddly arousing.
Cash: OK, Boss. But I'm only giving 4 years. How much can we offer?
George: Whatever it takes, boy. Whatever it takes. And do something about that beard. Maybe we should let him keep the hair.

C-BUS CLIPPER
12-21-05, 08:01 AM
Cash always said the Market would come to them. And it did

Great point Beantown.

jnewmark
12-21-05, 08:04 AM
Yea this move sucks, we have a CFer and didn't have to give up anything for him but money, we sure will be regretting it by the end of the season. DAMN YOU CASHMAN FOR FILLING OUR NEEDS, KEEPING OUR PROSPECTS AND NOT DEALING WANG, CANO, or PAVANO IN THE PROCESS!!

Yeah, the nerve of that guy! ;)

mycroft
12-21-05, 08:09 AM
Mycroft sez

"I would be willing to bet before the year is out we get a new CF, either by trade or FA."

Well when I said that I didn't think it would happen before the day ended. :eek:

It is very possible that now Damon is a Yankee all of the Bernie haters in this forum will get an early Christmas present.

Now I will be entertained by threads trashing Damon's lack of a throwing arm. Oh what fun that will be.

Even so, this is a very good move and all the speculations of Jeter or ARod in CF will be quashed for good and we will have a real outfielder in CF PLUS the added bonus of a real leadoff hitter. Not to mention all the fun we will have going to Fenway this year.

Merry Christmas Yankee fans.

ring403
12-21-05, 08:13 AM
This wasn't a pure Cashman move...It's common knowledge that George has been a fan of Damon's for years, but Cashman said from day one this offseason that the Yankees were interested in Damon at 4 years, and no longer. The Yankees made a take it or leave it offer, and Boras bit on it. The Yankees clearly had a dollar figure they had in mind, and they didn't get dragged into a bidding war by Boras. I think this was a calculated organizational decision, made after considering all the other available options.
If it doesn't work, both Cashman and George probably deserve to share responsibility.

BigBats
12-21-05, 08:22 AM
Very pleased with this decision.

StaceyRosie
12-21-05, 08:23 AM
What a way to wake up....screaming "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" at the top of my lungs probably scared the hell out of my neighbors at 5:00a.

RobRiv
12-21-05, 08:24 AM
"The Damon Shift" (the AL East's oddest new defensive alignment) is going to test A-rod's range, as Jeter will have to be re-positioned to short-center to cut-off Johnny's weak-winged throws.

Oh well, this was as cruelly inevitable as Brad Pitt dumping Jennifer Aniston for Angelina Jolie. It's an instant upgrade for Brad (aka the Yanks), but Angie's kinky quirks (aka Damon's deficiencies) make this another celebrity breakup waiting to happen.

utopiapkwy
12-21-05, 08:35 AM
[QUOTE=RobRiv]"The Damon Shift" (the AL East's oddest new defensive alignment) is going to test A-rod's range, as Jeter will have to be re-positioned to short-center to cut-off Johnny's weak-winged throws.

QUOTE]

I dont think that Bernies arm last year was any better than Damon's will be next year, so we ought to be used to this defense.

I like a few parts of this deal: We dont trade any of the kids, we dont cave on our four year max deal, and we get great balance in the order. We havent had a guy who prefers to leadoff consistantly since chucky K threw the ball into the stands. Damon fills a need in the lineup that we didnt really need but would greatly prefer. If he continues to do what he has done the last few years, get 10 pitch AB's, run the bases, run down fly balls, and throw them in badly, I am ok with the overall package, especially considering we stole this package from beneath the boston tanembaum.

ICEBERG18
12-21-05, 08:36 AM
I don't like how ESPN is now talking about the Yankees CFers with DiMaggio then Mantle then Bernie and now... Damon. It just ain't right.


Yeah, I was just about to ask, does anyone esle think that ESPN is going a little bit overboard with this? I mean, we didn't get Albert Pujols.

STNYY
12-21-05, 08:36 AM
I don't care if noodle-arm Johnny wins a batting title next year, $52 M for this aging media darling is the dumbest in a series of dumb moves over recent years. So this is what we get with Cash in charge?

I root for the laundry, but this is a nightmare. Thanks for the memories Yanks, I have better things to do than follow the overpriced soap opera this team has become. What a f'in joke.

mrbawm
12-21-05, 08:37 AM
Mycroft sez

"I would be willing to bet before the year is out we get a new CF, either by trade or FA."

Well when I said that I didn't think it would happen before the day ended. :eek:

It is very possible that now Damon is a Yankee all of the Bernie haters in this forum will get an early Christmas present.

Now I will be entertained by threads trashing Damon's lack of a throwing arm. Oh what fun that will be.

Even so, this is a very good move and all the speculations of Jeter or ARod in CF will be quashed for good and we will have a real outfielder in CF PLUS the added bonus of a real leadoff hitter. Not to mention all the fun we will have going to Fenway this year.

Merry Christmas Yankee fans.

It will certainly be a present for the Bernie haters on this forum. We'll have replaced Bernie's last four years with a completely new version of his last four years. Terrible throwing arm to start, declining fielding abilities early in the four year span and topped off with a below average bat in the last years of the deal. Sounds great.

mycroft
12-21-05, 08:37 AM
"The Damon Shift" (the AL East's oddest new defensive alignment) is going to test A-rod's range, as Jeter will have to be re-positioned to short-center to cut-off Johnny's weak-winged throws.

Oh well, this was as cruelly inevitable as Brad Pitt dumping Jennifer Aniston for Angelina Jolie. It's an instant upgrade for Brad (aka the Yanks), but Angie's kinky quirks (aka Damon's deficiencies) make this another celebrity breakup waiting to happen.

Ah we start already :o

mycroft
12-21-05, 08:38 AM
It will certainly be a present for the Bernie haters on this forum. We'll have replaced Bernie's last four years with a completely new version of his last four years. Terrible throwing arm to start, declining fielding abilities early in the four year span and topped off with a below average bat in the last years of the deal. Sounds great.

Knew you would be pleased :D

StaceyRosie
12-21-05, 08:39 AM
Yeah, I was just about to ask, does anyone esle think that ESPN is going a little bit overboard with this? I mean, we didn't get Albert Pujols.

Well they are Red Sox homers so of course any Red Sox or former Red Sox is going to get the oral tonguebath treatment on ESPN.

RobRiv
12-21-05, 08:39 AM
The more I think about Johnny SuperCuts in Yankee pinstripes, the more I remember how much I hated Javy Vazquez.

We just purchased a $52-million dollar bottle of Bernie-lite, to go with our dollar-an-ounce Becks beers at the Stadium

Seamonk
12-21-05, 08:41 AM
All I can say is let's hope every ball gets hit to Jeter...

STNYY
12-21-05, 08:41 AM
Not to mention all the fun we will have going to Fenway this year.



Yeah, I'll be great watching Josh Beckett K Damon along with the rest of the Yankee lineup. Can't wait.

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 08:43 AM
A positive....

The Yankees already know how to try to compensate for a CFer with no arm.

mrbawm
12-21-05, 08:45 AM
A positive....

The Yankees already know how to try to compensate for a CFer with no arm.

Haha, that's one way of looking at it.

mrbawm
12-21-05, 08:46 AM
Knew you would be pleased :D

On a positive note at least the fans will be patient with Damon because he's an ex Red Sox. I'm sure he'll get the same treatment as Bernie, who was part of the dynasty, when he's on a serious decline.

BeantownYankee
12-21-05, 08:48 AM
Yeah, I'll be great watching Josh Beckett K Damon along with the rest of the Yankee lineup. Can't wait.
As long as he isn't on the DL when we play them.

23and2
12-21-05, 08:48 AM
A lot of people, Boston fans included, seem to forget that before getting hurt Damon was putting together a very nice season. A healthy Damon - who if anything has proved to be a durable player over his career - is a very nice player to have in your lineup. The Damon we get is not the Damon we saw in the second half of last year. I'm assuming he fully recovered and healthy at ST... and I think a lot of you will be happy with what he brings to this team. He's a tenacious leadoff hitter already familiar with AL pitchers. He knows the deal with NY and has performed well under the brightest spotlight sports can offer.

Also, don't discount what he brings to the clubhouse. He's a team player and a gamer. If the Yanks get down, I think Damon can help keep the team loose... He's got credibility.

mycroft
12-21-05, 08:50 AM
On a positive note at least the fans will be patient with Damon because he's an ex Red Sox. I'm sure he'll get the same treatment as Bernie, who was part of the dynasty, when he's on a serious decline.

A true New Yorker. I think you are mad because you had to walk to work today :D

kino4
12-21-05, 08:51 AM
Will Damon have enough strength to play once he gets his long hair cut off? :eek:

Meecham4ever
12-21-05, 08:51 AM
You are wrong.

We needed a CFer that would produce at a positive margin. We got one. Unfortunately, we paid $52 million for about $5 million worth of production.
Besides which, Trot Nixon and Schmoopy are now reportedly telling everyone they see that Damon is not a "real Yankee". :dunno:

RobRiv
12-21-05, 08:51 AM
What a way to wake up....screaming "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" at the top of my lungs probably scared the hell out of my neighbors at 5:00a.

When I heard the news, I punched my car radio. Oh, well. We have 4 years to get used to Johnny SuperCuts in pinstripes.

mrbawm
12-21-05, 08:53 AM
A true New Yorker. I think you are mad because you had to walk to work today :D

Actually I work on Long Island, I can't imagine what I'd be going through if I was working in Manhattan right now.

ring403
12-21-05, 08:53 AM
Yeah, I'll be great watching Josh Beckett K Damon along with the rest of the Yankee lineup. Can't wait.Unless they're moving Fenway Park down to Miami, Beckett will be lucky to keep his ERA under 4.50.

RhodyYanksFan
12-21-05, 08:55 AM
This is my last thought on this. The Sox won a World Series more recently then the Yankees won with Bernie/Bubba.

mycroft
12-21-05, 08:56 AM
When I heard the news, I punched my car radio. Oh, well. We have 4 years to get used to Johnny SuperCuts in pinstripes.

What are you complaining about. Now they have an excuse to cut Bernie loose...oh right, what was I thinking ;)

mrbawm
12-21-05, 08:56 AM
This is my last thought on this. The Sox won a World Series more recently then the Yankees won with Bernie/Bubba.

This sounds suspiciously similar to the WIN method.

mr. baskums
12-21-05, 08:57 AM
Oh God, I just heard. Please tell me it's a nightmare and that I will wake up soon

:giveup:

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 08:58 AM
New Nickname:


Johnny Run It In

Shaun4013
12-21-05, 09:00 AM
I'm shocked, well, not really but its still a suprise. I dont hate the move, but I dont really like it that much either. I mean its Johnny Damon!?!?!

mr. baskums
12-21-05, 09:00 AM
New Nickname:


Johnny Run It In

:lol:

That still doesn't ease the pain :( Why oh why would they sign Damon???

#9
12-21-05, 09:00 AM
4/52 is just silly.

38Special
12-21-05, 09:00 AM
Yeah, I'll be great watching Josh Beckett K Damon along with the rest of the Yankee lineup. Can't wait.
Yeah that rotation is really making me shake in my boots

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 09:01 AM
Yeah that rotation is really making me shake in my boots

Plus they have that good closer.

StaceyRosie
12-21-05, 09:01 AM
Oh God, I just heard. Please tell me it's a nightmare and that I will wake up soon

:giveup:

No boo boo...its not. I was hoping the same thing.

38Special
12-21-05, 09:01 AM
:lol:

That still doesn't ease the pain :( Why oh why would they sign Damon???
I dont know man I think we needed a centerfielder

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 09:04 AM
I'm still holding out hope that there is no "no trade clause" in this monstrosity of a contract.

STNYY
12-21-05, 09:05 AM
A healthy Damon - who if anything has proved to be a durable player over his career - is a very nice player to have in your lineup. ...

Also, don't discount what he brings to the clubhouse. He's a team player and a gamer. If the Yanks get down, I think Damon can help keep the team loose... He's got credibility.

No one is disputing that. It's years 2-4 of the contract we're I'm disgusted about. Just because we didn't give Boras the 7 years he wanted doesn't make this a good deal. Signing good players to bad deals does not win championships, see: 2001-2005, NY Yankees.

And $52M is an awful lot of money for clubhouse "credibility". Geez, I thought that's why we brought back Tino. I'm NOT comparing the two as players, just saying it's beyond a stretch to justify this deal on 'intangibles.'

Want a 'loose' clubhouse? Try not having an $200+M payroll and a line up of all stars, of which Mr. Johnny is the latest piece. Anything less than 100 wins, and a championship is an utter failure. Adding Hollywood Johnny just adds to the pressure. I HATE THIS DEAL. We'll get one great year from the guy, then just another rich old dude who can't hit anymore.

This is Pedro bad: as bad as if we had signed Pedro last year - overpaying a fantastic player in decline just to grab the back page. If in 2007 this board isn't crashing from the "Is anyone else sick of Jonny Damon?" threads I'll eat my lucky Yankee 99 WS cap.

ojo
12-21-05, 09:06 AM
Yeah, I'll be great watching Josh Beckett K Damon along with the rest of the Yankee lineup. Can't wait.

well i saw a draft of the new baseball prospectus, and you're right, we should be worried.

beckett projects to pitch 902 innings this year to beat john clarkson's IP record.

:D

ReggieBar
12-21-05, 09:08 AM
Johnny Damon is a very good player. We don't need his offense and his defense is average factoring in his arm.

We overpaid for him, most certainly. It doesn't even appear that we had serious competition for him as BOS was set at 4/40.

I think the Yanks wanted him at 4 years all along. Maybe George just wanted to seal the deal by Christmas and made it a fat 4 year deal. I give credit to Cash for doing what he could as far as waiting this out. It's not a terrible move by any means.

I have this to ask however. If we had sighned Beltran last offseason, he would have 5 years remaining at approx. 16 per. Is that better or worse than 4 years at 13 per for Damon?

noneckwilliams
12-21-05, 09:10 AM
Well they are Red Sox homers so of course any Red Sox or former Red Sox is going to get the oral tonguebath treatment on ESPN.


Has Gammons checked in yet? I guess he hasn't gotten final approval of his statement from John Henry and Theo.

MTYankee23
12-21-05, 09:11 AM
I dont know man I think we needed a centerfielder

And this is a perfectly valid point. I think its safe to say that he'll be an effective leadoff hitter/CF for at least the next 2 seasons. At that point, its very possible he could be moved to LF. Especially if an Andruw Jones type becomes available.

It prevents us, hopefully, for using our limited upper level prospects for a fix in CF, it allows our promising lower level prospects to develop in our own system, it forces our biggest rival to dip into their talent pool to fill a void that they now can't through FA.

While its clearly not the best fit, they got him at 4 years, and hopefully there's not a no-trade clause attached.

mr. baskums
12-21-05, 09:12 AM
I dont know man I think we needed a centerfielder

No doubt but I don't think that Damon was the answer. Another CF for 4 years that can't throw, yippie

STNYY
12-21-05, 09:12 AM
Yeah that rotation is really making me shake in my boots

If our rotation had anyone shaking in their boots you might have a point. Just because our pitching may be better than the RS pitching doesn't make it good enough to go all the way. There are other teams we need to beat.

Please explain to me how adding a 33 yr old CF with a huge contract is a better move than adding a 25 yr old pitching stud. Wang and Chacon could use some company, in case you haven't noticed.

mr. baskums
12-21-05, 09:13 AM
No boo boo...its not. I was hoping the same thing.

sh!tola

Ghost of Dan Pasqua
12-21-05, 09:14 AM
Yeah, I'll be great watching Josh Beckett K Damon along with the rest of the Yankee lineup. Can't wait.

Can you K people when you are on the 60 day DL?

RIyankee
12-21-05, 09:14 AM
I wanted the Yankees to sign Damon back in the Fall of 2001. They could have moved Bernie to a corner and started Damon in CF.

Overall, I like this signing. The team kills two birds with one stone: CF and leadoff. Moreover, he bats left. His career OBP is .353.

However here are my concerns...

- Could his best years be behind him?

- He hit better at Fenway than on the road:
HOME AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .334/ .391/ .440/ .831
AWAY AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .298/ .342/ .438/ .780

- Will he be a productive hitter in the Stadium?
Yankee Stadium (2002-2004) AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .265/ .326/ .376/ .702
Yankee Stadium (2005) AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .342/ .350/ .368/ .718

- The Yanks will still have a weak arm in CF.

jeterjuice
12-21-05, 09:15 AM
Gee, I sure am glad things have changed with Cashman in charge.

jimmyclark
12-21-05, 09:16 AM
I'm still holding out hope that there is no "no trade clause" in this monstrosity of a contract.

Reports are there is a no trade clause.
I love this deal, understanding I would have preferred signing Carlos Beltran last year. But that is water under the bridge. I don't see the complaints about "he only has 1 good year left". Damon has never been on the DL and at age 31 his most similiar "Player Comps" are Tim Raines and Willie Davis.Those guys played a long time. I am happy Cashman held Damon and Boras to 4 years? Could Boston retaliate and do something spectacular? Possibly. But they have to respond and you want to keep your opponent reacting to what you do.

jnewmark
12-21-05, 09:16 AM
No doubt but I don't think that Damon was the answer. Another CF for 4 years that can't throw, yippie

I don't know if Damon is written in stone to play CF for all 4 years. It has been speculated that he could move to a corner position, or DH. His arm is'nt great, but his range is better than anything the Yanks have had in CF for a couple of years. In a couple of years there may be a younger option available. Anyway, welcome to NY Johnny !

What's ANSKY?
12-21-05, 09:18 AM
Wow, so many of you are so negative about this move. Forget about the money. Johnny is only 32. He'll be 36 at the end of the contract. That's two years younger than Kenny Lofton is now (38) and he is still productive. As a Yankee fan you should be happy having a guy who can feel the leadoff AND centerfield jobs. One of the best guys in the league at that. Sure he has no arm and doesn't steal as much as he used to. But he is a patient hitter, a durable player, can hit pretty much any pitch, and best of all, he is a winner.

Forget the contract. It is what it is. We're Yankee fans people. Why are ugly contracts even a factor anymore? That never gonna change. Just look at the guy we picked up and realize he is the perfect fit. Redsox or not...

utopiapkwy
12-21-05, 09:18 AM
this may have been mentioned in the past 32 pages, but damon as I recall wears #18, as does Bubby. Who gets it?

mrbawm
12-21-05, 09:18 AM
Gee, I sure am glad things have changed with Cashman in charge.

Yea, no kidding. I've lost all respect for him with this move because either one of two things happened:

1. he orchestrated this move
2. he acted like standing up to Steinbrenner and actually controlling the organization was going to be a priority for him in re-signing with the Yanks this offseason, if so he already folded up to Steinbrenner (or Tampa's) pressure and error filled decision making process

jimmyclark
12-21-05, 09:19 AM
I wanted the Yankees to sign Damon back in the Fall of 2001. They could have moved Bernie to a corner and started Damon in CF.

Overall, I like this signing. The team kills two birds with one stone: CF and leadoff. Moreover, he bats left. His career OBP is .353.

However here are my concerns...

- Could his best years be behind him?

- He hit better at Fenway than on the road:
HOME AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .334/ .391/ .440/ .831
AWAY AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .298/ .342/ .438/ .780

- Will he be a productive hitter in the Stadium?
Yankee Stadium (2002-2004) AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .265/ .326/ .376/ .702
Yankee Stadium (2005) AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS: .342/ .350/ .368/ .718

- The Yanks will still have a weak arm in CF.

Has there ever been a hitter who hit better on the road than Fenway Park? It is not just a good place for right handed hitters. Left handed hitters like Williams, Yaz, Boggs, Lynn, etc all hit well there.
a .36 difference in BA is probably pretty close overall.

Stryder2929
12-21-05, 09:23 AM
you guys would be best be suited by NOT complaining for the next 30 pages of this thread.. damon is a yankee. he didnt offer himself the contract, the yankees offered it, so why be so mad at damon?

wileedog
12-21-05, 09:23 AM
I dont know man I think we needed a centerfielder

And we will again in a couple of years.

Unfortunately at 4/52 we'll still have this guy.

coalcracker
12-21-05, 09:25 AM
Wow, so many of you are so negative about this move. Forget about the money. Johnny is only 32. He'll be 36 at the end of the contract. That's two years younger than Kenny Lofton is now (38) and he is still productive. As a Yankee fan you should be happy having a guy who can feel the leadoff AND centerfield jobs. One of the best guys in the league at that. Sure he has no arm and doesn't steal as much as he used to. But he is a patient hitter, a durable player, can hit pretty much any pitch, and best of all, he is a winner.

Forget the contract. It is what it is. We're Yankee fans people. Why are ugly contracts even a factor anymore? That never gonna change. Just look at the guy we picked up and realize he is the perfect fit. Redsox or not...

Good one.

Welcome, Johnny.

mrbawm
12-21-05, 09:27 AM
you guys would be best be suited by NOT complaining for the next 30 pages of this thread.. damon is a yankee. he didnt offer himself the contract, the yankees offered it, so why be so mad at damon?

Who's mad at Damon? All the players are mercenaries, it's the nature of the beast.

If you're angry focus it at Steinbrenner, Cash and co.

The Yankee "brass" is tarnished.

goin for 27
12-21-05, 09:27 AM
Exactly!!
After reading post after post after post trashing this deal, I fail to see how signing Damon does anything but make the Yankees much stronger......as a crippling blow is dealt to boston.THE red sox ARE DONE.

I disagree. I was really hoping to see the Red Sox get Damon for 4 or even 5 years. They showed discipline for a reason, it is not a good signing.

I think that they have Jeremy Reed within a week, and $38M of the $40M they offered to Damon to spend. It should affect them this season, but they made a wise move in my opinion.

wileedog
12-21-05, 09:27 AM
I don't know if Damon is written in stone to play CF for all 4 years. It has been speculated that he could move to a corner position, or DH.

Damon's numbers are pretty good for a CFer (now anyway). They are pretty darn mediocre for a corner OFer, or a DH.

Plus that arm probably keeps him out of RF, and I shudder to think of him trying to get the ball in from left center in YS.

Nope, he's a CF for 4 years.

kino4
12-21-05, 09:28 AM
It's an amazing turnaround from Damon, who in May told MLB.com: "There's no way I can go play for the Yankees, but I know they are going to come after me hard. It's definitely not the most important thing to go out there for the top dollar, which the Yankees are going to offer me. It's not what I need."

I am still trying to figure out what he needed that the Yankees gave him (besides the money, of course).

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 09:29 AM
Please explain to me how adding a 33 yr old CF with a huge contract is a better move than adding a 25 yr old pitching stud. Wang and Chacon could use some company, in case you haven't noticed.

He just turned 32 and he'll be 35 when his contract expires. Not exactly a youngster but not an AARP candidate either.

mrbawm
12-21-05, 09:29 AM
It's an amazing turnaround from Damon, who in May told MLB.com: "There's no way I can go play for the Yankees, but I know they are going to come after me hard. It's definitely not the most important thing to go out there for the top dollar, which the Yankees are going to offer me. It's not what I need."

I am still trying to figure out what he needed that the Yankees gave him (besides the money, of course).

The extra money.

STNYY
12-21-05, 09:29 AM
you want to keep your opponent reacting to what you do.

Isn't that what the Yanks did by signing Damon, react to the RS?

goin for 27
12-21-05, 09:30 AM
Reports are there is a no trade clause.


Any link, or did you just hear this on the radio? If so, that is VERY distressing. Not so much for this deal, if Damon declines no one would trade for him anyway. I just feel that this team HAS to get away from handing out NTC's. It ties hands from making moves later. If the Red Sox can build a team without them, surely the Yankees can.

No more no trade clauses!

MTYankee23
12-21-05, 09:32 AM
Damon's numbers are pretty good for a CFer (now anyway). They are pretty darn mediocre for a corner OFer, or a DH.

Plus that arm probably keeps him out of RF, and I shudder to think of him trying to get the ball in from left center in YS.

Nope, he's a CF for 4 years.


What's the average OPS for a LF?

Shuddering to think of him getting the ball in from Left Center at YS is not a reason to keep him in CF vs. LF, as if he stays in CF, he'll also have to get the ball in from Right Center.

jcan411
12-21-05, 09:33 AM
4/52 is just silly.

Well put. I can't believe this money. 4 years is an eternity

Lets look at this for a moment -

Next year there is a much better FA market for CF (hunter, A. Jones)
We have a very good offense and damon does add a piece but not enough to have to pay Damon for the last two years of his salary, whne he will be LESS productive and we will be handcuffed with him.

This I cannot say more clearly - he has always had a very weak arm and has SHOULDER problems so I see hid defense being a liability. His speed will be the one thing you can count on getting worse as he gets older.

HOrrible signing and we just keep getting guys at thier decline point. No sense. We will beat the sox next year (not the white ones), but the sox look like monsters for 2007 if they pull the Reed deal and their prospects turn out. OUCH!

noneckwilliams
12-21-05, 09:34 AM
I disagree. I was really hoping to see the Red Sox get Damon for 4 or even 5 years. They showed discipline for a reason, it is not a good signing.

I think that they have Jeremy Reed within a week, and $38M of the $40M they offered to Damon to spend. It should affect them this season, but they made a wise move in my opinion.

I'm not in favor of this signing (and saw it coming a year ago) but the deal is fairly reasonable as far as Yankee contracts go. This is NYC and everything is more expensive, including ballplayers. I certainly did not see the NYY being able to land Damon for 4 years - so it's a bit of a consolation.

As for the RS, they will spin it that they stuck with a 4/$40 offer and that was that. I think that's BS. They would have offered more money had they been given the opportunity and IMO if they go to $12 mil/per Damon stays. Damon would have taken less to stay with Boston - but not $12 mil less. I'm not buying the RS spin - they wanted him back.

yankeebot
12-21-05, 09:35 AM
Any word yet on the contract structure? I can only hope that it is heavily front loaded without a ntc.

ICEBERG18
12-21-05, 09:37 AM
Any word yet on the contract structure? I can only hope that it is heavily front loaded without a ntc.
I think he got a partial no trade clause.

MTYankee23
12-21-05, 09:38 AM
Well put. I can't believe this money. 4 years is an eternity

Lets look at this for a moment -

Next year there is a much better FA market for CF (hunter, A. Jones)
We have a very good offense and damon does add a piece but not enough to have to pay Damon for the last two years of his salary, whne he will be LESS productive and we will be handcuffed with him.

This I cannot say more clearly - he has always had a very weak arm and has SHOULDER problems so I see hid defense being a liability. His speed will be the one thing you can count on getting worse as he gets older.

HOrrible signing and we just keep getting guys at thier decline point. No sense. We will beat the sox next year (not the white ones), but the sox look like monsters for 2007 if they pull the Reed deal and their prospects turn out. OUCH!

Hasn't it been written in several places that Andruw Jones isn't an FA until after '07 (at which time they could probably get him, and move Damon to Left). Hunter as it has been written here is pretty overrated.

It fills a huge need for the next 2 seasons without giving up any high level prospects. The Red Sox are now going to have to tap into their resources to fill CF (and also probably SS). You can also reasonably expect that with the Washburn and Damon signings, the price of Jeremy Reed has just gone up.

I'm definitely not the biggest Damon fan there is (hated him in Boston) but we could have done worse in CF.

VerMonsteR
12-21-05, 09:38 AM
''Our policy with the Yankees is to go out and win, and we're going to try to bring another championship to them. They haven't had a championship since Chuck Knoblauch was there when they had a great leadoff hitter so I think the leadoff role has been underappreciated. A good leadoff hitter is tough to find and I think New York just found the best leadoff hitter in the game."

Here's a choice quote that show's you all Johnny's opinion of himself. Yes, he's arrogant, shallow and a general doofus, but he's a very good leadoff hitter and was in the running for the batting title for much of last season. You guys have the dough to blow so don't sweat it. He's got a worse arm than my little sister, but he'll take 2 bases for every 2 he gives up with his missing arm. This was the right move for the Sox (not signing him) and also the right move for the Yank$ (overpaying for him).

I'll miss his bat and wheels, but, like Pedro, he's so full of himself that it'll be fun to revel in his misfortune. I hope he goes lame sooner rather than later, but he probably won't. I look forward to rooting against him for a change but expect he'll punish the Sox for the next year or two. <!--QuoteEnd-->

gk1272
12-21-05, 09:38 AM
Yea, no kidding. I've lost all respect for him with this move because either one of two things happened:

1. he orchestrated this move
2. he acted like standing up to Steinbrenner and actually controlling the organization was going to be a priority for him in re-signing with the Yanks this offseason, if so he already folded up to Steinbrenner (or Tampa's) pressure and error filled decision making process

This really hits the nail on the head...I really was optomistic about Cash re-signing. Too bad that feeling didn't even last until Christmas.

Thurman15
12-21-05, 09:42 AM
Just what we needed, another has-been :(

38Special
12-21-05, 09:42 AM
this thread is still hilarious

YankeeStripes
12-21-05, 09:42 AM
I dont get why everyone is so pissed. I think Damon is a good choice:

He is better that crosby. He is a good hitter. He is a good clubhouse guy. He will make money for the team because he is a star, he will hit more homeruns in NY, and he JUST turned 32.

Seamonk
12-21-05, 09:43 AM
By the time Jones is a free agent, he'll probably be on the cusp of declining, too.

Big Daddy
12-21-05, 09:43 AM
This really hits the nail on the head...I really was optomistic about Cash re-signing. Too bad that feeling didn't even last until Christmas.


Yeah, he should have signed someone in his young twenties with a canon of an arm who bats .315 etc...too bad he's not available and never will be - players like that barely make it to the market. JD is not perfect, but he's a good player and will make this team better.

RobRiv
12-21-05, 09:43 AM
Click on attachment to meet our new $52 million dollar centerfielder, Johnny di Milo

wileedog
12-21-05, 09:44 AM
What's the average OPS for a LF?


Damon's .805 OPS last year would rank him 15th among ML LFers last year.

And that's not taking park affect into account. His .780 away OPS would move him down to 18th.

I think he'll be a mid .700 OPS hitter here, especially during his last year or two, which moves him down even further.

Mediocre.

YankeeStripes
12-21-05, 09:45 AM
if he goes 2-for-3 on opening day, you will all be posting in a thread called "Johnny Damon is the man!"

kino4
12-21-05, 09:46 AM
I think he got a partial no trade clause.


What is a partial no trade clause? Is that the same as a partial rape?

Seamonk
12-21-05, 09:46 AM
Yeah, he should have signed someone in his young twenties with a canon of an arm who bats .315 etc...too bad he's not available and never will be - players like that barely make it to the market. JD is not perfect, but he's a good player and will make this team better.

I seem to recall a guy last year...

:(

OzNYYfan
12-21-05, 09:48 AM
I am amazed at the amount of negative feedback to this deal...I certainly hope Damon is not checking out this forum because it would be a very rude welcome to NY. As long as he stays healthy, he will be a very productive addition to this team.

38Special
12-21-05, 09:48 AM
posted by MGL (the guy who created UZR and works for the Cardinals) on BTF

http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/files/newsstand/discussion/cbs_4_boston_johnny_damon_agrees_to_4_year_deal_with_yankees/P100/


His UZR are similar to David's (Roberts) numbers. He is still projected as an above-average defender (nout counting his rag arm). He is also sitll an excellent baserunner, and of course, an excellent hitter for a CF'er. Boston does not like his defense as much as the numbers.

Dooley Womack
12-21-05, 09:50 AM
Click on the NESN video. Good stuff. The NESN reporter sound extremely impressed with the Yanks lineup. He says something like "Look at that, an all-star at every position! Damon! Jeter! A-Rod! Sheffield! Matsui! Giambi!....it just goes on and on and on as the Yanks put up a great lineup."


http://www.boston.com/sports/

RhodeyYankee2638
12-21-05, 09:50 AM
What is a partial no trade clause? Is that the same as a partial rape?

He can reject trades to certain teams

yankeebot
12-21-05, 09:51 AM
He can reject trades to certain teams
Are the Red Sox one of them? ;)

RhodeyYankee2638
12-21-05, 09:54 AM
Click on the NESN video. Good stuff. The NESN reporter sound extremely impressed with the Yanks lineup. He says something like "Look at that, an all-star at every position! Damon! Jeter! A-Rod! Sheffield!Matsui!....it just goes on and on and on as the Yanks put up a great lineup."


http://www.boston.com/sports/

The Sox and their fans seem heartbroken. So sad

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 09:54 AM
I am amazed at the amount of negative feedback to this deal...I certainly hope Damon is not checking out this forum because it would be a very rude welcome to NY. As long as he stays healthy, he will be a very productive addition to this team.
Much of the negative feedback is based on fanboy appreciation for such players like Reed and Michaels, who may or may not turnout as good as Damon.

RhodeyYankee2638
12-21-05, 09:55 AM
Are the Red Sox one of them? ;)

Its usually only crappy teams













So Maybe;)

gdn
12-21-05, 09:55 AM
After a good night's sleep, the thing that really bothers me about this is the NTC and the 4th year. No doubt he'll be good for two years, but after that... it's too much money.

That being said - the real question for determining the lineup should be: Who is the better #2 hitter?

NYY7
12-21-05, 09:56 AM
Welcome to the Yankees, Johnny! Say what you want, but he was the best alternative available. I can't wait for this season to start!!

effdamets
12-21-05, 09:56 AM
First, I want to say that I love reading all of the fan reaction to something like this. Good, bad, ugly.

I always thought that I'd have a tough time rooting for Boggs or Clemens types because of where they came from, but I actually liked Clemens after he came to the Yankees and I really learned what he was about. I'm not saying that I will love Damon. That is yet to be seen.

Signing Damon is good for the Yankees. Would I have preferred Hunter? Yeah. Andruw Jones? Yeah. But they weren't available. Damon brings a lot of good things to this team. A hitter, that prefers the leadoff position in the order. Something the Yankees have not had in a while. And while Jeter's numbers in the leadoff position are better, does not necessarily mean that he is a "lead off" hitter. Johnny fills a huge void in center too. Is his arm that of Willie Mays? No. But, name for me, all of the centerfielders that have rocket launchers for arms. Jones? Hunter? OK. Point being, there are not many. Now, most CF arms are better than Damon's but, that is not what the Yankees lacked in CF last season. They lacked a guy that could run down a gapper to not let the two out hit fall in for two runs. I believe that Johnny does that! This in turn, makes the Yankees' stationary corner outfielders, better. So, overall, it's a good move.

And this is exactly how the Yankees should 'overpay' for a player. Not giving someone a 7 year, back loaded contract! I'd much rather see, less years, more money per year.

As for "clubhouse leadership"... The Yankees don't need that. They have Jeter, Posada, Rivera, and Torre. The Yankees need more guys to shut up and play ball. And honestly, I think Damon is that type of player.

I think we'll all see that he will be a wonderful addition to this team, when the season is about 3 weeks old and the Yankees are already in front of the division by 5 games.....

Only time will tell.

Stone Cold
12-21-05, 09:57 AM
Yea, no kidding. I've lost all respect for him with this move because either one of two things happened:

1. he orchestrated this move
2. he acted like standing up to Steinbrenner and actually controlling the organization was going to be a priority for him in re-signing with the Yanks this offseason, if so he already folded up to Steinbrenner (or Tampa's) pressure and error filled decision making process


From reading Buster Olney's column it sounds like the Yankees held firm on going no more than 4 years. Olney says Boston was willing to do 4 years as well but only at $10 million per.

I was upset at first thinking about Damon's possible decline in a few years, but it's really not that bad of a deal when you put it into proper perspective. The Yankees just got the best CF available and one of the best leadoff hitters in the game without giving up Wang or Cano. They now have the most potent lineup in baseball with Jeter back in his natural #2 spot. At the same time they weakened the Red Sox who will now have to scramble for a CF as well as a SS. Boston will most likely have to give up whatever prospects they still have left to fill those voids.

Also, in response to the alternative options, Reed has potential of MAYBE becoming a pretty good player. However, I know several of you have already mentioned the injury concern with his wrist and his struggles at the plate. I don't care what anyone says, Michaels should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Damon. Patterson was nothing more than an average option too. The only other big name would've been Hunter who hovers around a .310 OBP and we'd probably have to give up Wang or Cano.

The bottom line is that the Yankees are a better team today than yesterday. They're definately the consensus favorites heading into the season.

YankeeStripes
12-21-05, 09:57 AM
Look, damon isnt going to hit .330....it wont happen. But, he is a pesky hitter, and will probably hit .290 and be solid in CF. Sure, he is expensive, but who can you get that is better for that money at this point?

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 09:57 AM
Damon's .805 OPS last year would rank him 15th among ML LFers last year.

And that's not taking park affect into account. His .780 away OPS would move him down to 18th.

I think he'll be a mid .700 OPS hitter here, especially during his last year or two, which moves him down even further.

Mediocre.
However, if you have players that have higher OPS than the norm at other positions than it balances itself out. The White Sox won the WS last year with several guys in their lineup with below the average OPS.

mvavra1
12-21-05, 09:57 AM
I'm not a huge Damon fan but I think I've come around on this deal. First it's only 4 years, not 5,6,or 7 years that could have crippled this team. Second he is a great leadoff hitter and now Jeter can move into the 2 hole and this team will score many, many, many runs. The money sucks, I would love to have had him for maybe 45 or 48 million but he's here and it's time we support this guy. Is he the next coming of Mantle, NO and there never will be so people need to stop thinking there is someone out there like that. The Yanks needed a CF, there really isn't any good ones available until 07, so if we can get 2 maybe 3 productive years from Damon, then this deal is fantastic. So he might not have a great arm, but we won the Division title last year, and were a few key hits away from advancing to the ALCS with a CF with limited range and no arm. At least Damon can cover more ground, besides he'll hit more doubles and triples than Bernie to make up for his poor arm. Good signing Cash, and way to keep our young prospects too.

:D

goin for 27
12-21-05, 09:58 AM
This is Pedro bad: as bad as if we had signed Pedro last year - overpaying a fantastic player in decline just to grab the back page.

I disagree on this for sure.

If the Yanks signed Pedro last year, we very well might be clamoring for tickets to opening day to see the 27th ring ceremony. Swap out the Jaret Wright signing for Pedro all day long.

Martinez and Damon signed essentially the same contracts. I bet that Pedro is much better over the life of his contract in comparison, and one year of his deal is already in the books. Pedro is one of the greatest pitchers ever, who for some time has shown that he does not need velocity to be extremely effective. He has learned with experience. Even if he declines, he will decline and still be one of the best players in the game. Damon is not going to learn to throw hard.

RobRiv
12-21-05, 09:59 AM
Nevermind "Bat Day" at Yankee Stadiium. I can't wait for the "Caveman Johnny Crude Spear" giveaway.

38Special
12-21-05, 09:59 AM
After a good night's sleep, the thing that really bothers me about this is the NTC and the 4th year. No doubt he'll be good for two years, but after that... it's too much money.

That being said - the real question for determining the lineup should be: Who is the better #2 hitter?

It's not likely to be a full NTC, if there is any at all. I havent read anything that says that he got a no-trade clause so I'd like to know who dreamt this up

RobRiv
12-21-05, 10:01 AM
It's not likely to be a full NTC, if there is any at all. I havent read anything that says that he got a no-trade clause so I'd like to know who dreamt this up

In the case of Damon, "NTC" stands for "Non Throwing Caveman"

RhodeyYankee2638
12-21-05, 10:01 AM
Any word on the press conference? I wonder if he's shaved yet

gdn
12-21-05, 10:01 AM
It's not likely to be a full NTC, if there is any at all. I havent read anything that says that he got a no-trade clause so I'd like to know who dreamt this upI coulda sworn DiMagg5 (or whatever it is) posted a link to it last night. Hang on, let me find it.

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:02 AM
Much of the negative feedback is based on fanboy appreciation for such players like Reed and Michaels, who may or may not turnout as good as Damon.

No, most of it is based on thinking that Damon at 4/52 is probably not worth it.

With a healthy dose by some people of being pissed that they have to root for a complete douchebag for the next 4 years because he happens to wear our uniform.

Finally there is some disappointment that a little creativity failed to surface to create a more flexible solution that didn't lock us yet again into an aging player with an unmovable contract.

I've said before, given the alternatives its not the end of the world. But I see very little reason to cheer for this deal or think it was some kind of offseason coup. And I'll go on record now and say by 2009 Damon will be universally hated on this board.

yankeebot
12-21-05, 10:03 AM
Any word on the press conference? I wonder if he's shaved yet
I bet he is working on a commercial deal for the shave and a haircut.

Jasbro
12-21-05, 10:03 AM
As hard as it will be to get used to Damon patrolling CF in Yankee Stadium in pinstripes, the fact is that we got a more productive player than Carlos Beltran for about half the overall money it would have taken to get Beltran here last year.

Yankees1962
12-21-05, 10:05 AM
No, most of it is based on thinking that Damon at 4/52 is probably not worth it.

With a healthy dose by some people of being pissed that they have to root for a complete douchebag for the next 4 years because he happens to wear our uniform.

Finally there is some disappointment that a little creativity failed to surface to create a more flexible solution that didn't lock us yet again into an aging player with an unmovable contract.

I've said before, given the alternatives its not the end of the world. But I see very little reason to cheer for this deal or think it was some kind of offseason coup. And I'll go on record now and say by 2009 Damon will be universally hated on this board.
Bull, most of us on this board including those that like the signing already feel that Damon isn't worth that much, but we don't go around acting like it's the end of the world for the Yankees. Also, a lot can happen between now and 2009.

jimmyclark
12-21-05, 10:06 AM
I disagree on this for sure.

If the Yanks signed Pedro last year, we very well might be clamoring for tickets to opening day to see the 27th ring ceremony. Swap out the Jaret Wright signing for Pedro all day long.

Martinez and Damon signed essentially the same contracts. I bet that Pedro is much better over the life of his contract in comparison, and one year of his deal is already in the books. Pedro is one of the greatest pitchers ever, who for some time has shown that he does not need velocity to be extremely effective. He has learned with experience. Even if he declines, he will decline and still be one of the best players in the game. Damon is not going to learn to throw hard.

I was interested in signing Martinez last year (Wright was the second worst free agent pitcher after Al Leiter). But let's remember Martinez missed the last two weeks of the season. Could he have pitched successfully with the Yankees with his injured tow in October? Possibly but not a slum-dunk yes.
I could have sworn I saw that Damon got a no-trade but I can't find the story online. If I was wrong, I am sorry for passing bad info.

JDPNYY
12-21-05, 10:06 AM
It's not likely to be a full NTC, if there is any at all. I havent read anything that says that he got a no-trade clause so I'd like to know who dreamt this up

Several people have said in this Thread that there is a NTC. I'm not sure where they are getting the info either...

38Special
12-21-05, 10:06 AM
With a healthy dose by some people of being pissed that they have to root for a complete douchebag for the next 4 years because he happens to wear our uniform.

And we finally get to the heart of the argument. Whining because he was on the Red Sox. Good to see people showing their true colors :)

Stone Cold
12-21-05, 10:06 AM
No, most of it is based on thinking that Damon at 4/52 is probably not worth it.

With a healthy dose by some people of being pissed that they have to root for a complete douchebag for the next 4 years because he happens to wear our uniform.

Finally there is some disappointment that a little creativity failed to surface to create a more flexible solution that didn't lock us yet again into an aging player with an unmovable contract.

I've said before, given the alternatives its not the end of the world. But I see very little reason to cheer for this deal or think it was some kind of offseason coup. And I'll go on record now and say by 2009 Damon will be universally hated on this board.


This makes the Yankees the consensus favorites. They have filled the void in CF and got maybe the best leadoff hitter in the game to complement an already potent lineup.

If it gives us 2 rings in the next 2 years wouldn't you say it offsets the possible decline over the last few years of Damon's contract?

arjun_sankalia
12-21-05, 10:07 AM
my thoughts on the matter:

i like this deal.
i dont think we over paid/ he is worth the same as matsui.
our line up looks tremendous.
the pressure on us to win 105 odd games is gonna be huge.
the newspapers/ tabloids are happy as hell...he could be the 2nd coming of wells from a beat writers's point of view.
the 1st game/ series at fenway is gonna set the record for the longest ever boo(s) heard in a sporting event.
sorry if this repeats what someone has already posted.
happy holidays.
how many days til spring training?

Jasbro
12-21-05, 10:07 AM
I was interested in signing Martinez last year (Wright was the second worst free agent pitcher after Al Leiter). But let's remember Martinez missed the last two weeks of the season. Could he have pitched successfully with the Yankees with his injured tow in October? Possibly but not a slum-dunk yes.
I could have sworn I saw that Damon got a no-trade but I can't find the story online. If I was wrong, I am sorry for passing bad info.

Per ESPN 1050 this morning, it is a limited NTC. The names of the teams included in the NTC have not yet been released.

ReggieBar
12-21-05, 10:08 AM
As hard as it will be to get used to Damon patrolling CF in Yankee Stadium in pinstripes, the fact is that we got a more productive player than Carlos Beltran for about half the overall money it would have taken to get Beltran here last year.


Beltran is younger and better and we didn't spent half to get Damon really. It comes down to $3 million per.

gdn
12-21-05, 10:08 AM
It's not likely to be a full NTC, if there is any at all. I havent read anything that says that he got a no-trade clause so I'd like to know who dreamt this upHere you go.

This was in a post last night by DiMagg5


Damon is also to receive a no-trade clause as part of the deal.

Which he got from
http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/yankees/ny-spdamon1221,0,7603605.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines

Obviously, if there is newer information this morning, that might be more accurate.

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:08 AM
As hard as it will be to get used to Damon patrolling CF in Yankee Stadium in pinstripes, the fact is that we got a more productive player than Carlos Beltran for about half the overall money it would have taken to get Beltran here last year.

That's crap.

Beltran's career OPS is .829. He put up 3 straight 900+ OPS seasons before having an off year with the Mets. in fact it was his first year as a full time player with a sub <.500 SLG, which is amazing for a CFer.

Damon career OPS is .784. He has NEVER put up an OPS highter than .870, and will not be getting any better.

And that's not taking the age and throwing arm into account. Heck, Beltran is a better baserunner at this point too.

ReggieBar
12-21-05, 10:10 AM
That's crap.

Beltran's career OPS is .829. He put up 3 straight 900+ OPS seasons before having an off year with the Mets.

Damon career OPS is .784. He has NEVER put up an OPS highter than .870, and will not be getting any better.

And that's not taking the age and throwing arm into account. Heck, Beltran is a better baserunner at this point too.


Well put.

Jasbro
12-21-05, 10:10 AM
Beltran is younger and better and we didn't spent half to get Damon really. It comes down to $3 million per.

Beltran is younger, but it very arguable whether he is better. And I was not a math major but I see it coming down to $38 million less for Damon (at the supposed "Yankees discount"), and close to $50mm less compared to what the Mets paid for Beltran.

yankeebot
12-21-05, 10:10 AM
And we finally get to the heart of the argument. Whining because he was on the Red Sox. Good to see people showing their true colors :)I won't speak for others but any off-field issues I have with Damon are not related to the fact that he was with the Red Sox. In his book he said things about his ex-wife and about Arod (which he later apologized for and removed from subsequent printings) that bothered me. I try to put personnal feelings aside but it is sometimes difficult.

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:11 AM
Beltran is younger, but it very arguable whether he is better.

If you go by 2005 alone, sure.

But that wouldn't be very intellectually honest, would it?

Jasbro
12-21-05, 10:11 AM
That's crap.

Beltran's career OPS is .829. He put up 3 straight 900+ OPS seasons before having an off year with the Mets. in fact it was his first year as a full time player with a sub <.500 SLG, which is amazing for a CFer.

Damon career OPS is .784. He has NEVER put up an OPS highter than .870, and will not be getting any better.

And that's not taking the age and throwing arm into account. Heck, Beltran is a better baserunner at this point too.

Is that difference worth $40-$50 million to you?

shotgun_sam
12-21-05, 10:11 AM
I was interested in signing Martinez last year (Wright was the second worst free agent pitcher after Al Leiter). .


*cough* ERIC MILTON *cough*

38Special
12-21-05, 10:12 AM
It didnt take long for the Beltran sympathizers to stick their head in

ReggieBar
12-21-05, 10:14 AM
Is that difference worth $40-$50 million to you?


Again, it is 13 mil to 16 mil per. The yanks still will pay a CFer in 2010 when Beltran would have been in his final year.

Looking foward its Johnny 4/52 or Beltran at 5/80 (approx.)

silverdsl
12-21-05, 10:14 AM
Do I get a prize for reading through all 33 pages of this thread? Every post, I swear! Oh wait, I'm supposed to do that, nevermind. :lol:

Anyway, are there better players than Damon? Sure, there are. But were the Yankees going to get them? Probably not. So given that the Yankees filled a need I can't say that I'm too upset by this. As bakntime said way up thread - it could have been worse. IMO, Bubba or Bernie in CF on opening day would have been worse. So would a 7 or 8-year deal for Damon as it was originally said he wanted.

I'm not thrilled that Damon isn't great defensively but I think there are a lot of positives about him otherwise. It's very infrequent that a team is able to aquire a player who is perfect and has absolutely no negatives what-so-ever. So I'm mostly happy with the Damon signing, other than the possible no-trade which I think is a bad idea for just about any player. I think he will be an asset for the Yankees and I think that fans will grow to like him quite a bit after they get over the shock.

-Deborah

Vazquez
12-21-05, 10:15 AM
I really do not like the guy, but maybe he will grow on us.

ReggieBar
12-21-05, 10:15 AM
It didnt take long for the Beltran sympathizers to stick their head in

"sympathizers"? yesterday it was Beltran "lovers". Whatever.

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:15 AM
Is that difference worth $40-$50 million to you?
They are both overpaid.

The difference is one of them will not decline appreciably over the course of the contract, and his numbers are not severaly influenced by the park he played in the past 4 years.

Beltran at the END of his contract will a year older than Damon is NOW.

Yes, its worth it to me.

The Q Bomb
12-21-05, 10:16 AM
I don't like this. Call me silly - but the idea of a Boston Red Sox patrolling centerfield for The Yankees is akin to having Bin Laden join Homeland Security. I don't care how much he adds to the venture it's just not palatable. (And please don't lecture me on how awful it is to compare Damon to Bin Laden. It's the only analogy I could come up with on the spur of the moment and it's meant to show how much most Yankee fans - or at least this one - think of Damon as "the enemy".)

Secondly, it signals to me that all this talk about getting some sanity back into the Yankee "plan" and trying to get younger, cheaper, and smarter, lasted all of two months.

I guess we did not have any good prospects in our own minor league system. Melky Cabrera obviously played himself out of any future shot with this team and I guess no one else on the farm projects to be ready within the next year or two.

The fact that The Yanks even (reportedly) made an offer to Nomar and now have signed Damon is scary to me. Frankly, I don't know how I'll sit my rear end in Yankee Stadium and watch Johnny Damon run down a fly ball or clap for him when he comes up to the plate! Ugh!

Good business be damned! I think this stinks.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all!

Q "Bah Humbug" Bomb

YankeeStripes
12-21-05, 10:16 AM
he should shave and get a haircut AT the press conference.

shotgun_sam
12-21-05, 10:16 AM
That's crap.

Beltran's career OPS is .829. He put up 3 straight 900+ OPS seasons before having an off year with the Mets. in fact it was his first year as a full time player with a sub <.500 SLG, which is amazing for a CFer.

Damon career OPS is .784. He has NEVER put up an OPS highter than .870, and will not be getting any better.

And that's not taking the age and throwing arm into account. Heck, Beltran is a better baserunner at this point too.



Yeah, Beltran is not going to be a Yankee, do you realize that? EVER.

Why, a year later, do people still act like the Yanks are going to say "Oh wait, we should have spent a billion dollars on Carlos, Hey call up the Mets and tell them we changed our mind. Send him over here."

We got the best CF available, with the same contract Matsui got. This Beltran thing is in the past, and some people reallllly need to let it go.

aeromac76
12-21-05, 10:16 AM
Another 4 years of everyone and their mother going 1st to 3rd on every hit....

:eek:

Yes, but everyone and their mother went from first to third on every hit in the years from 1996-2000, and I don't seem to recall it mattering much then.

The 4th year may be a bit much, but for at least 2-3 years you just got a premier leadoff hitter who can run the ball down in CF. He is light years better offensively and defensively than we have had in years out there. If he turnd into Bernie in year 4, then so be it, he gives us a major player for the next 2 or 3, and cripples Boston. I am surprised, because other than the 4th year being potentially a bad year, there is no downside to this.

And please can we stop comparing Damon to Jeter and saying we dongraded the leadoff position. That is the wrong way to think of it.
Either Jeter bats before the heavy hitters or Damon AND Jeter bat before the heavy hitters. You want to argue Jeter is the better leadoff hitter than Damon, fine, but I don't care. Bottom line, a lineup with Damon and Jeter 1-2 is better than one with Jeter 1 and Bubba somewhere in it.
Arguing Jeter to be better than Damon misses the point that Damon's arrival makes the whole lineup better.

And as for Damon being Bernie II in the late years, recall there are plenty of players who have remained more productive than Bernie at age 36 (which is what Damon will be at the end of this deal).
Guys like Clemens and Johnson, and even Gary Sheffield. Look at Mariano Rivera. Age 26 is not a death sentence for most playing careers, even if it was for Bernie..

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:16 AM
It didnt take long for the Beltran sympathizers to stick their head in

Read the thread.

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:17 AM
Yeah, Beltran is not going to be a Yankee, do you realize that? EVER. .
I didn't bring it up, OK?

gdn
12-21-05, 10:18 AM
I will stop criticizing this move if people stop calling Damon a "pure/true leadoff hitter".

I promise.

yankeebot
12-21-05, 10:19 AM
I will stop criticizing this move if people stop calling Damon a "pure/true leadoff hitter".

I promise.
Is it ok if I call him a true yankee?

shotgun_sam
12-21-05, 10:20 AM
I didn't bring it up, OK?


Well, was there any other merit for comparing Beltran's numbers to Damon's? Because that sounded like everyone else that still goes to sleep at night and dreams that we signed him last year.

But i apologize if not. :D

Sam18
12-21-05, 10:20 AM
Yep, I still hate this deal. Hopefully we can get Michaels for RF. Unless he's taken already.

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:21 AM
If it gives us 2 rings in the next 2 years wouldn't you say it offsets the possible decline over the last few years of Damon's contract?

I don't know.

Bernie brought us 4 rings, but it was still pretty painful watching him play CF the last two years, wouldn't you say?

Sam18
12-21-05, 10:21 AM
I will stop criticizing this move if people stop calling Damon a &quot;pure/true leadoff hitter&quot;.

I promise.

*gives gdn a hug* Its ok man, we're all upset about this.

gdn
12-21-05, 10:21 AM
Is it ok if I call him a true yankee?:lol:

As long as everyone acknowledges that Jeter is a better leadoff hitter. Heck, no one has to do that. Just stop calling Damon that.

Vazquez
12-21-05, 10:21 AM
Is it ok if I call him a true yankee?



he is going to take EXCEPTIONALLY long to earn his pinstripes. Not only that f'n book and the verbal diarrhea that comes out of his mouth, but the fact that he was practically the poster boy of those horrible, horrible Cowboy up! and "idiot" gimmicks

jimmyclark
12-21-05, 10:21 AM
I don't like this. Call me silly - but the idea of a Boston Red Sox patrolling centerfield for The Yankees is akin to having Bin Laden join Homeland Security. I don't care how much he adds to the venture it's just not palatable. (And please don't lecture me on how awful it is to compare Damon to Bin Laden. It's the only analogy I could come up with on the spur of the moment and it's meant to show how much most Yankee fans - or at least this one - think of Damon as &quot;the enemy&quot;.)

Secondly, it signals to me that all this talk about getting some sanity back into the Yankee &quot;plan&quot; and trying to get younger, cheaper, and smarter, lasted all of two months.

I guess we did not have any good prospects in our own minor league system. Melky Cabrera obviously played himself out of any future shot with this team and I guess no one else on the farm projects to be ready within the next year or two.

The fact that The Yanks even (reportedly) made an offer to Nomar and now have signed Damon is scary to me. Frankly, I don't know how I'll sit my rear end in Yankee Stadium and watch Johnny Damon run down a fly ball or clap for him when he comes up to the plate! Ugh!

Good business be damned! I think this stinks.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all!

Q &quot;Bah Humbug&quot; Bomb

You would not have enjoyed watching Babe Ruth play right, Red Ruffing, Roger Clemens or Luis Tiant start, Sparky Lyle relieve, Wade Boggs play third/ride on police horses. Not to mention to reverse joy of watching Mike Torrez pitch to Bucky Dent.

gdn
12-21-05, 10:22 AM
*gives gdn a hug* Its ok man, we're all upset about this.I'm not really. I'm on the precipice of "Eh, I don't care anymore".

Let's see how he does next year.

ReggieBar
12-21-05, 10:23 AM
Well, was there any other merit for comparing Beltran's numbers to Damon's? Because that sounded like everyone else that still goes to sleep at night and dreams that we signed him last year.

But i apologize if not. :D


The reason Beltran gets brought up is because the Yankees didn't want to overpay him last year to solve the void in CF and now we overpay Damon. So it is relative.

welcometothebronx
12-21-05, 10:23 AM
depressing.

iWant27
12-21-05, 10:23 AM
I am happy with this signing . It gives Yankees a real good leadoff hitter with Jeter at 2 spot followed by big bats . It strengthens Yankees and weakens red sox . I am really happy with this signing .

gdn
12-21-05, 10:23 AM
Hey, it just occured to me! Now WE can giddyup!

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaw


:lol:

wileedog
12-21-05, 10:23 AM
Well, was there any other merit for comparing Beltran's numbers to Damon's? Because that sounded like everyone else that still goes to sleep at night and dreams that we signed him last year.

But i apologize if not. :D

Yes, because somebody else said that we got a better player in Damon. So I responded by mentioning that no, we didn't.

We disagreed on whether the extra money was worth it or not. You now have the whole story.

Apology accepted. ;)

RhodeyYankee2638
12-21-05, 10:24 AM
Yes, but everyone and their mother went from first to third on every hit in the years from 1996-2000, and I don't seem to recall it mattering much then.


Besides those 4 championships?

shotgun_sam
12-21-05, 10:24 AM
Is it ok if I call him a true yankee?


Actually, the way he seemed to stress "we" when talking about how good "we" are, how tough "we" are going to be to beat, seems like he's egging on Boston fans already.


It was funny.

gk1272
12-21-05, 10:24 AM
"There's no way I can go play for the Yankees, but I know they're going to come after me hard," he said on May 3. "It's definitely not the most important thing to go out there for the top dollar, which the Yankees are going to offer me. It's not what I need."
- Johnny Damon

heh.

PoughVirginiaYankee
12-21-05, 10:24 AM
Wow...guess I've come on late - went to bed early, woke up late.... but wow....couldn't believe my eyes when I checked out ESPN in the morning...wow