PDA

View Full Version : SI reports Halladay headed to Phillies, Lee to Ms in three-way trade



SubwayFanatic
12-14-09, 02:59 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/12/14/phillies.halladay.lee/index.html?eref=BrkNews

TheJobaRules
12-14-09, 03:00 PM
Poor mets lol

TheHugeUnit2
12-14-09, 03:01 PM
Wow, I guess I can see why they did that now. Lee didn't want to sign long term and Roy I guess did.

RhodyYanksFan
12-14-09, 03:02 PM
Is Halladay that much better than Lee? I don't get it. The headline should be how much this helps the Mariners.

Rice14
12-14-09, 03:03 PM
Wow. Poor Cliff Lee, on the move again. King Felix and Lee gives the Mariners a pretty potent 1-2 punch.

Wonder how much the Phils had to lay out for the extension?

At least the Mets can console themselves with Chris Coste.

Brooklyn Yankee Fan
12-14-09, 03:04 PM
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/roy-halladay-rumors-monday-1.html

The art of Twitter, gotta love it.

b-ball-lunachick
12-14-09, 03:06 PM
Well we get Lee back in the AL but it's not as bad as having Halladay in the AL East...he's going to be REALLY nasty in the NL...will be interesting to see when they want to pinch hit for him and he wants to stay in the game...he can get feisty :D

cupcollector99
12-14-09, 03:07 PM
anything that keeps him out of the AL is fine by me.

TheoShmeo
12-14-09, 03:08 PM
I will not miss seeing Roy Halladay in the AL East.

kan_t
12-14-09, 03:08 PM
I will not miss seeing Roy Halladay in the AL East.
Me too.

Torre Must Go
12-14-09, 03:09 PM
Good news. Won't miss seeing Halladay and worrying if the Yankees get him whenever they play Blue Jays anymore.

DiMaggio5CF
12-14-09, 03:10 PM
Halladay to Philly, Lee to Seattle, Lackey to Boston.

Let's hope Joba and Hughes will both figure out how to be starting pitchers very quickly... and Burnett will stay healthy.

blumj
12-14-09, 03:10 PM
Good Luck NL East, you're going to need it.

fredgmuggs
12-14-09, 03:12 PM
Well we get Lee back in the AL but it's not as bad as having Halladay in the AL East...he's going to be REALLY nasty in the NL...will be interesting to see when they want to pinch hit for him and he wants to stay in the game...he can get feisty :D
That link said it wasn't confirmed that Lee was involved in the trade although it's likely. I'm still waiting to see what all the pieces in the trade will be.

DiMaggio5CF
12-14-09, 03:13 PM
I know Halladay probably loves Philly because it's East Coast and their ST home is very close to his Florida home. But if he doesn't sign and waits until next year, assuming a good and healthy season, he'd get $25 million per for five years in a bidding war between the Yankees and Red Sox on the open market. So even though Philly seemingly wanted to make this deal because they think they can re-sign Halladay and not Lee, I think Halladay is a fool if his asking price is less than $20 million per for four years.

DiMaggio5CF
12-14-09, 03:14 PM
In other news, the Mets can get Bay, Molina, and Holliday, and they will still have completely dropped the ball this off-season by failing to add anything credible to the rotation behind Santana.

tdel23
12-14-09, 03:15 PM
Philly would be better off keeping Lee. A 1-2 of Halladay and Lee would be lethal.

Stick Michael
12-14-09, 03:15 PM
I have a feeling this trade isn't as close as being reported. It may get done, but with the alleged extension not yet negotiated and no mention of Mariners' part of the trade it wouldn't surprise me if this isn't a done deal.

DiMaggio5CF
12-14-09, 03:17 PM
Philly would be better off keeping Lee. A 1-2 of Halladay and Lee would be lethal.

Agreed. If you're going to make a move that big, and you apparently have the money to pay Halladay beyond this year, find a way to come up with the money to keep both this year, and you're probably the best team in baseball.

JeterForPresident
12-14-09, 03:20 PM
Agreed. If you're going to make a move that big, and you apparently have the money to pay Halladay beyond this year, find a way to come up with the money to keep both this year, and you're probably the best team in baseball.

From what Heyman was saying on Francesa, it seems that Lee wants to get to FA and get his big pay day.

Halladay likes Philly, likes that there ST facility is located near his home, and was willing to sign an extension with Philly.

So I guess Philly decided Halladay for a few years is better than Lee for one, and baseball is lucky that they aren't able to keep both pitchers because a 1-2 of Halladay and Lee would be dangerous.

JWHIII
12-14-09, 03:23 PM
Rosenthal called this a few days ago

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/10513552/Cy-Young-winners-Halladay,-Lee-could-fit-into-one-deal

thaa
12-14-09, 03:33 PM
I have a feeling this trade isn't as close as being reported. It may get done, but with the alleged extension not yet negotiated and no mention of Mariners' part of the trade it wouldn't surprise me if this isn't a done deal.

A half-hour ago, the Toronto radio guy was reporting that the Jays' GM was unable to talk to media for what the GM called "a couple of days." Probably means he's waiting on medical reports.

tdel23
12-14-09, 03:40 PM
From what Heyman was saying on Francesa, it seems that Lee wants to get to FA and get his big pay day.

Halladay likes Philly, likes that there ST facility is located near his home, and was willing to sign an extension with Philly.

So I guess Philly decided Halladay for a few years is better than Lee for one, and baseball is lucky that they aren't able to keep both pitchers because a 1-2 of Halladay and Lee would be dangerous.

I can see Philly being nervous about trying to resign both pitchers, but if I'm the Philly GM I take my chances of a 1-2 punch of Lee and Doc leading me to a World Series. At the end of the year if you can't sign Lee you get the 2 draft picks.

MTYankee23
12-14-09, 03:44 PM
I can see Philly being nervous about trying to resign both pitchers, but if I'm the Philly GM I take my chances of a 1-2 punch of Lee and Doc leading me to a World Series. At the end of the year if you can't sign Lee you get the 2 draft picks.

Yeah, what's worse is they had the opportunity to do this at the '08 trading deadline, so they could have ridden the 1-2 punch to 2 potential World Series while they were still in the Utley/Howard/Werth window. At that point, they could have tried shedding some other salary (Lidge, Moyer, Ibanez, etc.) to keep that intact.

NYYDragoon
12-14-09, 03:44 PM
Wow, the M's are serious, aren't they?

Dave B
12-14-09, 03:50 PM
I don't get this move at all. Why trade Lee if he's still signed somewhat cheaply for 2010? Teaming up Halladay and Lee makes them immediate favorites for a run in 2010. Replacing Lee with Halladay is a minor upgrade at best. Why give up the shot for an unstoppable rotation, even if it's only for a year?

I just don't understand getting rid of Lee unless a) it was straight up with no other prospects involved and b) he demanded a trade. His 2011 signability wouldn't factor into it for me at all. I'd worry about that after 2010.

BronxYanks45
12-14-09, 03:54 PM
Mariners getting much stronger, not surprised to see them in the ALCS next yr

C4v
12-14-09, 03:58 PM
I dont get it. Halladay isnt much better than lee, if he is at all. If they were smart, they wouldve kept lee and acquired halladay somehow.

SubwayFanatic
12-14-09, 04:00 PM
Mariners getting much stronger, not surprised to see them in the ALCS next yr

Could you explain to me how the Mariners are going to score runs next year?

You do realize they scored 640 runs last year, right?

tdel23
12-14-09, 04:00 PM
3:56pm: Morosi tweets that pitcher Phillippe Aumont of the Mariners and outfielder Michael Taylor of the Phillies are among the players heading to Toronto in the trade.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

wang+cano=future
12-14-09, 04:00 PM
Atleast Phillippe Aumont and Michael Taylor are headed to Toronto.....I am assuming some more prospects (Morrow?) are headed from Seattle......

http://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status/6674641214

Aumont is going to be very popular in Toronto......

Ram Man
12-14-09, 04:00 PM
Halladay -> Phillies, Lee -> Mariners, What-in-the-wide-world-of-sports -> Blue Jays? It would seem that the Jays must be re-stocking their farm system on this deal.

Mark19
12-14-09, 04:03 PM
Good situation for the Yankees

The only team that gets appreciably better is in the AL West. The one in our division and the one we played in the World Series either got worse or stayed the same.

Brooklyn Yankee Fan
12-14-09, 04:11 PM
Lee definitely gives the Mariners one of the best 1-2 punches in the league with King Felix, but it does not make them an ALCS contender right off the bat.

Ichiro/Figgins combo is great, however after them, there isn't much there. I'm a big Griffey fan, but let's get real, he's not what he used to be.

iWant27
12-14-09, 04:12 PM
Good situation for the Yankees

The only team that gets appreciably better is in the AL West. The one in our division and the one we played in the World Series either got worse or stayed the same.

With Lackey in Boston , their rotation has gotten better than Yankees .

SubwayFanatic
12-14-09, 04:13 PM
With Lackey in Boston , their rotation has gotten better than Yankees .

I am pretty sure he is just referring to this specific trade.

Epy7280
12-14-09, 04:15 PM
With Lackey in Boston , their rotation has gotten better than Yankees .

We have good numbers of Lackey.

GordonGecko
12-14-09, 04:22 PM
I don't get this trade at all for Philadelphia. Halladay isn't that much of an upgrade from Lee. If Lee left next year they got draft picks right? And who's to say they couldn't sign him after 2010. Now they trade him and who else to get Halladay? I don't get it

Rumba887
12-14-09, 04:22 PM
I dont get it. Halladay isnt much better than lee, if he is at all. If they were smart, they wouldve kept lee and acquired halladay somehow.

Amen!

Mark19
12-14-09, 04:24 PM
With Lackey in Boston , their rotation has gotten better than Yankees .

Fortunately Opening Day isn't tomorrow, I have faith that Cashman will do what's right and make the necessary improvements

GordonGecko
12-14-09, 04:29 PM
Halladay must be willing to take one heck of a paycut for Philadelphia to make this crappy trade. My take is that Ruben Amaro has royally messed up a golden opportunity to go 1-2 with Halladay-Lee

Axon
12-14-09, 04:30 PM
I got a scare when I read the headline, but when I saw they traded Lee, I wasn't too worried about it. Maybe there was some internal tension with Lee and the Phillies? They gave up a tremendous 1-2 punch.

TheoShmeo
12-14-09, 04:38 PM
I got a scare when I read the headline, but when I saw they traded Lee, I wasn't too worried about it. Maybe there was some internal tension with Lee and the Phillies? They gave up a tremendous 1-2 punch.
As a fan of an AL team, why would you be that worried about the Phillies having two aces? True, they could make the World Series again, but even having that one-two punch isn't much of a guaranty.

Derek2HOF
12-14-09, 04:39 PM
Hamels had a rough year, but he is still a great pitcher. 1.25, 1.12, 1.08, and 1.29. Those WHIPs are pretty damn good ... even for the NL. I think he bounces back in a big way this season. The Phillies did win a world series with him as their ace. I am sorry, but aside from the stint down the stretch for the Phils Lee isn't in the same category as Roy. The number don't lie. Neither of them walk a lot of batters, but Lee's OAV has always been pretty average, while Halladay has always been well above league average.

jlw1980
12-14-09, 04:42 PM
Nooooooo

BxBomber44
12-14-09, 04:45 PM
So the Jays traded the reason they were in the world series?

GordonGecko
12-14-09, 04:53 PM
So the Jays traded the reason they were in the world series?
No they traded the only reason anyone would go watch the Blue Jays

YankProspector
12-14-09, 05:02 PM
No they traded the only reason anyone would go watch the Blue Jays

This is what team's have to do. They couldn't win with Halladay now, they need to look to the future.

kan_t
12-14-09, 05:07 PM
5:00pm: ESPN's Jayson Stark heard this deal is close but not done. He says Halladay's extension would be just three years and $60MM (starting in 2011), with possible vesting options for another year or two. Aside from Aumont, Stark says the Jays would get Phils catching prospect Travis D'Arnaud. The Blue Jays have been asking for Phils outfield prospect Domonic Brown but have been offered Taylor. The Mariners would also give an additional prospect.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

Win-win-win situation.

Vazquez
12-14-09, 05:12 PM
3 years at $60 million?? Give Ruben Amaro a statue next to Rocky if he inks that...

Axon
12-14-09, 05:27 PM
As a fan of an AL team, why would you be that worried about the Phillies having two aces? True, they could make the World Series again, but even having that one-two punch isn't much of a guaranty.

There's no team that can match the Phillies with that combo in the NL, save a miracle series from the Cardinals. Hell, I don't know if any NL team can really beat them right now - without two aces - unless the Phillies get lit up with injuries.

Of course there are no guarantees of a Series birth, but why would I want a team clearly favored to face my team in the WS to stock up on two aces? It's not as bad as the Red Sox, but it's probably second or third on the worst-case list.

TheoShmeo
12-14-09, 05:32 PM
There's no team that can match the Phillies with that combo in the NL - barring a miracle from the Cardinals. Hell, I don't know if any NL team can really beat them right now, unless the Phillies get lit up with injuries.

Of course there are no guarantees of a Series birth, but why would I want a team clearly favored to face my team in the WS to stock up on two aces? It's not as bad as the Red Sox, but it's probably second or third on the worst-case list.
Yeah, I hear you. There's just so much that has to happen right in a 162-game season that I can't get too fussed about anything that a team in the NL does.

Separately, I don't think there's much to choose from between Lee and Halladay at this point. Halladay has the better overall resume but he does tend to fade in the latter part of the season.

dabomb2045
12-14-09, 05:36 PM
Yeah, I hear you. There's just so much that has to happen right in a 162-game season that I can't get too fussed about anything that a team in the NL does.

Separately, I don't think there's much to choose from between Lee and Halladay at this point. Halladay has the better overall resume but he does tend to fade in the latter part of the season.

Lets remember that Halladay has pitched his entire career in the AL East....constantly facing lineups like the Yanks and Sox. Now he gets to go to the NL. It will be like a vacation for him.

kan_t
12-14-09, 05:38 PM
Lets remember that Halladay has pitched his entire career in the AL East....constantly facing lineups like the Yanks and Sox. Now he gets to go to the NL. It will be like a vacation for him.
And he doesn't need to face a powerful lineup, Phillies.

ArodEra
12-14-09, 07:15 PM
Wow. Poor Cliff Lee, on the move again. King Felix and Lee gives the Mariners a pretty potent 1-2 punch.

Wonder how much the Phils had to lay out for the extension?

At least the Mets can console themselves with Chris Coste.

:lol: Dude, this is so effin funny. I love how it came out of nowhere, unexpectedly.

Dynasties R Forever
12-14-09, 07:34 PM
Wow. Poor Cliff Lee, on the move again. King Felix and Lee gives the Mariners a pretty potent 1-2 punch.

Wonder how much the Phils had to lay out for the extension?

At least the Mets can console themselves with Chris Coste.
Yes but can Chris Coste console himself after signing with the Mets?
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/mets/newest_met_no_fan_of_amazin_lREBkGDsYAl2TJJhnnEjlM


Coste rips Mets then signs with team


Chris Coste is burning bridges with Mets fans before he's even crossed them.
The ex-Phillies catcher/first baseman signed with the Mets yesterday, just three days after expressing disdain for his new team in an interview with a Philadelphia sports Web site.
After telling CSNPhilly.com he "will always be a Phillie," Coste said he had been hesitant to sign with Philadelphia's arch rival.

(http://www.nypost.com/blogs/metsblog)
"It was the Mets," Coste said, according to the site. "It's the last team I ever saw myself playing for. I knew I was going to accept [the contract], but had to think about it for a few days.


That says something when a 36 year old who's only had more than 200 ML ab's one time in his "career" has to "think" at all about a 500K contract.

AJW
12-14-09, 07:56 PM
From what Heyman was saying on Francesa, it seems that Lee wants to get to FA and get his big pay day.

=

He will probably from us. :)

junkman73
12-14-09, 08:10 PM
i don't see how this helps Philly. I think you need both Lee and Halladay to give yourself a chance vs the AL in the World Series. Unless Hamels reverts back to 2008 form.

ppa79
12-14-09, 08:14 PM
Are the Phillies morons?
They traded Drabek, Lee, and others for Halladay?
How does that make sense? Talk about taking a step backwards.

:lol:

In Mo I Trust
12-14-09, 09:39 PM
Trading Drabek and Lee? I don't think this makes any sense for the Phillies.

Snatch Catch
12-14-09, 09:58 PM
It was essentially two separate deal from what is being reported now.

The BJs sent $6 million to Philly, and the Phils essentially got rid of Lee in a salary dump to Seattle so they could take on Halladay.

It doesn't appear that any of the Seattle prospects end up in Toronto, and all of the Philly prospects do.

I'm reading rumors that moving Lee was all budget driven.

Incredible. I'd be so pissed if I were a Phillies fan right now. Holy crap, what a horrific 6 weeks.

This doesn't make any sense at all, unless they really did have to cut payroll or something.

GordonGecko
12-14-09, 10:03 PM
Amaro was jealous of Minaya

GordonGecko
12-14-09, 10:55 PM
If Amaro has his phone turned on he's no doubt getting the wrath of Phillies fans in full force. I wouldn't be surprised if he kills this deal since he has an out by saying they couldn't come to terms with Halladay on an extension.

GirouxGiroux
12-15-09, 05:17 AM
If Amaro has his phone turned on he's no doubt getting the wrath of Phillies fans in full force. I wouldn't be surprised if he kills this deal since he has an out by saying they couldn't come to terms with Halladay on an extension.

While the Phils have pumped up the payroll recently, they're still owned by the same tightwads who kept it in check for years before. Amaro doesn't have a blank check. Welcome to the world of not New York.

Having both would be nice, but if you have to choose (as Amaro did), a signed Halladay is better than an unsigned Lee. And if the numbers that are coming out are real, the Phils are getting a deal on Halladay.

I'm surprised they have to part with Drabek, but I don't know anything about this kid Aumont.

eaganmafia
12-15-09, 08:58 AM
I'm not gonna go through and read the 4 pages so maybe someone already said this, but...

I don't understand why the Phillies got the M's involved. Why not just ship Drabek, Taylor and pieces to the Jays and sign Roy to the extention. Have a sick front 3 of Lee, Halladay, Hamels for 2010, let Lee walk after the season and collect the picks.

I just don't see why the M's were needed for this deal.

GordonGecko
12-15-09, 09:05 AM
I'm not gonna go through and read the 4 pages so maybe someone already said this, but...

I don't understand why the Phillies got the M's involved. Why not just ship Drabek, Taylor and pieces to the Jays and sign Roy to the extention. Have a sick front 3 of Lee, Halladay, Hamels for 2010, let Lee walk after the season and collect the picks.

I just don't see why the M's were needed for this deal.
The Mariners are involved to restock the Phillie prospects they gave up to Toronto

SLURPEE
12-15-09, 09:07 AM
So what did the Mariners give up in all of this?

eaganmafia
12-15-09, 09:17 AM
So what did the Mariners give up in all of this?

Phillippe Aumont, Tyson Gillies & Juan Ramirez...which IMO is selling low on Lee. Lee is worth ahell of alot more then those 3.

GordonGecko
12-15-09, 09:20 AM
Phillippe Aumont, Tyson Gillies & Juan Ramirez...which IMO is selling low on Lee. Lee is worth ahell of alot more then those 3.
Yep, Amaro got owned

eaganmafia
12-15-09, 11:08 AM
The Blue Jays will trade outfielder Michael Taylor to the A's for third base prospect Brett Wallace, according to ESPN.com's Buster Olney and Jerry Crasnick (via e-mail).

I'm kind of shocked that's all it took to get Wallace.

Vazquez
12-15-09, 11:16 AM
I'm kind of shocked that's all it took to get Wallace.

I agree with you. There would have been no chance that the A's accepted a deal of Holliday for Michael Taylor straight up last season.

yankeesAZ
12-15-09, 06:30 PM
Phillippe Aumont, Tyson Gillies & Juan Ramirez...which IMO is selling low on Lee. Lee is worth ahell of alot more then those 3.

Aumont is a good prospect and the M's only get one year of Lee. However, now is the time for the M's while they still have Felix for 2 more years.

Huktonfonix
12-16-09, 08:30 AM
Cross-posting my thoughts on Philly's move from another board:

Such a dumb trade. I sort of understand emptying the farm for Halladay, as all indications were that Lee wouldn't extend, and the Phils did manage to offset part of his salary for this season and get a reasonable extension that won't take him too far into his late 30's.

The Lee trade makes no sense. How is a team fresh off back-to-back World Series appearances, and with their roster intact (improved, actually) so desperate to shed payroll that they dump an ace pitcher to save 8 million?

Halladay isn't young, and Ibanez certainly isn't. Rollins and Hamels suck more every day, and Howard is soon to be looking for a deal that will pay him 20 million a year until he's 40. The team should absolutely be in "win now" mode, and emptying the farm for Halladay suggests that they are.

I understand that they were going to lose Lee next year regardless, but how many teams with as good a shot at the playoffs as the Phils would rather have 8 million in payroll savings and and a few questionable prospects than a year of ace-quality pitching out of the 2nd rotation slot and 2 first-round draft picks next summer?

It's going to be even more ridiculous when they're 20 games up on the Mets in July but have to trade the prospects they just got or take on 8 million in salary anyway because Hamels sucks again or Happ regresses or Blanton gets stuck in the bathtub and they need someone like Gil Meche to hold down the back end of the rotation. I'm sure Phils fans will be excited to see him starting a playoff game against Adam Wainwright instead of Cliff Lee. And who the hell is their 5th starter anyway?

GordonGecko
12-16-09, 09:06 AM
Agree, Dunce award trade of the year

Huktonfonix
12-14-10, 09:11 AM
Ruben "it's better to be lucky than right" Amaro, ladies and gentlemen.

Yogi
12-14-10, 12:52 PM
There's no team that can match the Phillies with that combo in the NL, save a miracle series from the Cardinals. Hell, I don't know if any NL team can really beat them right now - without two aces - unless the Phillies get lit up with injuries.

Of course there are no guarantees of a Series birth, but why would I want a team clearly favored to face my team in the WS to stock up on two aces? It's not as bad as the Red Sox, but it's probably second or third on the worst-case list.

Yes, but the Phillies lost to the Giants last year not because they didn't pitch well but because they couldn't hit Giant pitching. Now Werth is gone and they have an even bigger hole. Look for them to trade a starter for a bat and decent defender to replace Werth.

delv
12-14-10, 07:31 PM
Yes, but the Phillies lost to the Giants last year not because they didn't pitch well but because they couldn't hit Giant pitching. Now Werth is gone and they have an even bigger hole. Look for them to trade a starter for a bat and decent defender to replace Werth.

they're counting on their kid Dominic Brown, platooned with Ben Francisco, I think.

awy
12-14-10, 07:48 PM
i hope dominic brown busts. nothing personal.

YankeesAce4Life
12-14-10, 08:58 PM
What a coincidence this happened a year ago today...the same day Lee signed his deal.

delv
12-14-10, 11:45 PM
i hope dominic brown busts. nothing personal.

his numbers are really pretty good. probably could use some more time at AAA, but he has plate discpline, so he'll probably hold up adequately at first, and improve with time.